Chicago Bulls Thread

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Personally I think the Bulls are better playing how they play now. There's far to many question marks with this team in regards to playing uptempo. The only thing it really helps us with is the fact there's no big time low post player, and I have my doubt about anyone atacking the rim even in a Suns style offence - most of the guys just aren't naturally aggresive.

The only thing? That's a pretty big thing. In fact, thats the thing that keeps 90% of the league from even contending for a championship. If you can minimize it at least you have a chance of being successful.

You have your doubts about them attacking the rim in an uptempo offense. As in what? They can't score in the fast break? They're too timid to dunk? Plus I'm a little confused by your comment. Not naturally aggressive? Isn't that what got the Bulls into the playoffs the last 3 seasons? The aggression and hard nosed play which carried over from the head coach? They might seem a little resigned to losing this year, but cmon, its there.

Continue to be doubtful about them in an uptempo game, and I'll remain steadfast that they're going nowhere in a hurry as a perimeter team that can't penetrate into the lane and get easy scores. If they get Rick Carlislie, then what? Are they going to feel better as they take contested 3pt shots? I guess maybe he won't bitch them out about having the fewest points per 100 possessions in the league?

Either the Bulls find a low post scorer, or they change their offensive attack. They've never been very good offensively, and with Ben Wallace being a team cancer again, they're not really that great defensively (10 ppg worse than Boston by comparsion).

The Bulls remind me a lot of the Nets teams of the past few years since they got rid of K-Mart. Remember how explosive the Nets were on the break back then? They ran when they had the opportunities, but they were still a solid defensive team. That got them a couple of NBA Finals appearances. Now though, Lawrence Frank has the team playing this mucked up half-court offense without the aid of a big man, and they've been pretty much mediocre during his entire tenure. They can't score, even with Jason Kidd in this offense. If they had Byron Scott back though, I'm sure they'd have at least a .500 record this point in the season. Same thing goes for the Bulls, I think. Give them a coach that is flexible enough to coach to the strengths of the team, and maybe they'll win more than 9 games.

The Bulls have been very good for 3 seasons now, last season peaking at 49 wins before the team tuned out to Skiles demands this season. Boylan's benching of Ben Gordon and placing him back into the 6th man role has looked very good thus far with todays performance against the Bucks, they looked like the Bulls of old. If the team is remaining competitive enough to win ~50 games a year with no star big man, I'll take it, and I'll welcome a personnell change well before a style of play change. My reason for that is this roster is just not a fastbreaking team. The team is run by an undersized 2 guard who loves to shoot, with a similar player as his backup and the third string point is a converted small forward.

It would take alot of changes to turn this into a fast breaking team, and even then nothing is guaranteed. When I said the team is not agressive, I meant it. These guys stand around on offence and there is very little cutting and even less driving to the basket. The only guys that seem to want to step inside the three point line and take a bee line to the rim on the regular is Tyrus Thomas and Luol Deng. The vast majority of this team just stand around shooting jumpers all day. Personnell changes are a major need if this team is gonna play Phoenix Suns style.

Aggression isn't what got the Bulls out of the lottery and into contention, it was defence, hard nosed hustling and a strong balanced attack. The Bulls haven't been attacking the rim for years.

If the Bulls continue their jumpshooting ways and continue winnign as they have in seasons past, I see no problem with that. They're a tough team to beat come playoff time. They can run with any team in the East - they challenged the Pistons last year once they got going, they could beat the Cav's, Wizards, etc and I personally feel that they could give the Celtics a good battle. This is still a contending team in my eyes.

The team has had the worst start possible and is only 2 and a half games out of the 8th seed. There's no need for drastic change yet.

As for the Net's comparison, they had a great roster for fast breaking. They had an elite finisher in Kenyon Martin who was also a very good defender, and they had the best point guard in the league at the time feeding him the passes and running the show. They had guys like Kerry Kittles who played Raja Bell type roles as major three point threats on the drive and kick, then they had a very good slashing small forward in Richard Jefferson. That team had all the tools to run the fast break with the best of them.

The Bulls will need to trade Kirk Hinrich to play a fastbreak type offence. I'm not opposed to trading Kirk, but right now he's in a huge slump which means his value is absolute shit, far lower than it should be. If he is to get traded, the Bulls need either a starting level pass first point or an elite do it all point a la Baron Davis. Look at the teams around the league that like to run - Phoenix, Golden State, Toronto, Indiana, Denver, Washington, Memphis, even Milwuakee and Sacramento - they all have either very good pass first point guards or elite all around point guards - Nash, Tinsley, Arenas, Calderon, Ford, Iverson, Davis. The ones that don't are run by guys like Mo Williams, Kyle Lowry, Mike Bibby, guys who just plain don't fit that mold. What's the result? Losing teams.

Hinrich has to go, and then the rest of the team has to quickly build up aggression to attack the rim - which they haven't been able to do in three years - or many more moves will need to be made.

It's too much of a risk in my eyes.

---------------------------------------------------

Anyway, while on the topic of the Bulls, I really liked what I saw today from the team. Ben Gordon was like his old self, Lu was great, Ben Wallace looked inspired. Things are looking up. I only saw the second half so I'll have to watch the game in full later.

I'm so happy about getting NBALP, I'm yet to miss a game all season. The games I didn't watch I downloaded and watched when I could. This thing is great - I just use good old Sopcast to see the National TV games, and even if I miss them I can catch a torrent later.

By the way, Demetris is playing great in the NBDL. I'm so glad we picked him up, he's a guy who I thought was a steal and I still think that way. I hope Pax holds onto him, because we could really do with a shooter who can actually shoot at the moment.

[air gordon]

from several Paxson & bulls beat reporter interviews post Skiles firing-

surprisingly enough, it was Skiles who started tuning out the players first. Also Paxson and Skiles had a fallout regarding:
-certain players not developing (Thabo& Thomas)
-players effort and defensive schemes (specifically defending the pick and roll)
-players not being utilized in the post (Deng)


my take on the Skiles situation..
i believe that Paxson hired Skiles to whip the roster at that time into shape and Skiles responded (though some of his methods were unorthodox). normally a team without a superstar will emulate it's coach and that's what the Bulls were- short on talent but big on effort and execution

now fast forward to this year- the team sucks and Skiles starts to resort to his unorthodox methods- benching 5 players at a time, leaving in players with the hot hand, inconsistent player rotations. Oddly enough this was the first year that Skiles did not resort to benching someone (not counting Thomas) and plugging in duhon the lineup. in the past, the team would respond to these tactics but for whatever reason, it didn't happen this year... hence the firing

i've always wondered why Skiles had the reputation of being such a hardass/non players coach/too candid and being ripped for that. there are plenty of coaches with the same mentality and have succeeded. currently arguably the league's top coach- Popovich is one of the those. that dude wouldn't coddle Parker and look how Parker has turned out. Skiles may have missed on Chandler but for every Chandler he's missed, he's been right on Eddie Robinson, Eddy Curry, Jamal Crawford, Jalen Rose, Tim Thomas, etc. besides, aren't assistant coaches there to be the players buddy?

interestingly enough, some here are asking to bring in the same kind of coach that the players tuned out- Doug Collings, Larry Brown, Fratello


moving forward with the roster...
i think the onus will now fall on Paxson. every single player on the current roster was brought in by Paxson. now that the coach is gone, it's time to start pointing the finger at the guy who put the team together.

Personally i think he's overrated/overvalued Deng. i'm not doubting the guy's work ethic but Deng is not a legit post player or #1 scoring option. i see Deng trying to post people but he can't overpower or go around his defender. he tries that fadeaway in the post but it just doesn't look confident and he's more turnover prone when he's in the lane.

it's no secret what the team needs- a legit scorer who can draw double teams. but the team can overcome this if night in, night out they play tough defense, have a good team effort, execute/have good ball movement on offense. which leads me to thinking- they need to get rid of Ben Wallace. Now.. It made a lot of sense at the time to sign him but now it’s looking like Paxson’s worst move. The $15million man was supposed to be a leader (he friggin turned down the role for captain for the team). He’s a team cancer and because of his ego, he’ll refuse to take a lesser role. Pax- just admit you were wrong and i'll forgive you for it. Cut him, buy him out, whatever. just get him off the team.

We need to see what Tyrus can do (and see if Pax whiffed by trading Aldridge). Throw Tyrus, Noah, and Gray out there. I would rather win/lose by playing/developing the young guys then win/lose and play the vets/not developing the young guys (though i'm not sure if those 2 are mutually exclusive)

i wouldn't say the Bulls need to trade specifically Hinrich, Deng, or Gordon. i think with the results, or lack of, show that these 3 are all expendable. all 3 would be better off in a secondary role/benefit from that #1 scorer. Hinrich though would be the hardest to trade since he is BYC player

a Phoenix-type offensive style sounds interesting but i agree that they don't have the personnel to run it. however it certainly makes sense for a team last in scoring and fg% to try and get some easy baskets via transition/fast break. against Milwaukee last nite, the Bulls did look like they tried to push the ball on every possession. but that was against the bucks hehe. a jump shooting team like the bulls should continue their offensive sets- spread the floor, use some pick and rolls, and have good ball movement. they can't exactly run isolations lol

some good points, there Shannon. though i find it weird how there's this perception by you of Skiles weaknesses outweighing his strengths despite the team overachieving to 49wins and advancing to the 2nd round last year. i wouldn't say Skiles magically became a bad coach 25 games into the season hehe. i definitely think Tyrus should be playing more but the last 3 coaches have kept him on the bench

whoever feels sorry for Skiles being fired is a fool. No one else would have given him a chance to coach in the NBA and the guy is now getting paid to do jack shit (i think his contract runs through next year)

just keep in mind Reinsdorf is the bulls owner- money may be a factor in hiring a coach (especially while skiles contract is still on the books)

[Donatello]

It's really painful for me to see how the Bulls are doing this season, I've been really glad about their revival the past few seasons. I hope they get a new coach who turns it around. If they blow this year, I'm afraid their confidence will be gone.

[benji]

They can't score, even with Jason Kidd in this offense. If they had Byron Scott back though, I'm sure they'd have at least a .500 record this point in the season.

The Nets offensive rankings under Scott: 25th, 16th, 19th, 25th. Not exactly lighting it up.

The Bulls problems I have outlined I don't know how many times in this thread (and no one has ever really responded to them...) and no coach can fix them. Coaches mean less in being good than people think. (Although, they can mean much more in being bad.) You can mold Carlisle, Fratello, Brown and Van Gundy into a super coach, Minnesota would still be one of the worst teams in the league.

The problem is their players. They dealt out a cheaper, younger, better big man for the right to sign an aging big man for more. They botched the trade completely by getting nothing in return for the players they acquired. They overpaid Hinrich, which resulted in them getting in a fight with Deng and Gordon this offseason. Meanwhile, they also overpaid Nocioni considering the lack of market, and oddly acquired Joe Smith.

We were all lured into thinking they were a contender, despite the evidence, that the teams best players were having fluke seasons likely far over their heads.

How does a coach improve this team? Running just gets them blown out because they can't score, and it's giving the other team more opportunities to score. The key to a bad team, is to limit the possessions. A lousy team is more likely to win a game with ten possessions, than one with a hundred. A better rotation can improve them, but only so much, considering close to nobody on the team can score well enough.

Slow the pace to a crawl, use your top favorite defenders (Thomas, Wallace, Duhon, etc.) to create opportunities, and only run off those. They can't play a full court game, you need shooters to run like the Suns do. They need a half-court offense that gets the guys shots where they can make them (which has been a problem this season...they can't make them anywhere) before they can even think about doing anything else offensively.

They botched getting a star last season, so as I said before, they're more or less doomed to a low compatibility. Good to see others realizing it.

[shadowgrin]

The key to a bad team, is to limit the possessions. A lousy team is more likely to win a game with ten possessions, than one with a hundred...

Slow the pace to a crawl

O shite. That's Fratello's style. Nooo..

[Andrew]

I am also in awe, and a little disappointed. I have a feeling the Bulls will regret this deeply. I can't wait for Andrew's response.

Its a bit of a rash move though, since its only 25 games into the season, and in 04-05, they had a worse record at this point. I never thought he would lose his job before Isiah Thomas.

The blame notoriously falls upon the coach and in that respect, it might seem a bit unfair or a rash decision but in the long run, I don't think they'll regret it. Skiles has done some good work with the team the past three years and he deserves a lot of credit for that, but consider also his inability to properly utilise or develop certain players. As air gordon said, he was right about certain players with poor attitudes but Chandler's regression and the misuse of players like Thabo and Thomas is a concern, as is the fact he supposedly tuned the players out.

His approach, I believe, was starting to wear thin and as air gordon also said, his unorthodox methods - frustrating to watch at the best of times - weren't working either. I found a Gordon quote after the loss to the Magic quite interesting as well:

"He doesn't get too high or too low," Gordon said. "That works when guys see Jim being so calm. He leads us in kind of a relax way."

Needless to say, Skiles shouldn't have coddled anyone but it's likely his stern approach of yanking players who miss a couple of shots or make a mistake and then sitting them was beginning to hurt the team. Popovich does the same thing in San Antonio but he has a better roster at his disposal and puts together a much better plan B. When Skiles would bench Gordon after missing a couple of shots and bring in Adrian Griffin when the team desperately needs someone to score, something's amiss with that plan. When players who can contribute are in and out of the rotation, it's not going to work.

It's easy to point the finger at Skiles but the fact is he does deserve some of the blame and when a team is struggling, rolling the dice and going for a fresh approach isn't a bad idea and preferable to blowing up a team that actually has some talent without trying something new first. That doesn't absolve the players or Paxson from any blame because their production is down and some of his moves are looking very suspect but if Skiles tuned out his players and doesn't have any answers then it's best for the team to move on.

Skiles is not a bad coach and his approach has its positives, the Bulls' improvement in recent years is a testament to that. But it's no longer working and that's why it's time for a change.

What concerned me when Boylan took over is that his first move was to ask Gordon to come off the bench. The fact that he was a bit miffed at the decision may not bode well for future negotiations but he is a professional with a much better attitude than other former players that we could mention (pretty much all those names that AG ran off, really) and at the end of the day, being stubborn about such things isn't going to help a team that needs to get out of a funk.

The second thing that concerned me is that benching Gordon is a classic Skiles idea which has me a little fearful that Boylan may not have too many new ideas, which I suppose doesn't matter long term if he's only going to be the interim coach (unless it causes a rift with Gordon) but I think as long as the Bulls are mathematically in playoff contention - which they still are, despite their poor record through the first two months of the season - they should be trying to win games as much as trying new things and getting players like Thabo, Thomas and Gray minutes. The thing is, so far it seems to be working with two victories and a last second loss to the second best team in the conference so for now, it's hard to argue against the move.

it's no secret what the team needs- a legit scorer who can draw double teams. but the team can overcome this if night in, night out they play tough defense, have a good team effort, execute/have good ball movement on offense. which leads me to thinking- they need to get rid of Ben Wallace. Now.. It made a lot of sense at the time to sign him but now it’s looking like Paxson’s worst move. The $15million man was supposed to be a leader (he friggin turned down the role for captain for the team). He’s a team cancer and because of his ego, he’ll refuse to take a lesser role. Pax- just admit you were wrong and i'll forgive you for it. Cut him, buy him out, whatever. just get him off the team.

I'm starting to feel that way. A trade would be preferable in an ideal world but they'd need to overpay for anyone to take on his deal and even then, I think they'd be hard pressed to find any takers short of a star player quitting on his team and demanding a trade (and even then, would you want to bring such a player into the mix?). Cutting him feels like such a drastic move but I know what you mean; his signing has been a huge blunder. I wouldn't be sorry to see him go.

On a lighter note, Gordon's dunk against the Spurs last week was pretty cool in the midst of a depressing game. Not quite as explosive as the one against the Nuggets last year (the game Thomas won at the buzzer) but fun to see all the same since I didn't expect it.[/quote]

[Mikki]

Marv Albert should give coaching a try. YES!

[air gordon]

The Bulls problems I have outlined I don't know how many times in this thread (and no one has ever really responded to them...)

lol sorry i was nodding when i read it each time.. had nothing to dispute so i didn't respond

Meanwhile, they also overpaid Nocioni considering the lack of market, and oddly acquired Joe Smith.

i've been out of the loop with the FA signings this past year...what was Nocioni's market value & what players were available comparable to him that you suggest Paxson should have gone after?

Smith has been a decent acquisition and his signing/contract didn't put them in an any worse salary situation. he's one of the few forwards on the team that can score

How does a coach improve this team?

magically make the players hit shots and starting playing defense like they have the past few years. even the espn stat man himself pointed it out in an article

They botched getting a star last season, so as I said before, they're more or less doomed to a low compatibility. Good to see others realizing it.

while it did make sense to acquire PJ brown and use him/his salary in a in a trade... but what offer was there on the table that made sense (besides the one that an east coast writer speculated about regarding Gasol)??

Andrew.. totally agree on Gordon. he is in that contract year and privately Gordon can't be happy. he's been lighting it up but you see some of those shots- it almost looks Jamal Crawford like.. a lot of forces. but i guess when he's coming off the bench, he's really got the green light (sorta of what Noce was doing).

2 guys to keep an eye on: Duhon. since the lineup change- he's been playing poor. and then Deng- i've noticed this guy has been invisible in the 4th qtr. c'mon man...

now i can understand the team needing a few wins so Thomas didn't play much. but after the dust has settled- he has to play.

and i'll give credit to Wallace for playing well (though wtf- he didn't even contest Turkoglu's winning shot. c'mon- you're supposed to be mr big buff bad dude, you can't let a little push off by Hedo knock you out of the way). however it's alarming when i hear Boylan mentioning in an interview he had to make some requests/had a talk with Wallace when he was hired. just go out there, play, and earn your paycheck. shouldn't matter who the coach is

[benji]

i've been out of the loop with the FA signings this past year...what was Nocioni's market value & what players were available comparable to him that you suggest Paxson should have gone after?

Smith has been a decent acquisition and his signing/contract didn't put them in an any worse salary situation. he's one of the few forwards on the team that can score

while it did make sense to acquire PJ brown and use him/his salary in a in a trade... but what offer was there on the table that made sense (besides the one that an east coast writer speculated about regarding Gasol)??

Well, I don't know if there was someone else the Bulls should've gone after, and even that they shouldn't have resigned Nocioni. What I mean by market value is...what were other teams in the league going to offer him? Were they really enough teams going after him, and wanting him that much, that the Bulls had to sign him to a contract starting at $8.5 million? I consider a team looking at Nocioni, perhaps (although different players in what they provide) as a team that may have looked at Varejao, and there was clearly no market for him.

Don't get me wrong, Smith has done well, and I don't know where the Bulls would be without him, but at $5 million per, couldn't there have been a better option at that price? It just seems like a questionable splurge on him and Nocioni, after being so stingy on Deng and Gordon. (However smart it was to not give them near-max deals.)

I don't know what offer was on the table, I'm sure there had to be something. The only rumors I was hearing were this offseason as "sign-and-trades" for Brown, which were clearly untrue (as the salary cap doesn't work as those people think it does). I'm saying they botched the Chandler for Wallace flip by getting nothing out of Brown and J.R. Smith. They basically used Brown's salary on extending Nocioni and signing Joe Smith. It wouldn't irk if there wasn't so much touting of "the Chandler deal is good, because Brown can be used to get a star!" all of last year.

Essentially, I have no idea how to fix this team (while staying competitive) with transactions as you can't really get anything useful for any of the guys. At this point you just hope everyone can get back on track...and then you're what? A 45-50 win team at best. Woohoo.

[puttincomputers]

puttincomputers wrote:
the bulls should trade wallace. who for? i have no idea. i just do not like the guy. maybe for tyson chandler an maybe someone else? just a thought


hmm yal still laughin?

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[/quote]
Quote:

Quote:
Ben Wallace said Saturday he would welcome personnel changes if it would help the club.

"That's one of those things that goes along with this league," said Wallace. "Change is not always bad. If everybody wants to be here we have to step it up and go out there and play basketball."




anyone still like wallace? [/quote]


okay lets all laugh at puttincomputers!

[-Young Buck-]

No lets all laugh at one of the biggest quoting disasters since the begining of the internet.

[jonthefon]

I've seen plenty, plenty worse.

Does anyone think that the Bulls can recover from this position like they did in 06-07?

They really need a hot stove trade. The problem is, as Shannon says, is that Hinrich's value is really low and unless he really steps out and puts numbers up (would have to be 22/10 in this situation), it's going to stay that way. Maybe sell high during a little form boost.) Wallace is looking a little better recently (thankfully for my underperforming fantasy team which needs a new name), but he's still way too expensive for a rebounding specialist and they need a genius trade to get something above 60 cents on the dollar.

[J@3]

No lets all laugh at one of the biggest quoting disasters since the begining of the internet.

yeah I think that one's a lost cause.

[JT_55]

He actually only made one mistake, he put the extra / in the first quote tag.

Code: Select all

[/quote]
Quote:

Quote:
Ben Wallace said Saturday he would welcome personnel changes if it would help the club.

"That's one of those things that goes along with this league," said Wallace. "Change is not always bad. If everybody wants to be here we have to step it up and go out there and play basketball."




anyone still like wallace? [/quote]

This would turn out to be...

Quote:

Quote:
Ben Wallace said Saturday he would welcome personnel changes if it would help the club.

"That's one of those things that goes along with this league," said Wallace. "Change is not always bad. If everybody wants to be here we have to step it up and go out there and play basketball."




anyone still like wallace?

First quote inside the tags would be for the article he got it from, and the second one would be the article itself quoting Wallace.

[shadowgrin]

You still it made it confusing JT.

That quote is still a disaster.

[JT_55]

Umm...yes. Apparently I made a small mistake. Forgot to "code" his quoting distaster. I edited it, hope it will be a bit clearer, but no guarantees of course...

[puttincomputers]

yeah it was! oh well off to bible school i go!

[shadowgrin]

Pippen wants to be part of Bulls again.

Pippen would consult with Jackson on defensive strategy, and it was he who suggested he take Magic Johnson in the 1991 Finals, which proved decisive. (Just wanted to put that in from the article to show Pip's greatness)

John Paxson signed Pippen in 2003 for leadership, but Pippen was injured and says he mostly backed off after Bill Cartwright was fired.

"I didn't come there to play for Skiles," Pippen said. "I didn't like him, didn't like him as a player."

Another report that Skiles gave up on the team

It has been reported that the firing of Bulls coach Scott Skiles was ordered by owner Jerry Reinsdorf, and that general manager John Paxson had to do it against his wishes.

Not true. Reinsdorf didn't want to buy Skiles out of the final year and a half of his deal at all. It was Paxson who insisted on making the change.

Here's how Paxson and Skiles fell out. Skiles told Paxson that he thought the team was irreversibly broken. Paxson told Skiles to fix it. Skiles said he couldn't. The players apparently got wind that Skiles had quit on them. In fact, one report had Ben Wallace going to Paxson and complaining that the players felt Skiles had bailed. The ballgame was pretty much over at that point.

[Andrew]

Andrew.. totally agree on Gordon. he is in that contract year and privately Gordon can't be happy. he's been lighting it up but you see some of those shots- it almost looks Jamal Crawford like.. a lot of forces. but i guess when he's coming off the bench, he's really got the green light (sorta of what Noce was doing).

A few of his shots have been that way at times but I'd like to think he still has a good attitude and that some of those shots have been more a case of "Well, someone has to make a basket" and their offense being pretty stagnant. I've only seen four Bulls games this year but I noticed that Hinrich and Noce were making some pretty poor decisions and hoisting up ill-advised shots as well. When it comes to Gordon, he showed he could be a 20 ppg scorer last season so I'm comfortable with him taking 16, 17, 18 shots a game or more if he's lighting it up. Of course you do want those to be good attempts.

As I said before Gordon is expected to be a team player and all but he's got to be somewhat miffed that other players who have struggled, like Hinrich, have not been asked to give up their starting spot. At this point in time, it's a fair enough call to say Pax messed up on the Wallace signing and Thomas for Aldridge is looking like a blunder as well, the last thing he needs to do is repeat Krause's mistakes and create a rift between himself and Gordon (or Deng for that matter). I'd like to think those guys could be part of bigger and better things in Chicago but whatever the future holds, it would be a disaster if they accepted the qualifying offer and ultimately left town, either outright or in a trade that brought in a Wallace-like contract and little talent, sending them right back to square one.

okay lets all laugh at puttincomputers!

Not many people dispute the idea that getting rid of Wallace is a good idea, but your original suggestion of trading him for Chandler was shot down because there's no way New Orleans would do that deal. Trading Wallace is easier said than done. It would be fantastic if it could be done without overpaying and losing anyone in the name of getting his contract off the books, but that's highly unlikely to say the least.

I'm not sure about Pippen being the Bulls' coach after his recent remarks. He didn't exactly endear himself to anyone on the team. Pip is one of my all-time favourites and unquestionably one of the greats, but you don't really want someone coming in with that attitude. With all due respect to his accomplishments, his comments came off as pretty egotistical and bringing up the whole "Michael Jordan never won a championship without (him)" stuff is ridiculous; at the end of the day, Pippen never won a championship with Jordan either. They both owe part of their success to each other - certainly the six championships - and both created opportunities for one another and contributed to the Bulls' dominance in the 90s.

At the end of the day, Pippen's accomplishments as a player can be cited along with examples of former players who immediately found success on the sidelines but I'm still not sold on Pip being the guy to get it down from the bench.

[shadowgrin]

"Michael Jordan never won a championship without (him)" stuff is ridiculous

Pippen doesn't mean that as a serious statement.
That statement is his usual standard quote to get some laughs or chuckles.

[Andrew]

Perhaps, perhaps not. In any case, his other remarks about the Bulls' players and even taking shots at Skiles isn't the attitude you want a new coach to come in with. He obviously has knowledge about the game but I'm not sure he'd be personable enough to be a successful head coach. Besides, his greatness as a player and his ability to run a team don't necessarily make him a prime candidate as there's no guarantee those qualities would translate into coaching. Magic Johnson was a superior point guard to Avery Johnson but The Little General has a more impressive record as a coach.

[air gordon]

[quote="benji"][/quote]
I wouldn’t put Nocioni and Sideshow Bob in the same class in terms of garnering interest since Noce can score & defend. Or maybe Noce has a better agent then the other guy. Noce reportedly resigned for 5yrs/37.5mil. I’m not sure how that compares to how much other key contributors for playoff teams have resigned for… but I think it would be nonsense to let a player like that walk

If im not mistaken, Joe Smith was signed using the MLE for 1yr so that signing was had no bearing on resigning Deng or Gordon. Splurge or not, it seems like Pax has made the right call on those two so far

It’s all speculation exactly what deal(s) where on the table... but i think it's fair to say that there wasn't an offer that made both Chicago & Memphis happy. I was all for Paxson making a deal for a legit scorer as the team couldn't make the next step without one.


The best way to “fix” the team is on the players themselves. 45-50 wins is a step in the right direction for a team like the Bulls, the same team that was an embarrassment for 6 years. Maybe if Pax can sucker another GM and get a Rasheed Wallace type of trade like the Pistons did a few years back, expectations can be higher


Scottie's latest comments is classic Scottie- not knowing when to keep his mouth shut. I can't say i disagree with all those comments but he needs to bite his tongue... especially if he intends to coach those guys. the media loves this type of stuff certainly. could Pippen be a successful coach? that's debatable. when he was still playing, there would be reports of him teaching/taking the younger guys under his wing. and he must know how to handle egos after player with "the greatest". though he has no coaching experience, can be a loose cannon himself, and would probably need some experienced assistants at his side

Andrew- i was specifically referencing Gordon's performances since Boylan has taken over. there were a lot of iso's for him and you can't complain when he's making the shots... i'm just hoping for high percentage shots

i don't see any alienation between Gm & Gor-Deng. Both players turned down the offers and at this point, looks like the players made the mistake. ..the Bulls still have the right to match any offer this offseason

[shadowgrin]

Damn it airgordy, you're no noob. Learn to quote properly.

[Matthew]

I'm not sure about Pippen being the Bulls' coach after his recent remarks. He didn't exactly endear himself to anyone on the team. Pip is one of my all-time favourites and unquestionably one of the greats, but you don't really want someone coming in with that attitude. With all due respect to his accomplishments, his comments came off as pretty egotistical and bringing up the whole "Michael Jordan never won a championship without (him)" stuff is ridiculous; at the end of the day, Pippen never won a championship with Jordan either. They both owe part of their success to each other - certainly the six championships - and both created opportunities for one another and contributed to the Bulls' dominance in the 90s.

Sometimes the truth hurts

At the end of the day, Pippen's accomplishments as a player can be cited along with examples of former players who immediately found success on the sidelines but I'm still not sold on Pip being the guy to get it down from the bench.

There we have it. Sorry, Scotty. You don't have the support of Andrew to become coach of the Bulls. You should of known better.

Magic Johnson was a superior point guard to Avery Johnson but The Little General has a more impressive record as a coach.

Maybe Avery Johnson has had more talent to work with?

Larry Bird had a very honourable coaching record and he had a much bigger ego then Scottie ever had or has now.

[shadowgrin]

Maybe Avery Johnson has had more talent to work with?

Magic Johnson had talent to coach.
Nick Van Exel and Cedric Ceballos! Yeah!