2012 NBA Finals: (2) Heat vs (2) Thunder

[shadowgrin]

Take it easy you guys, asking a canadien about basketball is like asking an american about football or soccer as you filthy pigs call it.

[Spree#8]

I don't understand how it was the referees who were keeping the Thunder in it. The officiating was bad overall, but I remember more bad calls favoring the Heat. Goaltending on the double block, Chalmers' flop on Harden and the final possession when Durant got fouled on the shot and Westbrook on the rebound attempt, just to name a few.

Throughout the game, the Heat were a better team, I think they deserved their win, but let's not pretend that in the end the game wasn't decided by the referees.

Heat have probably played almost their best in game 2. Offensive execution (except some of the 4th quarter, they had a few avoidable turnovers), rebounding, defense, effort, threes, it was all there. The Thunder on the other hand, were atrocious in the first half. The game would have been over by halftime if it wasn't for Harden. I wonder if/when Brooks will realize that playing with two bigmen is completely screwing them over (especially if Perkins is one of them) and that they play their best when they go small with Durant at the 4. I have a feeling that has a lot to do with their terrible starts. I bet he won't bench Perkins though, even despite the fact that he's useless in this series as the Heat don't have a center and also play small most of the time.

I'm surprised Battier is still able to keep his shooting streak going, even with extremely lucky bankshot threes. Wade finally played at the proper level, but they might want to get Bosh involved a bit more. LeBron maintains his high level of play and at last they've played a Wade-James pick and roll in the 4th. Not a difficult play to set up and works a lot better than an isolation, doesn't it?

Miami has to take at least two of their three home games to have a chance to win. OKC needs to start playing after the tip off, not halftime. Even Durant owning the 4th quarter might not be enough when you enter the period with a double-digit deficit.

[shadowgrin]

Miami has to take at least two of their three home games to have a chance to win

I see that you enjoy listening to Magic Johnson's commentary.

[NovU]

i am starting to think you dont actually watch the games. you understand a trickle down effect right? without him we have to start ray and bring in pietrus off the bench who took shots away from our scorers. bradley allows allen to rest more allowing him to be more efficient, gives us young legs, and plays great defense(again completely shut down wade in the past). do you ever look beyond how many points someone has?

He's a mere average second year player who was absolutely having a terrible playoffs. The Celtics on most of part did a great job on Wade. I was surprised how the Celtics were stellar both on offense and defense throughout the series against the Heat whom I thought were a heavy favorite. Do I think Avery could have made a series outcome changing impact to the series with his good defense and ABSOLUTELY crap offense? No, of course not. Old man, just give the credits where it's due. As you already said, all both teams were banged up. Having to believe Avery a series changer is entirely your opinion which I just can't agree. The Celtics came close but the Heat prevailed and came out a better team. Kudos to your team as you guys were an underdog by huge margin though. And no reason to be a sore loser like hyena above.

[Spree#8]

Miami has to take at least two of their three home games to have a chance to win

I see that you enjoy listening to Magic Johnson's commentary.

Actually, I didn't even watch the studio. If he said the same thing, it's probably because it's common sense. If the Heat will be trailing 2-3 after 5 games, I don't see them taking both game 6 and game 7 in Oklahoma City. That's why they need to win at least 2 of the next 3 games to stay in the series.

[benji]

You completely missed his point. It's not that Bradley is some kind of superstar, it's that Bradley is so much better than what the Celtics had to rely on.

Same concept as the Heat missing Bosh. A healthy Bosh makes the series a walk. When they got him on the court in games six and seven, the Celtics couldn't manage.

Sauru is making the argument that if Bradley is there, the Celtics can beat the Heat in seven.

Consider this hypothetical. The Celtics have three perimeter players other than Pierce and Rondo. Bradley who is -4 offense and +8 defense. Allen who is +2 offense and -6 defense. And Pietrus who is -15 offense and -1 defense. Losing the first guy and having to play the third guy is a HUGE impact on the overall team.

IF Bradley can derail one of Wade's second-half appearances in a Heat win, then the Celtics can win the series by grabbing a game they didn't get. Same logic as IF Bosh is healthy the Celtics maybe go home in five or six games.

[shadowgrin]

it's common sense.

Exactly.


"They have to score more points than the other team to win the game."
"They have to protect the ball to lessen their turnovers."


Not exactly Magic Johnson quotes but the pattern is like that for Magic's commentary.

[NovU]

You completely missed his point. It's not that Bradley is some kind of superstar, it's that Bradley is so much better than what the Celtics had to rely on.

Same concept as the Heat missing Bosh. A healthy Bosh makes the series a walk. When they got him on the court in games six and seven, the Celtics couldn't manage.

Sauru is making the argument that if Bradley is there, the Celtics can beat the Heat in seven.

Consider this hypothetical. The Celtics have three perimeter players other than Pierce and Rondo. Bradley who is -4 offense and +8 defense. Allen who is +2 offense and -6 defense. And Pietrus who is -15 offense and -1 defense. Losing the first guy and having to play the third guy is a HUGE impact on the overall team.

IF Bradley can derail one of Wade's second-half appearances in a Heat win, then the Celtics can win the series by grabbing a game they didn't get. Same logic as IF Bosh is healthy the Celtics maybe go home in five or six games.

That's a big maybe but quite possible. Sauru's a believer in Celtics so I will give him that.

At times, the Heat's role players looked superior against the Celtic's role players. If Avery could have stepped up in place of Pietrus or Dooling, why not. But Dooling's timely threes I thought were massive for the Celtics. Too bad both teams weren't 100% so we'll never know. As far as injuries affecting the series, the Bulls should be on top of the list. It's too bad we didn't get to see the best team in the league at full strength. But we got the next best thing in the Finals, 2nd and 3rd.

[SkyLine03LT]

Why is everybody getting caught-up with this 'what if' nonsense? It's the same as making excuses for the player injuries, which are a part of the game and there's nothing you can do about it. I think it's best to just admit that Celtics lost to a better team, while showing great determination and effort before eventually running out of gas, and I respect that. I would be saying the same thing if the C's woulda won. My point is if someone gets injured it's not an excuse for the team not to play as hard, and I'm glad none of the teams in the playoffs gave up this year, not even Chicago. BUT in the end, you have to give the winning team credit for winning the series instead of saying that 'they had it easy'. Nothing comes easy in the Playoffs, my friends.

[benji]

WOOOOSSSSHHH

[Sauru]

WOOOOSSSSHHH

awesome lol.

in a close series 1 player, 1 play, can change it all. do you think i am saying bradley would have won all 4 games for us? hell no, am i saying he might have won us game 2 when rondo was super and no one else stepped up? hell yes. does having him in gave 7 help slow the heat and maybe give us the win? possible.


i cant explain it any better than benji did and the point is still being missed so i guess its time to give up.

[NovU]

Should have been real butt hurting to lose to the fourth best team out of four remaining teams. You can't explain any better than benji anyways, because that'd be too much of everything-goes-right-for-the-Celtics-scenario, which actually already is as it is. Just give the credits where it's due, son. I respect the Celtics and their game and it was close. But why can't we just leave it at that.

[Andrew]

Throughout the game, the Heat were a better team, I think they deserved their win, but let's not pretend that in the end the game wasn't decided by the referees.

Agreed, I think that's a fair assessment of the situation. The Heat played the better game and it was only in doubt due to a furious final push by the Thunder, but the final score meant that a couple of very contentious calls became very significant, especially the non-call on Durant's shot attempt. You hate to see that happen in any sport.

I like Kevin Durant's post-game response to the situation though, taking it upon himself for not making the shot and talking about how they need to play better. As you noted, the effort has to be there from the opening tip. If they get off to those slow starts in Miami, it seems very unlikely that the series will be returning to Oklahoma City.

Not exactly Magic Johnson quotes but the pattern is like that for Magic's commentary.

Slightly better than his occasional "The Lakers will win because they're the Lakers!" proclamations.

[Spree#8]

http://www.sbnation.com/nba/2012/6/16/3 ... inals-2012

In the 44 minutes that Perkins has played, the Heat are +19.6 per 48 minutes -- they've outscored OKC, 98-80. In the 52 minutes that Perk has sat, the Thunder are +23.1 per 48 minutes -- they've outscored Miami, 121-96.

Exactly what I was talking about. Perkins should only play a few minutes a game in this series when Durant/Collison/Ibaka is tired/in foul trouble.

[RedPhazon8]

Maybe he needs a drive like what happened after the Blake dunk, but that stat should be taken into account for gm3 on the Thunder's end...

[NovU]

To be fair, he already has a ring. He's a winner, nothing more to prove. He can lax a bit like Fisher does.

Shane is turning out to be the Heat's Robert Horry. Watch out!

[benji]

This is the most important game in LeBron's career. If he doesn't step up, deliver a win, drop 50 points with half of those in the fourth including the game winner, he'll forever be forgotten as a player.

This is literally his last chance at having a respectable career.

[2Khoward]

If he drops 50 points the rest of the team is not going to be productive and that is a fact.

[Nick]

Lol @ benji. Melting faces globally with basketball perspective satire.

[Sauru]

Should have been real butt hurting to lose to the fourth best team out of four remaining teams. You can't explain any better than benji anyways, because that'd be too much of everything-goes-right-for-the-Celtics-scenario, which actually already is as it is. Just give the credits where it's due, son. I respect the Celtics and their game and it was close. But why can't we just leave it at that.

you are an idiot. i have said from day 1 that the celtics need bosh out and bradley playing to win. i am not hurt the celtics lost i am happy they made it as far as they did. if rose does not get hurt we dont get out of round 2. you are to fucking stupid to understand that a role player can impact a game. in a 7 game series 1 shot can change the entire outcome and you think bradley would have zero affect? hell without bradley the celtics beat the heat if bosh dont come back. learn the damn game of basketball before you actually try to talk about it.

[NovU]

Stop trying to patronize anyone with your utmost Celtics fanboism. I am NOT denying role players could make a difference or Bradley could have made a difference with the scenarios that were presented. I already fucking gave you that much and why can't you deal with it? All I was saying is it isn't obvious as your claim as Bradley possibly could have hurt the team more with his nearly minus performance in the playoffs. I don't even know why you made such a sore-loser comment from the get go. Poor sportsmanship or fanboism if you ask me. Let's get back to it anyways.

But I don't think he's 100% healthy as lingering-injury rumours been around since the playoffs started.

who is 100% at this point? the celtics were as beat up as any team not named chicago and look what they did this season? we dont lose bradley the heat would have been watching game 1 of the finals

Only thing we were discussing was potential reason why Wade was playing poorly in this post season. Yet I had to be dragged around with your what if scenarios. Yes, we could have well been watching game 1 of the Finals from home as you claim but I can also entertain you with what-if-not scenearios. And not to mention all those big comments you've been throwing around on the Heat which I didn't even bother to respond previously which includes the Heat being the fourth best team behind the Celtics when you guys were up 3 to 2. That's fine but once you decide to be dicky on certain teams and fans, deal with the consequences as we all do the same here.

[Andrew]

Stephen A Smith predicts a Thunder victory tonight. He accurately predicted the score of Game 1, so I guess you can take that to the bank.

[shadowgrin]

Somewhere, Duncan laughed so Joey Crawford had the urge to give out a technical.

Westbrook just Rondo'd the Heat by scoring that basket.

[benji]

Metta WorldPeace ‏@MettaWorldPeace
No brain All beard

[benji]

I wonder how many Thunder fans are wishing this was Greg Oden right now. Kevin Durant clearly is not the kind of player you can rely on to win a title. But Greg Oden would massacre the Heat inside.

Crazy how just one pick in the draft changing can mean the difference between a title and nothing.