Murder rate is rising....

[Doobie]

http://apnews.myway.com/article/20061227/D8M9EJ580.html

Well, this sucks. As some things seem to get better other things seems to get worse.

[Riot]

Police Chief Francisco Ortiz said that about half of this year's killings involve young people settling disputes with guns instead of fists.

I found that part of the article to be quite comical. When did kids stop learning that fists is the way to settle disputes!?!

[Axel]

That's why I'm pro gun control. People always argue that guns save lives, but that might be the most bullshit statement I've ever heard.

[Riot]

That's why I'm pro gun control. People always argue that guns save lives, but that might be the most bullshit statement I've ever heard.

No, but you have a right to own a firearm. The people getting guns shouldn't be getting them anyways. Banning guns won't do anything to stop violent crime, it will just stop the average citizen from getting their own firearm. The criminals will find a way to get a gun because the majority of them that own a gun have it illegally in the first place.

Do you get what I'm saying? By banning guns you are taking it away from the innocent and not the guilty.

[Jowe]

Thats the most pathetic excuse ever.

Its the average citizen who is taking lives, who is using a firearm to end disputes. Who then inturn end up being the criminal.

[Nick]

Well if the murder rate is rising i might join the fun! Oh wait, here in Australia you're not allowed to own guns. I guess i wont be able to murder anyone.

Ever wonder why America's murder rates are so much higher than everyone else's?

[Riot]

Well if the murder rate is rising i might join the fun! Oh wait, here in Australia you're not allowed to own guns. I guess i wont be able to murder anyone.

Ever wonder why America's murder rates are so much higher than everyone else's?

Because we have a lot of stupid people with a lot of money?

[Nick]

Yeah, who own guns...

[Riot]

If you put tougher restrictions on guns you aren't going to stop violent criminals from getting them. You can't stop them from getting drugs and you won't stop them from getting guns. You will stop the law-abiding citizens from getting guns and that automatically tips the scale in favor of the criminals.

If you all of a sudden say guns are bad and you can't get them that doesn't mean criminals won't get their hands on guns. The reason why the murder rate is so high in America is because we have a lot of fucked up people here. If you take guns away from them they are still fucked up and they will find a way to be a nuisance to society. Most of them don't even have their guns legally in the first place so making it illegal for them to have it really wouldn't do a damn thing. When this country was founded it was determined that is was our right to own arms to protect ourselves. It has been over 200 years since that decision has been made. It is practically too late to turn around and do a 180. What is the government going to do? Go around house to house searching homes for guns until every house in America is clean? Give me a break.

Gun control, in theory, seems like a great idea. I would love to have all the nutjobs in America to be locked up and away from anyone with a pulse. Believe me, nothing drives me crazy than a fuckwit with an attitude and if you add a firearm to the equation it can get pretty damn nasty. Do I want people to die? Not really. However, it is my right to own a firearm and it is your right to own a firearm. When people get shot and killed it wasn't just two neighbors who walked outside their house with their loaded pistol and randomly shot strangers as they walked by. It's usually fucking criminals with an agenda walking up to someone with a purpose. They usually have criminal thoughts going through their heads. There aren't too many cases of the average Joe spilling his coffee and taking his anger out on the pretty waitress by filling her little body full of lead.

Instead of focusing on the tool that is used to kill these innocent people maybe we should focus on the operator who is using that tool? Doesn't that seem like a much more effective way to spend our time and money? Shouldn't you attack the source of this madness and not put a band-aid over such a serious problem? Look at our communities and try to do something about all the problems we have with violence. It starts with the people and not the weapons. The gun can't shoot itself. You need someone with a fucked up mind to pull it at an innocent person. I'm much more concerned about that man with not much going on upstairs than I am of a firearm. Chances are, that guy will do just about anything to get whatever the hell he wants and whether it's with a firearm, a knife or whatever he'll get what he wants.

Attack the damn problem at the roots and not the stem. Don't hurt the law-abiding Americans by taking away their right to own a firearm because in the end those are the only people who will be effected by such a movement. The criminals are the ones we are after and we should go after them.

[J@3]

Why do you even NEED a gun? There are other ways to protect yourself, if anything a gun should only be a last resort at least. All of this stuff about "rights" is stupid. It seems no other country on the entire planet even comes close to the amount of gun related deaths/crimes as the USA (I haven't researched this AT ALL so I am probably wrong) yet the laws shouldn't be changed because 200 (!!!) years ago someone said it was cool for people to pack heat [/end rapper]?

[Riot]

If I feel safe with a firearm I can have a firearm. If I want to hunt as a hobby and as a sport than I can hunt. It's a right in this country that we are forunate to have.

[bigh0rt]

If I feel safe with a firearm I can have a firearm. If I want to hunt as a hobby and as a sport than I can hunt. It's a right in this country that we are forunate to have.

You'd be singing a different tune if some average Joe who owned a handgun simply to protect his family snapped one day and killed someone close to you. You can say that hardcore, ruthless criminals are the only ones shooting people in this country, if that's what helps you sleep at night. You've never listened to opposing views to yours regardless of their validity, so I don't expect you to start now...

[J@3]

If I feel safe with a firearm I can have a firearm. If I want to hunt as a hobby and as a sport than I can hunt. It's a right in this country that we are forunate to have.

The only reason ANYONE would feel safe with a firearm in your country is because you know you're allowed to have them. It's like saying I'd feel safe if I built a spiked electric fence all around my house... would it protect me? Sure. Would it make any sense at all when I could easily just get a security system or build a regular fence? No. Want a weapon? Get a baseball bat or something...

[Riot]

If I feel safe with a firearm I can have a firearm. If I want to hunt as a hobby and as a sport than I can hunt. It's a right in this country that we are forunate to have.

You'd be singing a different tune if some average Joe who owned a handgun simply to protect his family snapped one day and killed someone close to you. You can say that hardcore, ruthless criminals are the only ones shooting people in this country, if that's what helps you sleep at night. You've never listened to opposing views to yours regardless of their validity, so I don't expect you to start now...

Well you seem to have the same closed mindset as me so I don't see how you can attack me. I don't agree with your opinion so I'm wrong? You believe in your opinion and I believe in mine. I guess I'm just the dumb hick who doesn't listen to anyone else and thinks my opinion is always right. Of course I think my opinion is right and I expect you to think yours is, too. But it's about damn time you show my opinion some respect instead of throwing it around like it's bullshit and worthless. I get in these debates for fun and because I believe in what I'm saying. I debate this with you because I believe in it.

I don't need you disrespecting me or my opinion anymore. It seems like everytime we get in a debate here I'm always considered the close minded son of a bitch and I need help. You need to look in a god damn mirror.

[bigh0rt]

If I feel safe with a firearm I can have a firearm. If I want to hunt as a hobby and as a sport than I can hunt. It's a right in this country that we are forunate to have.

You'd be singing a different tune if some average Joe who owned a handgun simply to protect his family snapped one day and killed someone close to you. You can say that hardcore, ruthless criminals are the only ones shooting people in this country, if that's what helps you sleep at night. You've never listened to opposing views to yours regardless of their validity, so I don't expect you to start now...

Well you seem to have the same closed mindset as me so I don't see how you can attack me. I don't agree with your opinion so I'm wrong? You believe in your opinion and I believe in mine. I guess I'm just the dumb hick who doesn't listen to anyone else and thinks my opinion is always right. Of course I think my opinion is right and I expect you to think yours is, too. But it's about damn time you show my opinion some respect instead of throwing it around like it's bullshit and worthless. I get in these debates for fun and because I believe in what I'm saying. I debate this with you because I believe in it.

I don't need you disrespecting me or my opinion anymore. It seems like everytime we get in a debate here I'm always considered the close minded son of a bitch and I need help. You need to look in a god damn mirror.

Looks like I struck a lil' nerve there. Re-read what I wrote, chief.

"You've never listened to opposing views to yours regardless of their validity, so I don't expect you to start now..."

Nothing about thinking your opinion is right, mine is wrong, being closed minded, throwing opinions around like they are bullshit or worthless. Just commenting on your continued inability to see anything other than what you want to see, nevermind actually consider it. It's well documented - it's not like I'm saying something new or revolutionary here; just pointing out the obvious. Far too often you'll post a diatribe, which will be refuted, to which you'll just paraphrase what you've already said, in a way dodging the reply. It's why I first found some debate with you interesting and quickly grew tired of it. You've got your opening statement, and then, your opening statement rephrased. Just one man's views.

--

Do I think that owning a gun could in some cases possibly lead to people either being or at least having a sense of advanced home security? Sure. But so does keeping a baseball bat under your bed, or having a home security system, or owning a dog, or any other number of things that don't involve you owning a weapon designed to do lethal damage. As I said above, there's a large quantity of these murders, of which the rate are rising, where the shooter is somebody whose gun ownership was designed to protect themselves. Then they catch their wife's legs in the air and wham, plug her in the head. Just a random example, and Lord knows what the result would've been had the easy route of putting a bullet in them not been there.

See, it's a large difference squeezing a trigger at a short distance and murdering them with a handheld object, such as a knife or something blunt. One requires a split second decision to something that's easily accessible. The other requires extended effort, and a follor through to the hairtrigger decision.

If I ever feel I need a gun to protect myself or my family, I'll gladly pack up all our things and find a new place to live before I feel the need to purchase a gun.

[Christopherson]

I own several guns. I use them for hunting and recreation. I enjoy target shooting. I do not own any guns for protection. They are all stored in a gun safe and have trigger locks on them. If someone broke into my house it would take me a good 2 minutes to get my gun, load it, etc. Most of the time I think that pulling a gun on a potential criminal etc. just increases the risk you will get shot. Personally I see no reason to own a gun if you live in the city.