Smoke it up....

[Oznogrd]

guys, stop attacking each other over this shit....share some knowledge, but stop fucking passing judgement..just because you think its wrong or stupid doesnt mean everyone does...there's a lot of points on both sides, i happen to be a proponent simply because i've known some very responsible, coherent, very positive minded weed smokers in my life. There's a lot of mythology on both ends so lets state our cases without getting personal...for christs sake, its just weed.....responses to everything else:
1. Indy man, driving while high, while not as dangerous as alcohol/drunk is still not exactly the smartest idea, but as someone said, if your allowed to drive with some alcohol in your body why not weed? Just be careful dude, because unlike other people, i'd hate to see it bite you in the ass (on a personal sidenote, lets not talk about the beating your OSU boys gave my illini this weekend)
2.Piks, if you take responsibility for your actions and are intelligent about your use of it (as stated somwhere bout no more than once every two weeks and maybe even less) you wont get stupid one day. Chronic use of any drug is a health hazard from caffeine, to weed, to anything else.
3. The gateway drug phenomenon is bullshit. The reason it exists is people from a certain background/with certain character traits are more likely to try any kind of drug, not just weed, so alot of people who try weed are curious about others. Me personally? i know the other shit can kill you instantly. Find me one story about someone ODing on weed...I will never touch 'shrooms, acid, cocaine, heroin, ecstasy, ether, any of the countless other things we're assuming weed opens you up to use of. The people need to stop blaming the drug and blame themselves for their own stupidity.
4. the point about fatally injured car wrecks...whats the stat on alcohol? I believe if weed is illegal for reasons like that, then so should alcohol and tobacco....and dont even get me started on the drinking age....
5. Not knowing where to find it is a problem of who you hang out wiht, your age etc. For christs, sake i'm on college campus, i cant walk by a frat or sorority house without a little bit of weed smoke billowing out the windows...also, remember some of the people saying that are KIDS: its an excellent thing they dont know where to find it because they're the ones who get carried away and stupid.
I can see both sides of this issue, but those who are anti-marijuna, stop demonizing it...Just like any other drug: if you are responsible with its use, you'll be ok, if you are irresponsible, you will be "bit in the ass"....its personal choices, not the drugs that make bad things happen

[BIG GREEN]

I never asked for an opinion or judgement...i simply told about myself in a topic that was about a certain subject as it pertains to my life. The next time i want judgement or opinions from you...i'll ask for it. I won't be tolerating your bullshit on these forums Bill O' Reilly. I suggest you keep it away from me cause you don't know shit about me.

You stated you liked the smoke in a thread. That opens you up for critism from those who think smoking is immature, irresponsible and stupid. I am one of many who think that. I'm sorry your little hobby isn't socially accepted. I'm sorry you can't handle the facts that your innocent drug does a lot more harm than good.

You won't be tolerating my "bullshit" on these forums? What are you going to do? What if I said the exact same thing but in a coherent sentence? It wouldn't do much, would it?

lol...wow you're a smart one aren't you? Always ready and waiting for a comeback to try to establish a false sense of moral, ethical and literacy dominance. Well guess what? You're not that smart because all I made was a simple request that you shut the fuck up but you didn't seem to understand it. Maybe i wasn't "coherant" enough? Have it your way...you started shit..and you got warned and still continued anyway. Perhaps my actions will be more "coherant". You're a "Riot".

[Christopherson]

Illini, I have a hard time believing that weed is not a gateway drug. Are you telling me that its never happened that someone was stoned out of their mind and decided to try a drug they wouldn't have tried if they weren't stoned?

While I don't have any statistics to back this up, I would say that people who smoke weed are more likely to do harder drugs that people who don't smoke week.

Also, hanging around a weed-smoking environment makes you more likely to be in an environment which has harder drugs present. Simply being around them makes you more likely to try them.

I don't understand how you could argue that weed isn't a gateway drug.

[BIG GREEN]

Anything done too much is bad. Weed can be a gateway drug if you're a "pot head" and make it your life's purpose to smoke. Eating too much gets you fat, excercising too much can cause muscle damage etc etc.

[Oznogrd]

because baldus, people can make a conscious decision to not go harder. Weed/alcohol tobacco, while it fucks up your judgment, does not TRULY make you do things you usually wouldnt...anyone who tries different drugs while intoxicated was already wanting to try them, just dindt want to admit it. I've seen enough drunkards try weed while wasted and talked to them after. You are right, having the other drugs around is a potential problem, which is why you dont smoke with dealers or people you dont trust. It is a gateway drug if people let it be, no one takes responsibility for their actions and tries to blame the drug when really its their own dumbass fault

[Christopherson]

So you are saying that when a girl gets drunk and eventually raped, that she wanted to get raped all along, she just didn't know it?

[Axel]

I think America needs to be more firm in its stance on marijuana. Either make it completely legal, or adopt a much more stern policy against it, like Singaporean law. I hate this perception that people who smoke it are above the law and they can get away with whatever the fuck they want. All of you who have admitted to smoking have admitted to breaking the law. Since when did it become ok to break established laws at your own discretion?? It's illegal for a reason. If people aren't going to abide, and with current enforcement as it is, it might as well be legal. I would like to see a complete ban of it with much harsher penalities for first time offenders, but as it stands, something needs to be done either way.

[bigh0rt]

So you are saying that when a girl gets drunk and eventually raped, that she wanted to get raped all along, she just didn't know it?

Now you're talkin'.

Just kidding, of course.

[Oznogrd]

about the rape issue if you know that could happen, dont get that drunk period and if you do be around people you know and trust (not in a frat house/in public)....simple responsibility....but ingesting other substances is YOUR control...if you get roofied or someone slips it to you fine not your fautl...rape is a completely different story...i have been very drunk and i have been stoned and NEVER once was i out of control..it is a matter of mindset, not a matter of "i'm drunk i can do whatever and blame it on that"

[Christopherson]

illini, So are you admitting that your argument was wrong? That it isn't something you wanted to do in the first place? As for your discussion about only doing drugs (alcohol is a drug) around people you know, most rape victims are raped by someone they know, so I think the best bet is just to abstain.

How would you know whether or not you were out of control? Most drunk people think they are perfectly in control all the time. How many times have you heard someone say, "I'm OK to drive" or "I can walk home by myself" only to end up in an accident or passed out in the park?

[---]

Most drunk people think they are perfectly in control all the time

Thats true. Thats why I emptied my pockets of $120 in cash on the corner of a main road

[Oznogrd]

the people who get raped by people they know are bad judges of character i think I have yet to see a guy who raped a girl (including frat boys/sorority girls) who i didnt expect it from...yes i know hindsight is 20/20, but its also easy to tell at least around here....once again, people have to accept responsibility, not that they arent victims, but they did put themself in a physical mental/state to be taken advantage of....it was their decision..my argument is based on things people CAN control, not other peoples actions, you can only handle yourself. So i wasnt wrong, just needed to clarify better. Most drunk people i know you're right, think they are ok to drive/ walk home by themself....which is why the rest of my group has taken responsibility and hid his keys about 2 hours earlier...you can see the signs coming, and when you do, take action. I've been completely wasted myself but known to stop drinking and to cut other people off when they'd had too much....i'm not trying to say nothing bad happens, i'm trying to say control what you can and be safe/smart enough to not get in bad situations. You are right, abstinence may be the best policy for some, but since the drugs are readily available and people are going to use them, all i'm asking is a little thought and caution in what they are doing...when i see my friends getting too wasted, i stop drinking so i can be capable of helping them...people should always have a DD no matter what psychoactive drug is occurring...maybe most people arent as caring about their friends...who knows?

[Christopherson]

Hey I'm all for being responsible and using caution. I know that abstinance isn't very realistic, but it is still something to strive for. In our society, we have just decided that it isn't possible, so all of the sudden moderation is the standard.

As for your comments about rape. You are a sick bastard to suggest that it's a girl's own fault that she got raped. You obviously haven't ever known a victim before. Most wouldn't be in a situation to be raped if not for their consumption of alcohol. Being victimized was not something they wanted to happen.

Listen, sometimes we just need to admit our argument was wrong. It happens to everyone. There is no need to go on a dig yourself a deeper hole. Now you are trying to say that because something works for you, it should work for all. You say that you and your buddies hide the keys. So you are capable of doing your best to avoid bad situations. That doesn't mean everyone is.

[Indy]

Indy,
I saw your comments about driving at a slower speed before I made my last post. To me the fact that you are commending yourself for not driving 100 mph is very sad. Not breaking the law isn't something I would be proud of. It should be expected. My argument is weed slows reaction time and impairs judgement. So if you are on your way to your Pacers game and a deer or a little kid jumps out in the road, the THC in your system is going to make you more likely to have a negative impact on another's life. How can you look at that and be proud of it?

I guess you've never been on Interstate 65, a kid jumping out is a negative percent chance, and I'd see a deer coming a mile away.

I really don't have anything to say about this other then what I've already said. I know what I can and can't do, I'm old enough to make my own decisions and I'm old enough to evaluate the consequences of my actions and decide whether or not its a smart move. I've been driving while blazing for years, and I've gotten good as hell at it. If you guys want to worry and say whatever you will so be it, but I know the risks of what I'm doing and they are no higher then driving sober.

I'm actually going to tell a story, even though I said there was nothing else I had to say on the subject. I've been in two accidents in my life, and they were actually both the same situation. I was driving on a 4 lane highway type thing, and a person was sticking out in to the intersection, I was in the right lane and I moved over to the left I had a blunt in my hand, and I had just finished smoking, I was high as hell. I get about 50 feet from her and I'm going pretty quickly, I assumed she had seen me and was going to wait for me to pass before turning out. She then pulls out right in front of me. I drive a stick shift, so this manuver was more difficult then just slamming on the brakes, but I shift in to neutral and jam on the brakes really hard and I only just barely nick the back of her car. If I had braked any later or less hard, I would have slammed in to her side of the car and likely killed her or injured her horribly. There was also a kid in the backseat, but my reaction was so quick that I was able to avoid hitting her too. She claimed it was my fault but I won the insurance case and got my insurace deductable back.

I was sober and literally the exact same thing happened to me, and I hit right in the back seat where the kid would have been and had to pay a lot in damages.

I'm sure you will all have a comeback for this story saying I got lucky, or this or that, but you have to understand that I learn from experiences, and I know for a fact that I am a better more alert driver when I'm stoned.

[Oznogrd]

Know several rape victims, 3 of them ex girlfriends, and they were sober...the fucked up shit i've heard would drive most people to insanity and maybe i am a little insane. But i'm not suggesting they are not victims. But the rape cases i heard all saw it coming yet did nothing to stop it due to their own self esteem issues. they felt as if they deserved it . Every case is individual i guess so i will suggest that my experience may not be the norm and yes i could be wrong. I'm not saying my argument is wrong, it may be just as unrealistic as abstinence, but why cant people take a little responsibility for themselves? thats all i'm arguing truly Rape and drug use are COMPLETELY different things as i said before and i think you're ignoring that part....Rape is the actions of others....drug use is your decision unless people literally force it into you (which is rare)

PS. Your reaction time is not affected by weed, your attention is....theres a difference....if a kid jumps out at you, you'll be able to stop just as well as sober unless you start thinking about the how cool of an effect just happened as he froze in front of your headlights....

[Christopherson]

Well, I am officially too tired to try and decipher another one of your posts. Maybe I'll take a crack at it in the morning.

You really should try to use sentances, punctuation, etc... It would do nothing but strengthen the points you try to make. It is often unclear what you are trying to get across.

[Oznogrd]

i write stream of consciousness style, follow it like a thought, not like an essay. Just because i hate writing formally doesnt mean i cant be understood. Yeah i have a few run ons...i do have sentences and i do use ellipses alot but thats more for informality sakes...if the common consensus is for me to improve that i will but i have only heard complaints from 2 people...PM me or bring it up in NLSC issues and i will discuss it and adjust accordingly

[Christopherson]

Illini, I am not going to PM you, I just told you here in the forums. I am not going to bring it up in the NLSC issues because I feel it would be a waste of space. Just remember, it is just like in a classroom, if one person has a question about something, usually about 10% have the same question. So if a couple of us here have said something to you about your posting style, then I would venture that at least 10% of the people here have a bit of a problem with it. I mean, even koberulz writes in complete sentances and paragraphs.

You said that a drug "does not TRULY make you do things you usually wouldnt." The girl I know who was raped would never have gone somewhere alone with the guy who raped her. It wasn't something she TRULY wanted to do. The alcohol she consumed impaired her judgement. Sure rape is mostly the action of others, but a girl can't get raped if she doesn't put herself in an available position, like being drunk.

Oh, and by the way, it has been proven that THC does indeed affect one's reaction time.

Indy: I think you told that story to try and get us to believe that you didn't hit the car hard when you were smoking because the weed somehow makes you a better driver. I don't believe that for a second. The fact that you didn't smash the vehicle hard is because it wasn't exactly the other situation.

Anyways, you obviously fell strongly about the choices you have made. All I can say is that I am disapointed that a seemingly mature person like yourself could be so irresponsible as to willingly endanger the lives of others.

[Indy]

Indy: I think you told that story to try and get us to believe that you didn't hit the car hard when you were smoking because the weed somehow makes you a better driver. I don't believe that for a second. The fact that you didn't smash the vehicle hard is because it wasn't exactly the other situation.

I really don't give a fuck what you think.

[Oznogrd]

http://www.druglibrary.org/schaffer/Misc/driving/s1p2.htm

A drug does not make you do shit because you chose to ingest the amount of the drug to put in that vulnerable position. Like i said, every case is individual and i know for a fact the rape victims i knew were completely sober....but anyway...

As i said before, most studies are biased, link me to the studies and i will read and assess...GIVE ME PROOF...otherwise its he said she said bullshit thats not worth arguing. that goes for you and Riot, i'm not going to argue 'facts' that are just said by people who dont know the fucking drug culture...my fave quote out of this is: "THC did not impair driving performance yet the subjects thought it had. " yes i know this is out of a country where weed is legal but that makes it that much more valid.....

[Jackal]

Everyone should just come live in Holland and see that the use of marijuana isn't as bad as people make it out to be.

[Indy]

Everyone should just come live in Holland and see that the use of marijuana isn't as bad as people make it out to be.

I seem to remember you saying before that you hated it, wished it was illegal or something to that sentiment. Do you still feel that way?

[Jackal]

Now now Indy, I said I hated Holland, not marijuana.

Holland just isn't something for me, Europe as a whole isn't something for me. The lifestyle is fast paced & people don't seem to give a rats ass about anything except achieving their goals...no matter what the cost. In some aspects I suppose that's a trait others would look up to, but having grown up in mostly South America, I'm just not used to the fast paced lifestyle and I don't think I can adapt myself to it.

I prefer the laid back, easy going lifestyle and I don't think I could ever stop loving it.

On the topic of marijuana, personally I've never tried it and I don't intend on doing so. I don't hate it nor do I condemn or judge the people that use it. My uncle was a hardcore drug addict/alcoholist and it subsequently cost him his life. I've seen him on his worst days and I've seen him beg my mom just to buy him one joint. Seeing a grown man beg has an effect on you, I've come to realise that judging people on the basis of their usage of marijuana isn't my job. I don't like the smell of it, but that's just me. I don't hate it nor do I wish it were illegal, I can't hate something I don't know about.

So basically it's a live & let live situation. Let the people that want to use it, use it. Judging them isn't my task. I've been offered to try & I've kindly declined and the people that offered have respected that. So, I in turn respect them right back.

Wow, that was much more than I was planning to say, but you got the gist of it.

[Indy]

Good post. I honestly couldn't remember what your stance on it was, I wasn't trying to be a smart ass.

[Jackal]

Lol, don't worry, I know you better than that. I didn't think you were being a smartass. I knew it was an upright question.