2017-18 Daily Discussion

again curry having a knack for picking up stupid fouls. smh

brown had some great individual defense. KD hit some tough shots on him.

Monroe is crap on defense so i guess he's right up the sun's alley for the their tank

Monroe put up 20 and 11 on 10-14 last night, the problem is he is NOT a center. He needs somebody playing behind him to protect the rim. He started at center and played center most of the night.

He was tied for 31st in the league in defensive rating last year, he played 81 games. And 21st in rebounding % and 15th in the league in Steal %.

Raw stats per 36 minutes last season he averaged 18.8 PPG, 10.5 RPG, 3.7 APG, 1.8SPG and shot .533% from the floor.

He has been a Center a lot of his career, but I think he is more suited for the 4 position with a shot blocker behind him. Which is why he worked well with Drummond in Detroit.

I think he is a good player when he is at his natural position. He doesn't need to be hidden on defense, but he absolutely needs a rim protector behind him.

perhaps the rail lonzo ball's bad shooting train is losing momentum, but how about the stretch of woeful shooting by Marcus Smart. mind you, he is an excellent defender, can defend multiple positions, etc.

22fg%, 23 3pt%. a TS% of negative crap. ok fudged that one. this even makes Lonzo Ball blush

He's shooting .268% for the season, which is total garbage.

Last game he was a big part of the Celtics going down 17, with his questionable shot selection and flat out inability to be consistent (he wasn't even consistently hitting the rim).

Good Marcus and bad Marcus is the problem. When he is bad, he looks like he doesn't even belong in the league. But when he is good (better shot selection, finding his teammates, playing great defense) he looks like an above average NBA player.

I have a love hate relationship with him like no other in league history.

fr do you guys think Cavs will be able to beat Celtics in the ECF? Even with Isaiah Thomas, I don't see this team beating the young Celtics team.

Team that have better chance at beating the Cavs imho are the Bucks.

Celtics are more like the Raptors. You can win regular season games but when you need to turn it on, they don't have that extra gear. Your top players matter especially 1 to 4th best guys. Lowry and DeRozan would get mauled in the PO, Horford and Kyrie, you can expect just about the same.

Monroe is crap on defense so i guess he's right up the sun's alley for the their tank

You betcha.

The Rockets went right at Monroe early in the game and it's part of the reason the Suns were out of it early. The Suns are almost certainly going to be trading him or buying him out at some point because of his expiring contract and maybe this will help them move that along faster than expected.

Clint Capela: This stat line doesn't do him justice as he dominated the paint and killed the Suns with his high screening.

Behind Monroe's empty stats, there's only sorrow and despair. Average bigs like Clint Capela could toy with such a shit big, no biggie.

Dunno why but I feel like Monroe reminds me of Andray Blatche in some ways.

[Dee4Three]

fr do you guys think Cavs will be able to beat Celtics in the ECF? Even with Isaiah Thomas, I don't see this team beating the young Celtics team.

Team that have better chance at beating the Cavs imho are the Bucks.

Celtics are more like the Raptors. You can win regular season games but when you need to turn it on, they don't have that extra gear. Your top players matter especially 1 to 4th best guys. Lowry and DeRozan would get mauled in the PO, Horford and Kyrie, you can expect just about the same.

Monroe is crap on defense so i guess he's right up the sun's alley for the their tank

You betcha.

The Rockets went right at Monroe early in the game and it's part of the reason the Suns were out of it early. The Suns are almost certainly going to be trading him or buying him out at some point because of his expiring contract and maybe this will help them move that along faster than expected.

Clint Capela: This stat line doesn't do him justice as he dominated the paint and killed the Suns with his high screening.

Behind Monroe's empty stats, there's only sorrow and despair. Average bigs like Clint Capela could toy with such a shit big, no biggie.

Dunno why but I feel like Monroe reminds me of Andray Blatche in some ways.

What got the Suns in the hole was the Rockets hitting a barrage of three's where Capela wasn't even involved. Harden just dribbling up to his guy and jacking a three, Ryan Anderson not even coming off screens, firing from deep. Capela didn't outplay Monroe in this game. The Rockets were 7-11 threes in the first quarter.

Monroe is not a "shitty big", to say so is ignorant. Are you going to ignore not only his advanced defensive and rebounding stats from last year, and his raw stats even at the Center position just to keep the "shitty big" mantra going? LOL to Clint Capela "Toying" with Greg Monroe, who dropped 20 and 10 on him on 10-14 shooting. I'll give you some examples of other things you could say other than "Shitty big", that way you sound like you know a little bit more. "He is flat footed, and doesn't seem to move his feet well which may impact how effective he is against small ball lineups". "He is undersized for the Center position, and is not a reliable rim protector". Things like that. While also pointing out his strengths "He can hit the mid range shot, and has good footwork in the post". "He is a good team defender, he has had good steals numbers for a big in his career". "He is better suited with a rim protector around him".

Those are all basketball critiques and praises, as opposed to just saying someone is "Shitty". To say he is "Shitty", is complete ignorant garbage. NBA Teams wouldn't call Greg Monroe "Shitty" either. He was still a big part (Over 22 minutes a game) of what Milwaukee did last season. He is a GOOD player, and in my opinion more suited for the 4 position than the 5 position.

NovU, did you watch the game?

In regards to the Celtics not having that extra gear, what? They literally have showed that through this entire win streak. If any team has that extra gear, it's the Celtics. We are deep this year, it's not just Irving and Horford. Anybody who has watched this team this season knows that they have a chance to come out of the east with the best record, and challenge CLE in the playoffs. How are the Bucks deeper or have "An extra gear" that the Celtics don't have? That makes no sense.

Last edited by Dee4Three on Sat Nov 18, 2017 7:53 am, edited 1 time in total.

Monroe is crap on defense so i guess he's right up the sun's alley for the their tank

You betcha.

The Rockets went right at Monroe early in the game and it's part of the reason the Suns were out of it early. The Suns are almost certainly going to be trading him or buying him out at some point because of his expiring contract and maybe this will help them move that along faster than expected.

Clint Capela: This stat line doesn't do him justice as he dominated the paint and killed the Suns with his high screening.

Behind Monroe's empty stats, there's only sorrow and despair. Average bigs like Clint Capela could toy with such a shit big, no biggie.

Dunno why but I feel like Monroe reminds me of Andray Blatche in some ways.

i think houston's offense did play a part in this but really. i'm not going to go over game film but he was bad in pick and roll, poor in contesting drives, slow & poor on close outs to the perimeter player. where can you play him? maybe on another team he'll look better on defense. early returns- crap on defense

I agree that he was slow on the pick n rolls, and he's not a rim protector so he struggles on drives. It was his first game back, so I am wondering if he will get a bit quicker as the season goes on. And again, I don't think he's suited to play the 5. I think he needs a rim protector around him.

He wasn't stellar on Defense, I wouldn't say he was even good on defense. I am saying he isn't a shit big, and I am saying that the first quarter was the result of a 3 point barrage mostly. I don't think Capela necessarily outplayed Monroe in this game, either.

I talked with a couple people at work today about Greg Monroe (one watched the game and one didn't, both watch a lot of basketball). And they believe that he is a good player as well, that he can do a lot of positive things for a team, but that indeed him not being a rim protector makes it tough for him to play the 5 (Even though he has put up good numbers in that position in the past, and I shared some of them above).

To say point blank he is a "shit big", is ignorant.

I, like Jay Triano, thought he had a solid debut in this game.

Greg Monroe Gets Double-Double vs Rockets

The Suns traded for Greg Monroe on November 7, but the center hadn’t played yet due to a calf injury. That changed on Thursday as Monroe not only suited up, but was placed in the Suns starting lineup against the Rockets.

The game against may not have gone the Suns way, but that did not stop Monroe from having an impressive debut. The big man finished with 20 points on 71 percent from the field to go along with his 11 rebounds.

“The only guy in our lineup with four years of experience, and he just knows how to play the game and lets the game come to him,” Head Coach Jay Triano said. “He wasn’t overpowering in any way, but he was very solid, very solid.”

Stan Van Gundy would also welcome him back to Detroit, and his improved defense last season with the Bucks was noticed.

http://www.freep.com/story/sports/nba/pistons/2017/11/15/detroit-pistons-greg-monroe/859633001/

He has always been a skilled offensive threat, but there are defensive concerns.

But he addressed those concerns as the hub of the second unit in the Bucks’ playoff push last season.

Those are two reasons Pistons coach Stan Van Gundy wouldn’t mind coaching Monroe again.

fr do you guys think Cavs will be able to beat Celtics in the ECF? Even with Isaiah Thomas, I don't see this team beating the young Celtics team.

Team that have better chance at beating the Cavs imho are the Bucks.

Celtics are more like the Raptors. You can win regular season games but when you need to turn it on, they don't have that extra gear. Your top players matter especially 1 to 4th best guys. Lowry and DeRozan would get mauled in the PO, Horford and Kyrie, you can expect just about the same.

a bit premature to ask regarding the Cavs. i don't know if Crowder is butt hurt for being traded to the team that knocked his former team 2yrs straight. guy's gotta start playing. and of course have to see how IT fits in

i was thinking the bucks too before the bledsoe trade. now i think with him and the eventual return of Parker... they along with the Wiz are very strong contenders to take out the cavs. and the celts too of course

Probably old news but "Players Only" on NBA TV is going to transition to TNT in January as their already had been announced extra game a week.

I've created a running subplot in my head that nobody likes Dennis Scott which is why he's the only one sent everywhere while they stay in the studio.

For those unaware:
It's the show Chris Webber hosts (should have never been cast off for Shaq!) with the rest of the former player NBA 2K commentators except Clark Kellog. Greg Anthony and Steve Smith usually do commentary (sometimes Brent Barry), and Isiah and McHale are the Kenny and Chuck old timers. I actually kinda like it, would like it more without Greg Anthony but someone has to do the play-by-play I guess, speaking of running subplots I have this one where everyone tunes him out when he starts talking as if he was ever on any of those guys level. Webber straight up ignored some dumb ramble he went on last week to ask Isiah Thomas basically the same topic, and Isiah being the point guard always tries to involve McHale and others in his answers. He's so much better and involved than he was a decade ago.

Also Webber will straight up 1980s fan geek out on McHale and especially Isiah a lot which is adorable.

Speaking of PLAYERS ONLY broadcast stuff, KG is getting better at hosting Area 21 and cutting back on the shoutouts to literally anything mentioned. I feel like Sheed needs to be his permanent side kick though. (And always always dressed like a bum.) And also get his ass in the 2K games already.

And while I'm on the topic of halftime/pregame/postgame duders, ESPN has really improved this year when they use Billups, McGrady and Pierce joining Jalen with just the chick who actually isn't annoying and seems to know what she's doing as a host. Who would have thought that dumping columnists or crappy coaches for former star players and just letting them talk would work so well! Now if only they could get rid of Wilbon somehow. Even Scottie Pippen would be better despite the fact that he looks like he just wandered in off the street half the time and I'm convinced he's spent months trying to troll both Jalen and McGrady at times on various topics.

Greg Anthony's play-by-play is pretty weak, but I'm generally a fan of the concept otherwise.

Probably old news but "Players Only" on NBA TV is going to transition to TNT in January as their already had been announced extra game a week.

I've created a running subplot in my head that nobody likes Dennis Scott which is why he's the only one sent everywhere while they stay in the studio.

For those unaware:
It's the show Chris Webber hosts (should have never been cast off for Shaq!) with the rest of the former player NBA 2K commentators except Clark Kellog. Greg Anthony and Steve Smith usually do commentary (sometimes Brent Barry), and Isiah and McHale are the Kenny and Chuck old timers. I actually kinda like it, would like it more without Greg Anthony but someone has to do the play-by-play I guess, speaking of running subplots I have this one where everyone tunes him out when he starts talking as if he was ever on any of those guys level. Webber straight up ignored some dumb ramble he went on last week to ask Isiah Thomas basically the same topic, and Isiah being the point guard always tries to involve McHale and others in his answers. He's so much better and involved than he was a decade ago.

Fuck McHale.
NBA TV dumped the super team of Chris Webber & Gary Payton when they hired McHale. CWebb and the Glove were must-see TV.

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I liked the Webber-Payton combo. Without Webber, Payton rambles like a drunk. Without Payton, Webber has opinions that are ESPN Magic Johnson level. Together they both keep each other in check.

where can you play him? maybe on another team he'll look better on defense. early returns- crap on defense

That is really the million dollar question. He is such a shit big, it's tough to play him at 5 and neither alongside great defensive minded center like Drummond as their pairing literally produced shit result. Not sure where he would be a good fit, how do you build a winning squad with him? Perhaps a really really tough task if he was to play a heavy heavy role.

a bit premature to ask regarding the Cavs. i don't know if Crowder is butt hurt for being traded to the team that knocked his former team 2yrs straight. guy's gotta start playing. and of course have to see how IT fits in

i was thinking the bucks too before the bledsoe trade. now i think with him and the eventual return of Parker... they along with the Wiz are very strong contenders to take out the cavs. and the celts too of course

I think the real issue for the Cavs is the motivation. This is no Spurs who are actually significantly worse this year. Cavs are perhaps having Finals hangover, they have made it every year and LBJ has made longest consecutive Finals appearance. Boredom is actually what it is, deluded Celtics fans are jokes these days.

[Dee4Three]

Holy shit. You are getting worse somehow.

The Cavs are bored with finals hangover? Thats the reason they are not doing as well so far? You mean because LeBron is doing what he normally does, and so is Love, are the new players on the Cavs roster bored with finals hangover???... even though they don't have it? Injuries couldn't be a part of it could they? Or the fact that they do miss having Irving as a go to in the lineup? The fact that they literally lost a 25 PPG producer via trade? It's so many things, and they are still 9 and 7. The Cavs DID get worse, not only because of not being healthy, but being a one dimensional basketball team. They have a lot of one dimensional players who are not great defenders. This has NOTHING to do with finals hangover.

Holy. Shit.

You know why the Spurs are 10-6, good for 4th in the Western Conference without Parker, Leonard and Simmons (now with Orlando)? Because they have a great, legendary coach who gets the best out of his players night in and night out. Popovich is letting Aldridge be Aldridge, and Rudy Gay be Rudy Gay, while getting the best out of Mills and Danny Green. Lue/LeBron combo leadership may also be a problem, and them knowing LeBron may have one foot out the door could also be a factor.

NovU, are all the possible reasons above good examples of why the Cavs are having a bit of a slower start, or are they just "Semantics" as you stated when you claimed the Grizzlies were your home team while Abdur-Rahim was playing, and that he NEVER played SF, and that I was very wrong, only to be proven 100% wrong because he played SF all his years with the Grizzlies, then you cried "semantics".

I agree with Sauru, NovU is either 15 and lying about his age, or a very insecure adult or one that never grew up. He is clueless about basketball. He is so simple minded when it comes to his dialogue about basketball, it's as simple as it gets. It's "he's shit", or "fuck him". Dude has issues.

Talk around me all you want man, but you just continue to show that you have no clue what you are talking about. And each time you do, I will call you out. It's much deserved after the shit I've had to put up with from you in here.

Every time you say Monroe is a shit big, you sound even more like an idiot who knows nothing about the game.

Oh and FYI, deluded Celtics fans? I KNOW we are overachieving at the moment. Some of this is absolutely sustainable, but not all of it. However, you are the same moron who said they would be a mere .500 ball club by Seasons end, which no person who has actually watched them this season would say that, or anybody that knows a lick about basketball. The same person who said they couldn't push it to the extra gear, when that's literally what makes this team so successful to this point.

NovU. You amaze me.

Last edited by Dee4Three on Sun Nov 19, 2017 6:53 am, edited 6 times in total.

[Dee4Three]

For those of you who watched some of the games last night.

Kuzma's offensive game (much like Tatum) is very mature for a rookie. Not only does he have the confidence, but he picks his spots wisely on most occasions. I love his attacking mindset, he has no fear. It was sort of a dual in the second half between Kuzma and Booker, pretty fun to watch. Two teams with some decent young talent.

Booker is so crafty, he can hit from anywhere on the floor as well. Josh Jackson needs to improve his outside shot, and I think he will. He needs to reel himself in sometimes when he's attacking. He looks out of control and the results sometimes reflect that. I think in time he will be a very solid NBA player, I love his defensive intensity. Ball played his usual non aggressive basketball offensively, defensively he was scored on 3 times in the second half by the same 5'9" Tyler Ulis move (put his body into Ball and proceeded with a step back floater/shot). Balls defense leaves a lot to be desired so far this season, he needs to get stronger and move his feet better laterally.

Watching the Bulls game, Dunn certainly looked the best I've seen him. He was hounding on defense, and doing a good job offensively of creating for himself. He's been showing sparks of what so many liked about him coming out of Providence. At this point, I think the Bulls should start him, give him the keys and grow with him playing bigger minutes on the floor. I think he is far from hitting his ceiling.

Tough loss for the Hornets, honeymoon stage is over for Howard, and his production is waning. I didn't see that team being 5-10 in the first 15 games. The team depends so much on Kemba, he can't do it all.

Rondos debut included typically decent stats, followed by bad defense (himself and the team as a whole) that was a part of the onslaught the Nuggets put on. Not sure anybody saw the Pelicans being ripped to shreds by the Nuggets, not by that much. Granted, Davis went down at the beginning of the third with a concussion, but that doesn't give them an excuse to allow 82 points in the second half. Not only that, they allowed almost 40 points in the 1st quarter with Davis on the floor.
Makes you wonder what will happen if the Pelicans stay this inconsistent, who gets moved and when. Or, if indeed we will see another coaching change. I never liked Alvin Gentry, so I wouldn't be opposed to a coaching change. Look what it did for the Suns, it breathed new life into that young team.

Last edited by Dee4Three on Sun Nov 19, 2017 6:55 am, edited 1 time in total.

As good as the Celtics are doing, imagine adding Hayward to the team lol

As good as the Celtics are doing, imagine adding Hayward to the team lol

Celtics look deep as it is because Brad uses his pieces wisely. But yeah, imagine adding Hayward with his ability to impact the game in so many ways. He would fit in so well with what the Celtics already have. He would also be another guy that can guard positions 1 through 4 or even 1 through 5 when teams went small. He would make the Celtics even more versatile.

Not just saying this as a Celtics fan, but the Celtics will be scary for years to come barring anymore serious injuries.

However, I think that you would agree that there is a silver lining to him going down. It has really helped accelerate the growth for both Brown and Tatum, and maybe even guys like Semi. It may be a blessing in disguise, the confidence that Tatum and Brown have is at an all time high.

where can you play him? maybe on another team he'll look better on defense. early returns- crap on defense

That is really the million dollar question. He is such a shit big, it's tough to play him at 5 and neither alongside great defensive minded center like Drummond as their pairing literally produced shit result. Not sure where he would be a good fit, how do you build a winning squad with him? Perhaps a really really tough task if he was to play a heavy heavy role.

ah yes. good point about him with drummond. already forgot about that. i do have doubts if he can guard in space and against modern day 4''s. imagine him having to guard kuzma

I think the real issue for the Cavs is the motivation. This is no Spurs who are actually significantly worse this year. Cavs are perhaps having Finals hangover, they have made it every year and LBJ has made longest consecutive Finals appearance. Boredom is actually what it is, deluded Celtics fans are jokes these days.

i think its part of it... they don't put much significance in the regular season. the nba season is too long and the road through the EAST is easier than the WEST. iirc they did finish one month under .500 and still went to the finals without homecourt. this isn't an unfamiliar theme. we've seen this before with the perennial finals teams iE jordan bulls and shaq-kobe lakers. the vets complain about the regular season, coast a bit, then get their ish together.

it's a little different now for their Cavs as their minutes eaters are hurt (or cut), new players to fit in, and of course the irving replacement is hurt. but hey look at the cavs record against the traditionally strong teams in the East.

So Mavs would rather play Majiri than Nerlens Noel who was in rumours in the past both with Mavs and 76ers for potentially signing max contract. This should really frustrate Noel as he was gunning for max again in next offseason. Perhaps trade coming?

ah yes. good point about him with drummond. already forgot about that. i do have doubts if he can guard in space and against modern day 4''s. imagine him having to guard kuzma

Yeah.

Issue really with players like Monroe imho is that they don't block or hinder shots enough, which are the most called upon skillset for a 5 in today's 1+4 era. Opponent's entire game plan could change just because of it, but he is not anything of that caliber. Monroe never averaged anything closed to 1 block per game even when he was getting minutes.

Neither he qualifies well enough to be a nice 4 in today's ball game. He's kinda tweener between traditional and modern era PF with not enough perks to offer.

Scoring little above avg level is what he does really bring to the table but finding scoring talent is not a tough task in today's league and in team-oriented offensive schemes, you have little means to adjust your game plan so Monroe could get his touches to produce scoring.

BETTER!!! NICE JOB!.

Explained something with more depth. Instead of saying he was just "shit".

I agree that the guarding of quick 4s is the question with Monroe. I think his game isn't as much suited for that because of his foot speed. So it's settle being a Center (efficient like he was with the Bucks last year), or be a 4 in situational lineups against certain teams that have players at his position that couldn't blow by him speed wise.

While a talented player, he needs to find a team that can use him like the Bucks did last year, otherwise he may be a niche player on a team like Powe was for the Celtics in 07-08 (being able to come in and play the 4 or 5 depending on the team being player or situation).

So the Sixers scored 47 points against the Warriors in the first quarter and led by 22 at half time, but then failed to show up in the second half.

Golden State outscored them 47-15 in the third quarter. Ouch

A textbook demonstration of the old adages about playing the full 48 minutes, and not counting out great teams while there's still ample time on the clock. Tough loss for a young Sixers team, but also a bit of a learning experience.

So Mavs would rather play Majiri than Nerlens Noel who was in rumours in the past both with Mavs and 76ers for potentially signing max contract. This should really frustrate Noel as he was gunning for max again in next offseason. Perhaps trade coming?

sad really. old man Dirk having the farewell tour. you figured Noel would be a good fit but it's the 31yr old making those hustle plays instead. noel for okafor

i thought Dallas would be more competitive than this.

He's kinda tweener between traditional and modern era PF with not enough perks to offer..

ahem. its an AB discussion but i'm going to C myself out of the it LMAO

Okafor > Noel in the modern NBA
Who needs defense when Rockets be scoring 90 points in the first half

A textbook demonstration of the old adages about playing the full 48 minutes, and not counting out great teams while there's still ample time on the clock. Tough loss for a young Sixers team, but also a bit of a learning experience.

Curry made the Simmons & the Process duo look mortal. dude put a on show