NBA Live 08 - Back from the Dead

Talk about NBA Live 08 here.

NBA Live 08 - Back from the Dead

Postby BodyBump on Wed Jul 18, 2007 5:40 pm

NBA Live 08 - This Year's Sleeper Pick?
Jul 17, 2007 2:16pm - Author: Shanker Srinivasan

Prior to E3, I wrote a piece on what NBA Live needed to do in order to compete with NBA 2K. Since moving to the next-gen systems, EA has not had an answer for 2K’s basketball sim… and it hasn’t even been close. While last year’s version was an improvement, even if only because of the inclusion of a dynasty mode, NBA Live has suffered from serious gameplay issues that are highlighted further because of the presence of 2K’s title.

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Alright, that’s a bold statement considering 2K hasn’t released any information about NBA 2K8, but that is a testament to how impressed I was with Live’s transformation from a year ago. And, before anyone pegs me as a NBA Live pusher, let me just point out two things: 1) I have been very critical of NBA Live in the past and 2) NBA Live has been so terrible as of late that pushers for this franchise don’t even exist anymore.

In my earlier article, I highlighted 3 specific rules that NBA Live 08 would need to adhere to in order to be successful…

Rule 1: Fix existing errors before implementing new features

Camera Angle
I am happy to know I wasn’t the only one who hated the baseline camera angle from Live 07. I just found the turnovers to be annoying and slightly disorienting since the camera had to rotate all the way around quickly. Thankfully it was replaced with the broadcast camera similar to 2K.

Choppy Animations
An issue in both of NBA Live’s earlier releases, this was clearly a focal point this year. Obviously everyone expects the game to look better, but 60 fps does make a tremendous difference. There was only one graphical hiccup I noticed during my game (the lack of a realistic pass stealing animation) and nothing that appeared blatantly insensitive to the laws of physics. Even with the new Quick-Strike system that allows players to prematurely end animations, you will be hard pressed to notice graphical flaws.

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Collision Detection

Lots of sports games have had problems with this but NBA Live was definitely the poster child for collision issues. In the past, it didn’t matter what was in between a player and the basket; once the driving animation began, the resulting dunk was a foregone conclusion. Live’s new collision system is one of the most impressive features I’ve seen in some time. Not only does the collision system fuel the post game and influence rebounding, but players react differently depending on who they are (ie. Lebron James’ collision animations are uniquely his). I didn’t get a chance to determine if the animations differ depending on who the defender is (as EA claims) and I only had a chance to play as the Cavs, but this thing could be the shizznit.

Rule 2: Graphical improvements should take a backseat to gameplay and controls

Own the Paint

This is one feature that I thought would be critical if NBA Live was going to be a success. A basketball simulation must have a realistic post game. To that end, NBA Live has done a better job than any other title to date. There are between 50-60 different low-post animations; the one you get is probably determined by position to the hoop and who the player is. The best part of this feature is that, even with the variety of moves and fakes, it is defensible. There is no hop-step button that will automatically allow you get behind an opponent and there isn’t a fast animation that puts the defender at a disadvantage. Again, I only played one game so there may be cheese techniques that I haven’t seen. From what I did see though, the low post game is actually a fun and rewarding experience (and that’s saying a lot).

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Smart AI

Another strength of NBA Live 08. The first thing I noticed was the auto double-teaming. It is done at appropriate times as you would see in an NBA game though I’m sure there are settings that let you change how often or from how far out the double-team comes. I am uncertain though if they collapse on star players more often than others (mostly because Lebron was always handling the ball and always drew some help defense). Either way, while dribble penetration isn’t impossible, it’s definitely not as simple as in years past. The AI will also take charges; I only saw one during the game (called on Tony Parker drive), but it seemed like a reasonable call.

Perimeter Shooting

This was supposed to have improved in NBA Live 08 but I still found it a bit disappointing. The problem isn’t so much with the shooting, which has now been normalized to some degree with the inclusion of Hot Spots; the problem is defending it. Even when a defender is directly in the face of a shooter, unless you specifically put your hands up, the shooter has a great chance of nailing the shot, even from 18-20 feet out. I’m not expecting to reject any shots, but I do assume that having a defender that close to a shooter will have some impact on his accuracy. EA should have made putting your arms up on a shot automatic. Even so, with reliable shooting from outside, maybe this will help dissuade the constant dribble penetration found in earlier versions.

Rule 3: The more realistic the game, the better

Rebounding

I have read that this was an issue in the past as well. Supposedly, in prior versions, only the player most likely to pull down the board would even jump. And, supposedly, in NBA Live 08 that has been improved but I didn’t really notice. I did notice the box-out animations but I didn’t see any over the back fouls called or any tip-out or saving-the-ball animations that you would normally see during an NBA game. You wouldn't think that these would be that difficult to add. Speaking of missing animations, will anyone ever put in a tie-up animation?

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Go-To Moves

I will admit that I was wrong about this feature. I initially described it as a “more selective version Signature Style found in the 2K series.” While it is true that the feature only applies to better known players of the NBA, it does not only apply to perimeter shooting. Players like Kobe Bryant and Dwayne Wade have multiple go-to moves depending on the situation. In a way, this feature is stronger than 2K’s because you won’t have to learn the shooting animations of every obscure player in the NBA, only those of your stars. My reaction after Lebron threw down one of his vintage jams would have been enough to convince you how cool this is.

Overall, the improvement from last year is simply staggering. EA has really done some good work to create a more sim-style experience. Two of their highlighted features: Own the Paint and Quick-Strike specifically address the issue of a balanced offense; dribble penetration, perimeter shooting, and the post game are now all viable and possibly necessary methods to win. While it would be premature for me to hand the title to NBA Live 08 (since we haven’t even seen NBA 2K8 yet and because they usually dominate this sport), I do think that 2K Sports should be very worried.


Source: SportsGamer
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Postby Sauru on Wed Jul 18, 2007 8:50 pm

that second pic looks like crap, though it does make me laugh
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Postby Jing on Wed Jul 18, 2007 11:37 pm

Fairly nice read man. Very nice analysis and presentation. The pics were pretty damn pleasing as well.
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Postby ThaLiveKing on Thu Jul 19, 2007 12:50 am

Nyce article. . ..I'm looking forward to Live this year


/ I wonder what 2k has up it's sleeve
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Postby buzzy on Thu Jul 19, 2007 12:51 am

Look at Gasol's shorts :shock: like a skirt, two legs would fit too

Anyway, nice read
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Postby Anthony15 on Thu Jul 19, 2007 5:38 am

Jing wrote:The pics were pretty damn pleasing as well.


Courts and the upper part of the body looks fine. Legs, shorts/mini skirts along with funny looking socks looks like they need big fixing. Thanks for the read.
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Postby mrMiyagi on Thu Jul 19, 2007 8:03 am

Man I hope they get a fix in for rebounding.

Here's where we sit in rebounding with 07:

1. There is a controller bug where it sometimes doesnt even recognize the jump button being pressed.

2. Shooters DO NOT FOLLOW THEIR SHOTS. They will turn around and run back on defense no matter if the shot went in or not.

3. Players do not crash the boards. If you're lucky ONE of the forwards might go for the rebound.

4. Centers setup way too often OUTSIDE the 3pt arc, making offensive rebounds by them impossible.

5. Sometimes players randomly jump about 1 inch off the ground instead of the usual jumping height making the rebound impossible.

6. Sometimes they jump towards the ball, sometimes they jump straight up in the air. Sometimes they are running forwards and jump backwards... it's totally random which way your player will jump, and totally annoying.


--

I hope these are fixed.
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Postby Jugs on Thu Jul 19, 2007 5:13 pm

lol @ webster backing down gasol
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Postby king2k on Fri Jul 20, 2007 12:52 pm

ThaLiveKing wrote:Nyce article. . ..I'm looking forward to Live this year


/ I wonder what 2k has up it's sleeve


Hello, ThatLiveKing, I'm king2k :D

Well, wonder no more lest your heart stop. It pains to accept reality.
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Postby Lean on Sat Jul 21, 2007 1:33 am

:lol: at Gasol's thigh.
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Postby 06woz on Sat Jul 21, 2007 2:34 am

most guards wont follow there shots anyways. Its a gameplan to get back on D. If you watch a game you will see players shoot and watch the shot. They won't go sprinting in after it.
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Postby Sauru on Sat Jul 21, 2007 4:10 am

only way a guard runs in after his own shot is if there is a clear lane and he knows he is gonna get it otherwise it puts his team at a major disadvantage. i always found it odd that in school coaches would yell "follow your own shot" when that really only should apply if you are downlow.
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Postby cheater1034 on Sat Jul 21, 2007 4:26 am

If live 08 fixes the shorts/thighs problem :lol: and the interior defense, then this game will be much better than nba 2k8.

So far from the videos the AI is much improved over last years, the animations are 10x better, overall the gameplay sounds amazing to me from what we've seen and heard.

Also some of these things like dunking inside out, that it looks like EA fixed, 2k7 had the same problem except worse it just wasn't talked about? EA fixed that too it appears though.

But the gameplay of live 08 looks much improved, the quick strike ball handling is nice addition, shooting animations are nice to have actually good unlike live 07, and passing is better than live 07 as it appears.

Gameplay on live 07 next gen wasn't all that bad compared to current gen, but it was still bad but it appeared easily fixable to get on 2k's level.

My verdict, nba live 08 will be better than nba 2k8 gameplay wise, and although nba 2k8 will have their new graphics engine as seen on nhl 2k8, nba live 08 will have better graphics than 2k8 (but graphics aren't everything!)

I'm excited for this, I'm getting the xbox 360 any day now (I'm going to sell it though), and I'll get my ps3 in like a week (I'm keeping this one though)

I'll only use my ps3 for multimedia like bd-ray (hd movie playback), dvd, music, web browsing, etc, and the most important thing I'm going to use it for is of course, NBA live 08! (I'll rent both games though and buy whichever one is better)
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Postby 617KiD on Sat Jul 21, 2007 6:58 am

Sauru wrote:only way a guard runs in after his own shot is if there is a clear lane and he knows he is gonna get it otherwise it puts his team at a major disadvantage. i always found it odd that in school coaches would yell "follow your own shot" when that really only should apply if you are downlow.


I know that always made me mad when my coach yelled "FOLLOW YOUR SHOT", but when i did and didn't get the rebound, he would be mad cuz i didn't get back on the break.. :?:

BAD COACH..lol
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Postby Sauru on Sat Jul 21, 2007 9:19 am

yeah i know, whenever i shoot, even in pickup games i run backwards after the shot. if it was a 3 ball i am at half court before either team even gets the rebound and if its my team i come back up.

i played in a league once where i was always the only guy back on a break. near the end of the season i would be back there alone vs 4 guys and i would just walk out of bound and let them do thier thing to try and prove a point. the point was my team sucked ass and we went 0-12 for the season lol. umm, i didnt play for them again
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Postby The X on Sat Jul 21, 2007 12:47 pm

following your own shot is fundamentally good advice, unless you are say the PG & your 4 teammates are between you & the basket, then you should be getting back on D....I'd say following your own shot can result in you getting 20-25% of your missed shots back....but a real shooter knows when to follow their shot & not, as they know the moment after they shoot it whether it's going to go in or miss & where the rebound is going....the reason why they tell you to follow your shot is that is that a shooter generally has the best idea of where the rebound is going....of course I'm talking from a SF perspective which I am, not a guard perspective....I don't tend to have to worry as much about the fastbreak as much as say the guards....
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Postby Sauru on Sat Jul 21, 2007 1:11 pm

yeah i guess its different for me as i have always played the point my entire life
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Postby The X on Sat Jul 21, 2007 2:13 pm

Sauru wrote:yeah i guess its different for me as i have always played the point my entire life

yep, I guess that was the exception that I was talking about....either way, it's a team effort getting back in transition defence, not just on the PG....
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Postby Sauru on Sat Jul 21, 2007 8:13 pm

yeah it never helped much when i was back there alone, standing all of 5 foot 8, with 3-4 guys,2 of which are 6 feet or more, running at me lol
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