Truth

Hello everyone, I wanted to ask you all about the subject of Truth.

How can you really KNOW something? That you are right about something? What is “Truth” when:

Different people can look at the same data and come to completely different conclusions.
In the court of law, the verdict is given based on a majority opinion.
The majority opinion can be incorrect.
You can’t really PROVE anything. Eyewitnesses can lie or be mistaken. Pictures, signatures, videotapes, audiotapes, etc. can be forged.
What is bad to someone is good to someone else, and vice-versa. For example, Adolph Hitler thought he was on a mission from God to get rid of the Jewish people whom he considered to be a plague on society.
So much is relative. What’s big to someone is small to someone else, what’s loud to one person may be quiet to another, what’s good/bad/cool/lame/beautiful/ugly/important/meaningless etc…

Do you think that there is such a thing as Truth in the world? Or is there only an individual’s Truths- like “To me, this house is made out of wood. I don’t care if the rest of the world says it’s made out of brick, this is my Truth.”


Basically, how do you think a person can you really know that they're right? About anything- physically, morally, etc…

Well I know DaTruth and it hurts, my brain.

A little more on-topic: I find the point your bring up at the 4th arrow extremely interesting. Nowadays there's so much possible that you can't really go by pictures, video, audio, etc. anymore since they can easily be edited.

There is no truth. There are interpretations, those interpretations happen to be believed by many & that is passed off as the "truth". Atleast that's what this twisted mind thinks.

Dubya speaks the truth.

The truth also comes with a lot of diehard and overly biased fans.... Thats for sure.

the truth can be out there.... and it can also be in you. but if you have no trust then you can never taste the great feeling of truth in this lifetime...........

this sounds like philosophy homework.

The truth also comes with a lot of diehard and overly biased fans.... Thats for sure.

The Truth should be rated 99 in NBA Live.

Dubya speaks the truth.

how do we know youre telling the truth -.-

Is this something you are currently learning in class why you ask?

"you want the truth? you can't handle the truth!!!"

Is this something you are currently learning in class why you ask?

It looks like an assignment outline to me...

Is this something you are currently learning in class why you ask?

Maybe, maybe not. He's maybe 'deep' topics kinda like this one before..

I think bullsfan makes some of the best, serious topics of anyone. Unfortunately, a lot of people don't answer back seriously.

Or is there only an individual’s Truths- like “To me, this house is made out of wood. I don’t care if the rest of the world says it’s made out of brick, this is my Truth.”

First of all, 2 plus 2 is always 4. Math is always an absolute truth.

If we had no absolute truths, then this world would be a mess. I mean, if someone killed a guy and said that it wasn't wrong, and that it was his truth, then what would this world be like?

This isn't for a class, I just like talking about this kind of stuff...

First of all, 2 plus 2 is always 4. Math is always an absolute truth.

I used to think that too, but actually, not even 2+2=4 is an absolute truth. I read this book called "The Man Who Loved Only Numbers," which was about a famous mathematician named Paul Erdos. It also discussed other famous math theories and other famous mathematicians.

One thing I noticed was how many brilliant mathematicians committed suicide. Why? Because they were seeking Truth with their math, they wanted to have Certainty. But in 1931, Kurt Godel demonstrated that there is no such thing in math!!! His "Incompleteness Theorems" showed this. Here's a description I took from http://www.miskatonic.org/godel.html.

"In 1931, the Czech-born mathematician Kurt Gödel demonstrated that within any given branch of mathematics, there would always be some propositions that couldn't be proven either true or false using the rules and axioms ... of that mathematical branch itself. You might be able to prove every conceivable statement about numbers within a system by going outside the system in order to come up with new rules and axioms, but by doing so you'll only create a larger system with its own unprovable statements. The implication is that all logical system of any complexity are, by definition, incomplete; each of them contains, at any given time, more true statements than it can possibly prove according to its own defining set of rules."

So I think with 2 + 2 = 4, Godel would say something like: "Well, what does the number 2 represent?" And then he would break down all the assumptions & rules that "2" was composed of and based on, and raise more and more questions until you'd say, "ENOUGH! Who CARES?!?"

There is no truth. There are interpretations, those interpretations happen to be believed by many & that is passed off as the "truth". At least that's what this twisted mind thinks.

In a way, I agree with you there, Jackal. But only to an extent. Because of H Rock's concern:

If we had no absolute truths, then this world would be a mess. I mean, if someone killed a guy and said that it wasn't wrong, and that it was his truth, then what would this world be like?

I believe that our feelings of a morality means that right & wrong have to exist, and also physical truths have got to exist, because of the facts of reality being relative. When you say that something is relative, that means that it is not absolute. If there weren't at least 1 absolute, you could never say something was relative! It would make no sense...the very definition of relativity is based on the concept of absoluteness.

So I think with 2 + 2 = 4, Godel would say something like: "Well, what does the number 2 represent?"

I think that 2 represents two things. I think that's pretty absolute.

I mean, if someone killed a guy and said that it wasn't wrong, and that it was his truth, then what would this world be like?

Fun.

I mean, if someone killed a guy and said that it wasn't wrong, and that it was his truth, then what would this world be like?

Fun.

Unfortunately, a lot of people don't answer back seriously.

So I think with 2 + 2 = 4, Godel would say something like: "Well, what does the number 2 represent?"

I think that 2 represents two things. I think that's pretty absolute.

Actually, bullsfans speaks the 'truth.' Even numbers aren't truth, they're arbitrary. If you read Orwell's 1984, there's a startling case where even I was convinced that 2 + 2 = 5 It's kinda scary to be put into a world where there is no absolute truth in terms of materialism and in anything that can be arbitrary. The only truth that I can see is in a few intangibles, such as love, for example.

Unfortunately, a lot of people don't answer back seriously.

I made my serious comment, now I made my fun one, lighten up.

Cyanide, that sounds interesting, care to explain more?

You don't know the truth unless you see it, hear it, or been there.

If you read Orwell's 1984, there's a startling case where even I was convinced that 2 + 2 = 5

Please elaborate.

You don't know the truth unless you see it, hear it, or been there.

If you haven't seen Hurricane Katrina (and I presume you haven't), then how do you know it happened? You look at the aftermath ie. the wreckage.

Well, you don't know that either. it's called propaganda.