Lakers Thread

[Cloudy]

Some interesting stats comparing Kobe and MJ

Jordan 86-87:
37.1 ppg
35.4% of Bulls 104.8
33.8% of league average 109.9

Bryant 05-06:
35.3 ppg
35.8% of Lakers 98.6
36.5% of league average 96.6

Jordan eFG% .484
Bryant eFG% .491

Jordan 56.2% TS%
Bryant 56.1% TS%

Jordan 1.124 ppfga
Bryant 1.123 ppfga

Bulls 40-42
Second leading scorer Charles Oakley 14.5 PPG
third leading scorer John Paxson 11.3 PPG

Lakers 47-34
Second leading scorer Lamar Odom 14.9 PPG
Third leading scroer Smush Parker 11.5 PPG

Hey I like those stats! You keep me optimistic, Lakers are gonna get Six Straight soon! Yay!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[dada]

Some interesting stats comparing Kobe and MJ

Jordan 86-87:
37.1 ppg
35.4% of Bulls 104.8
33.8% of league average 109.9

Bryant 05-06:
35.3 ppg
35.8% of Lakers 98.6
36.5% of league average 96.6

Jordan eFG% .484
Bryant eFG% .491

Jordan 56.2% TS%
Bryant 56.1% TS%

Jordan 1.124 ppfga
Bryant 1.123 ppfga

Bulls 40-42
Second leading scorer Charles Oakley 14.5 PPG
third leading scorer John Paxson 11.3 PPG

Lakers 47-34
Second leading scorer Lamar Odom 14.9 PPG
Third leading scroer Smush Parker 11.5 PPG

Hey I like those stats! You keep me optimistic, Lakers are gonna get Six Straight soon! Yay!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Make that 8 straight.

[gergerjai]

I dunno if thats accurate though
when it comes to stats, someone better get benji in here

[Carmo]

I dunno if thats accurate though
when it comes to stats, someone better get benji in here

Well i saw this.................

Lakers 47-34

and thought, "hey thats wrong". (44 - 37)

[Fresh8]

Stats don't tell the full story... Maybe someone older can come in here and educate us on the difference in playing style in the late 80s as compared to now... Handchecking was allowed or something? People could play physical defence thus MJ could have scored more? Of course, this is all theory... (So if someone who knows the difference can tell me what was different back then, it would be great!)

[Mayerhendrix]

I think I've heard that teams played more of a Phoenix Suns running game with less organized defense that exists today, so if that's true then Kobe Bryant's 81 could come in the same elite group as Wilt Chamberlain's 100 and Michael Jordan's amazing career.

[Fresh8]

I watch highlights from that era and teams like Detroit would have guys elbowing and smashing into MJ... That was a main reason why people like Pippen said that if MJ played in our era of bball, he'd score more points than he did in his career.

[Carmo]

27 point lead at half time for the lakers. Dominating the Hornets right now. Kobe 27 points, Kwame 13 points. I am certainly loving life right now, I hope the playoffs don't crush me.

[*Los Angeles*]

I think the Lakers have locked up the 7th spot. Im happy as long as the Hornets dont make a comeback

Edit: If Kwame would have played like this all season the Lakers would no doubt have 50 plus wins. Also if Lamar plays the 4th he could have his 3rd TD in 4 games 6pts 7rbs 6ast 2:30 left in the 3rd.

[gergerjai]

Kobe with 22 fga midway in the 3rd quater, thats a lot, though efficient like 50%.
Maybe hes trying to break the record.

EDIT:
And he did it, 35 to pass up 2 guys for most points scored in a season.

[J@3]

36 point game, that's ugly. Awell, Bucks + Lakers are in the play-offs so I now have reason to pay attention.

[gergerjai]

Oops, Luke to hospital after catching an elbow form Marc Jackson.
Marc jackson reminds me that it seems every big man coming from the Warroirs are said to be good and have good potential before being nothing.

[TRUball]

Wow... with the Denver loss and if the seeding was just by records the Nuggets would be tied for 8th with the Kings... So if the Laker's were in the Northwest Division, they would be 3rd.

[Fresh8]

Lakers got to 45 wins Can't say I should expect anything else mroe from them! But I want more!

[gergerjai]

Hell my friend sent me some real nice clips from youtube, one being Mark Jackson arguing with Pipen on Kobe, and one of the others is a total of 8 minutes of clutch performances from Kobe, not all of his clutch shots are there but thats a total of 8 minutes? Ridiculous.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bUdkzDQvWn8&search=Kobe
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1KtXvP17BJA&search=Kobe
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bSHIUSHYpks&search=Kobe
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r5OuHUqKiN8&search=Kobe

[dada]

I watch highlights from that era and teams like Detroit would have guys elbowing and smashing into MJ... That was a main reason why people like Pippen said that if MJ played in our era of bball, he'd score more points than he did in his career.

I've watched plenty of Hardwood Classics games and the elbowing and smashing stuff wasnt that serious. Those kinda hits MJ received were special to that series and it wasnt like they werent calling the fouls. I personally dont believe if MJ played now he would score significantly more. The speed at which this generation plays I dont believe would allow it. Even the hand checking argument I think is rubbish. Its just not that serious. Its more like that was just one of the arguments they found for MJ and as little as it was they took it and ran. I still see hand checking today anyways granted they call it more often. Also, I was wondering, did they play zone back in those days?

[Fresh8]

Pips is right. It's too early to even say Kobe is better or will be better than MJ right now. Kobe's still got a lot to prove and unless he can take the Lakers deep into the playoffs in the future and make them a winning side, he won't surpass MJ. Give me a few mroe 30+ ppg seasons and a few 60 win seasons... then Kobe would be greater than MJ. But thats only my take. What you guys think?

[J@3]

I don't think he'll get to MJ's level as far as achievements go. If Shaq had left earlier maybe, but then he might also be without a ring or two.

[dada]

I fell asleep in class today and I had the wierdest dream. Kobe dropped 116 on Phoenix in their opening playoff game. It was a double overtime game where he scored 97 at the end of regulation and had to sit out nearly half of the second quarter cuz he was in foul trouble.

I actually woke up thinking it was real. I was pretty happy for a good minute or two before reality came back to me.

Oh well, it isnt a sin to dream.

[The_Flying_Tomato]

suns win 4-1 or 4-0

[beau_boy04]

Pips is right. It's too early to even say Kobe is better or will be better than MJ right now. Kobe's still got a lot to prove and unless he can take the Lakers deep into the playoffs in the future and make them a winning side, he won't surpass MJ. Give me a few mroe 30+ ppg seasons and a few 60 win seasons... then Kobe would be greater than MJ. But thats only my take. What you guys think?

What is Kobe guides them to the finals to win it all... would that be in consideration if he's better than MJ? I know it'd be one of the toughest task to accomplish and one of the biggest surprises ever in history but hey you never know. I think Kobe will raise his play against the Suns specially when his mvp competitor is playing on the field and proves everybody he's the real mvp and get his act together and win the necessary games to win the series.

I have a lot of faith.

I think it's time for Kwame Brown to shine for real this time and prove himself.

[Fresh8]

I have faith too... but to have faith, you've got to be realistic. The Lakers have a chance to win a playoff series against the Suns. It all depends on the Suns' gameplan though. Will they let Kobe go on a scoring binge and try to shut down his teammates? Or will they try to shut down Kobe instead? No matter which they choose, the only way for LA to stand a chance is for Lamar and Kwame to shine.

And on your topic of is he better than MJ? I have faith that maybe one day he will... but not this year. He's getting closer, I will give him that but if you're asking him to lead this team to the Finals this year. It's not going to happen. If Kobe did guide the number 7 seed to the Finals this season... then there'd be a lot of serious debate.

Personally, I would think that Kobe is getting close to MJ's level but unless he could back up a feat, such as what you posted, with a winning season the next year... I would stil lconclude he's a great player and one of the best but not the best.

And as Jae said... Kobe may never get to MJ's level in relation to acheivements. But one question Jae... do you say achievements in ragard to MVP's? And Scoring titles? And All-NBA first teams, etc? Maybe Kobe won't win those MVP trophies or at least as many as Jordan did. But I don't see no reason why Kobe can't help LA win another few rings or so. However, winning six rings may be out of the question... I wish he could though! If he did, then the debate of whether MJ or Kobe was/is better would be much more of an even debate.

So one other question to all of you... if Kobe won back to back championships with the Lakers in the future to add to his collection of championships he won with Shaq... would that make the cut for you so that you would conclude that Kobe is better than Jordan?

[J@3]

But one question Jae... do you say achievements in ragard to MVP's? And Scoring titles? And All-NBA first teams, etc? Maybe Kobe won't win those MVP trophies or at least as many as Jordan did. But I don't see no reason why Kobe can't help LA win another few rings or so

Well MVP's mostly, because when all is said and done and his career is over people are going to look at two things mostly; MVP's and championships. He's not old by any means, but Kobe isn't 18 anymore... he's got maybe 3 years at this current level, then another 3 or so a little bit lower.

I don't really see the Lakers winning another few rings, 1 or 2 at most but the team isn't good enough, the GM isn't good enough and all of the major guys the Lakers seem to be targetting as future free agents are all re-signing with their teams.

[Fresh8]

You're right about the fact that Kobe isn't getting any younger. I thinks it's just a case of starting too late. If Shaq wasn't part of the team, God knows what Kobe could have done individually and how he would have developed. And if the rape case never happened... you never know what he'd be like in today's NBA; image wise and playing-wise.

At the end of his career, as you say, I think that he won't get the ammount of scoring titles and MVPs MJ got. As for championships, only time will tell. The Lakers though aren't in any position to make the team better any time soon and how long Kobe stays in his prime and how he adjusts his playing style once he needs to... will determine how his legacy will end.

One thing to ponder: If Shaq doesn't win a ring again and Kobe does win 1 or 2 more... what will that mean to Kobe Bryant and the argument for him to be considered as greater than MJ?

[J@3]

If Shaq wasn't part of the team, God knows what Kobe could have done individually and how he would have developed.

I agree, and same with Eddie Jones for that matter. If he wasn't there, Kobe would've been starting from day one. That being said, without Shaq he might've become the best player since Jordan, but I doubt he'd have the rings to go with it.