I love nbalive05 edition but check this IF it's a THREATH...

[Colin]

I would say I am a Live Boy. Even if I only am because I don't have/want a console (except for an N64 and that James Bond game, that's the shit.) But I can see problems in both game's screens. ESPN seems to have paid more attention to any area of the player that is skin then Live and it does look better. The only problem there is their hands (especially K-mart) look like they've been wrapped in saran wrap. The jerseys would be pretty bad if they didn't have a Jowe-like texture. The arenas also seem very small. In those screens with Shaq the Miami arena looked to have only 16-17 rows. I was there, there's something like 24. Last year NBA Live was the opposite and the arenas were huge and the spectators were very far apart.

NBA Live doesn't have any specific problems IMO. The faces and whatnot are all a step below ESPN, and everything else is either equal or a step above. It also seems that the NBA Live screenshots aren't very good quality for some reason.

[John-John Joe]

anyone that argues that madden is not the best sports game available year in and year out is an idiot and should have no right posting anything anywhere. madden sets the bar every year for all the other sports games to try and reach.

Hi Sauru! I agree that Madden is the best. But you can't be so closed minded to say that whomever doesn't agree with us is an idiot. There are alot of Sega fans out there and they are growing in large numbers seemingly everyday........

Point is, if you're a PC gamer then this conversation isn't applicable. You'll pick EA by default. If you're a console gamer like yours truly then you have a few more options where basketball games are concerned. I can't call a Sega fan an idiot because he like something different, he's an idiot if he doesn't explore all his options.........

[GloveGuy]

anyone that argues that madden is not the best sports game available year in and year out is an idiot and should have no right posting anything anywhere. madden sets the bar every year for all the other sports games to try and reach.

Whoa, you better watch it there buddy. The ESPN fan base is growing rapidly this year. Sales are doing great, and I've even heard it's been selling better than Madden. I played Madden 2005 and it just didn't do it for me -- not like ESPN does. In my opinion, the visuals aren't even close and ESPN gameplay just doesn't fit my style. You can say all you want about Owner Mode, but I could really care less about deciding how much hot dogs cost at the stadium. Plus, ESPN's Sportscenter presentation with Chris Berman is fantastic. But that's just my opinion.

DRESPN, hit it right on the dot. People just have their preferences. I've settled down with Sega, and unless it's totally lobsided this year, I'll most definitely buy ESPN NBA 2K5. The thing that I just don't like is sales have been showing EA games outselling Sega games so much over the years. I get the feeling that some people just buy EA games for the name and the eye candy even during years where Sega is arguably better.

Also, the graphical "problems" that you guys point out are way to miniscule to even judge a game on. It's not as if you'll be noticing them as you play. In my opinion, ESPN's are just more crisp and clearer.

[ludacris06]

Rival titles will always appear to threaten each other with new features to gamers who hover between the two, but hardcore fans will almost always stick to the product they are familiar with. That's not a slight against anyone; people who simply prefer one title over the other aren't likely to give up on their favourite game.

Well put.

VC experiments too much with their basketball game and hopefully 2k5 isnt another one of their experiments. NBA Live 2005 sounds like they have the PERFECT gameplay in addition to the great graphics and features they have.

How can you possibly go wrong with NBA Live '05?

[Point God]

How can you possibly go wrong with NBA Live '05?

Thats what alot of people were saying last year about 2004(...before it came out).

[John-John Joe]

How can you possibly go wrong with NBA Live '05?

Thats what alot of people were saying last year about 2004(...before it came out).

True. But c'mon, what gamer is ever 100 % satisfied with their favorite product? I'm sure at least one week after the release of Live 2005 you'll start to see cats making threads complaining about every number of issues.......

What it all boils down to is the fact that you're either a "Live Guy" or a "2K Guy", period. There's enough room for all of us to live.........

[Jing]

the messed up rim (where it literally bends when you dunk), its too thin. the players look like they've been rolling in grease, so shiny. when the game ends or something, the players just drop dead, and stop moving, standing there like idiots. and when you are shooting a three or something, and the horn sounds, you still go through your motion, but the ball drops out magically, its one of the most annoying things to me. and maybe also cause AI has been on the cover forever, and they need someone new (unless he's on for life).

live will always be better because they are a longer franchise, they are on every console (PC makes it even better because of patching). live is gonna rock, simple as that

[GloveGuy]

the players look like they've been rolling in grease, so shiny.

That's usually what you look like when you're sweating. That's why the players look so shiny.

live will always be better because they are a longer franchise, they are on every console (PC makes it even better because of patching). live is gonna rock, simple as that

That's why it sells better. EA games have always sold better because their fan base has been around for a longer time. It will probably always sell better regardless of what the reviews say(and the reviews have been going to ESPN every year). Just because the name "Live" has been around longer than the name "NBA 2K", doesn't automatically mean it's going to be better. But maybe you're just one of those people who buy's a game simply for it's name.

[PinoyIDOL]

THE BALL IS PERFECT:





I am not a sega fan. In fact i will buy LIVE05 first. Just want u guys to appreciate both ESPN & EA's improvement this year because in the end it will not be a loss in our part but a BIG WIN for having great basketball video games soon...

The entry & partnership of TAKE-2 (maker of Grand Theft**) to espn will make this game a total awesome game.. If NFL 2K5 was successful in a very low price why NBA 2k5 can't.

MORE POWER TO EASPORTS & VISUAL CONCEPTS!! WE CAN'T WAIT...

[Sauru]

actually the live sales will be better since its a better game. that lame crap 2k series(football and basketball) cant compete with live or madden. they dropped thier game to 20 bucks and i bet you it still gets out sold. cant blame a fan base for that, cause alot of people will see 2 brand new games, 1 being 40/50 and the other being 20 they will just grab the 20.

whenever a real challenger steps up to live or madden people try out the new game and in alot of cases they convert. madden had a challenger way back with gameday. now alot of people jumped shipped to gameday so dont give me that loyalty crap. ofcourse madden came back and detroyed gameday and now sits squarely on top of video game sports. espn came out and challenged live and alot of people got it to see what it was about, and alot of those people just didnt enjoy the game at all, i was one of those people. when espn makes a fun game i will buy it.

[GloveGuy]

I've gone to a couple of video game stores, and I've asked the people there what game has been selling better, ESPN or Madden. They've been saying that ESPN has sold more since both games' release.

On the Madden site it says something like "2.3 million sold" but that's not really true. They've sold that many to the stores, yet a lot of them are still on the shelf rather than at people's homes.

The Sega/EA rivalry story is complicated. EA never released on the Dreamcast, so any sports gamer who bought the system didn't really have a choice, much like PC gamers don't have a choice either. The 2K games were new and they were good.

The competition, in my mind, was never really established until both games were released for the next generation consoles(Sega released their 2K2 games on the Dreamcast first, and on PS2 and Xbox later) in 2003. I didn't think it was really close. NBA 2K3 was far superior to Live 2003. To this day, I still call it the best real simulation basketball game.

Sega received a lot of heat for their 2K4 game, taking a major step backwards in gameplay, while producing a graphically amazing game. I still preferred it over Live, but I cold tell the competition growing closer. I always felt that Live was catching up. That's just always how I thought and I still think that.

Hopefully, like we've seen in football this summer, we can have two great games for the world to enjoy.

[Andrew]

That's a good point. No matter how good the ESPN series may be, I still think some of its popularity is due to the fact it's newer and challenging an existing product. A lot of people love the underdog and they love to see someone new come along and knock off the current "best".

This way of thinking paints the 2K series as new, exciting, and boldly challenging a franchise that is now a decade old. In contrast, the NBA Live series has been dismissed as old, dated, yesterday's news. Now, I certainly didn't think NBA Live 2004 was perfect but I still enjoyed it more than any other game in the series. These days, I think the series gets brushed aside too easily.

ESPN's best points are constantly held up and given much acclaim, while the positive aspects of NBA Live are generally downplayed. That's not to say that ESPN doesn't have any good points or that it isn't a good game, but it is going to look far superior when NBA Live isn't even given a chance to look good.

Also consider some of the gripes about the NBA Live series in recent years. I remember a couple of people making a big fuss back in the days of NBA Live 2002 because on one of the team selection screens the team toggle label read "City", and teams like Golden State and Utah are not sorted by the city they play in. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, but the outrage at such a small detail was a little silly compared to the complaints about more important aspects of the game.

I'm not going to lie about my bias, and if someone asked me which game they should I get I would say that NBA Live is my preference and I would recommend it, but that they should play both before making a decision.

[Sauru]

i will give you this gloveguy. espn has made a big leap towards madden this year. my biggest problem with espn was the player rateings, most are just totally wrong. other than that its a good game specially for 20 bucks. now i would still go with madden myself but like i said, espn did made a huge leap towards madden.

[Alibabafumanchu]

in that dunking pic, all the players are looking at the ball!!!!

I wish Live would do that.

[cocobee]

I've gone to a couple of video game stores, and I've asked the people there what game has been selling better, ESPN or Madden. They've been saying that ESPN has sold more since both games' release.

On the Madden site it says something like "2.3 million sold" but that's not really true. They've sold that many to the stores, yet a lot of them are still on the shelf rather than at people's homes.

2K5 was released what 2 or 3 weeks before Madden. Yet has only managed to sell something like 800,000 copies. (which is still good for them) but Madden, in it's first week alone has sold 1.3 million copies. ESPN is getting better but it will never outsell Madden. I have both and like both. But Madden just has a better "football" feel to it. Why do you think that's why the real players play it. Madden just equals football to me, ESPN is a fun little game--it just doesn't cut it.

The same will happen to the NBA 2k5 series. As wonderful as it may be, Live will out sell it. Just a fact, hopefully I didnt hurt too many people's feelings. If I did, sorry the truth does sting a little.

[GloveGuy]

2K5 was released what 2 or 3 weeks before Madden. Yet has only managed to sell something like 800,000 copies. (which is still good for them) but Madden, in it's first week alone has sold 1.3 million copies. ESPN is getting better but it will never outsell Madden. I have both and like both. But Madden just has a better "football" feel to it. Why do you think that's why the real players play it. Madden just equals football to me, ESPN is a fun little game--it just doesn't cut it.

The same will happen to the NBA 2k5 series. As wonderful as it may be, Live will out sell it. Just a fact, hopefully I didnt hurt too many people's feelings. If I did, sorry the truth does sting a little.

I've already stated that that statistic is false. EA sold 1.3 million copies to video game stores, yet a lot of them are still on the shelf. In fact, the people at the stores were kind of pissed because they have all these copies of Madden, yet not as many people are buying them as they thought.

I've come to grips with the fact that EA has outsoled Sega over the past five years, though I know it's not because of the actual quality of the game. They've just had a bigger fan base for a longer time. On top of that, they add ridiculous eye candy to their games, adding new phrases such as "Freestyle Revolution" and "Hit Stick" every year which attracts gamers.

[Colin]

On top of that, they add ridiculous eye candy to their games, adding new phrases such as "Freestyle Revolution" and "Hit Stick" every year which attracts gamers.[/color]

Maybe those features attract gamers because *gasp* they are very smart and useful. Accusing EA of eye candy as opposed to ESPN is like Pig Miller saying Karl Malone should work out more. Which game added a digital sportscenter with Chris Berman and sideline interviews? Yes ESPN did that. That's 100% eye candy, those things you mentioned may be 10%.

[cocobee]

Who's to actually say what game is better and so forth? I could care less what people play--they could play Shootout for all I care. I just know that EA always outsells ESPN. To me personally, Live does it for me. The patches, rosters, and the community. I've tried to buy into the ESPN hype--but I just can't get into it. Kinda like fat girls, they probably have better personalities and are nicer--but I'm just not attracted to them. So the likely chance of me dating one is very rare and unlikely. But like always, i will try ESPN again this year.

Best of luck to both companies.

[Sauru]

actually espn is the one that tries to win with eye candy not live. live actually adds things and then makes up a name for them, espn does the same thing cept thier stuff aint as fun. live dont outsell espn cause it has a bigger fan base. the second espn starts makeing a better game you will see me and a shit load of other people jump ship. i am loyal to me not no stupid company.

[fgrep15]

Well I'll agree that the "eyecandy" can go both ways, each group tries to add something to attract people, cause that's the whole point isn't it?
In terms of Football, I thought ESPN NFL 2K5 was better than Madden in terms of gameplay, some might say it's harder, but I felt it was easier to control, like QB srambling was just holding the right trigger then releasing when you want to stop scrambling, as opposed to pressing Y (on X-Box) then having to click it back again to go back to not scrambling. The difference is very minimal though because Madden had better defense, but gameplay overall, ESPN by like 0.1.

ESPN NBA has better graphics than Live, you might say they look plastic or shiny, but if you were going to pick out graphical flaws of both, Live would have more graphical flaws than ESPN would. Now the big thing for ESPN is gameplay, we all know that's the most improtant part of sports games. Graphics can only get you so far, because videogames are about enjoying playing not enjoying looking, one reason why I hated the new Doom game, and can enjoy playing some old games as opposed to it.
ESPN hasn't said much about gameplay improvements, and Live has, the gameplay in ESPN last year was not good, Live was better but had many annoyances and some minor things that were killers.
Live has said many of those annoyances will be out, and they aleady had the lead in animations from last year, so till ESPN starts to spit out more who knows?

This is how I felt:

NBA 2K3 > Live 2003
NBA 2K4 < Live 2004

NFL 2K4 = Madden 2004
NFL 2K5 > Madden 2005

[ailive2005]

Check this out, I am not sweating NBA 2k5 graphic's because thats what they showed first for NBA 2k4 and that game sucks. Plus even though they are teamed up with Take 2, take 2 is not gonna stay with them if they can't sell under regular price because no compamy wants to lose money.NFL 2k5 sold over 800 thousand copies, but thats at the price of $20 so if you ask me the did horribly. In just a matter of time, take 2 will end their partener ship with sega, sega will sell VC since it's known that they don't want them anymore, and EA will purchase High Volatage's (inside drive crew) Ai team, and VC's graphics team and then they will be the winner. Being that take 2 is not a sports developer or maybe there just testing the sports water, but if there not sucessful they will not continue with this if it bring thems down. So the safest bet is EA. Even if this doesn't matter to you, EA should be on the top of the list anyway, dunk contest anyone. VC is saving there info because there isn't much for them to say, they will have four tip-off tuesdays, which includes developer interviews that lie to us, and then after the fourth Tip off they will release NBA 2k5 early, to some surprise, to others it will be the same ol' thing. Then some will spend there $20 see some things that are amazing and some things that are pure sega sports which mean half-stepped, half-done, or plain wack in attempt to be urban and cool like EA. So all i'm saying go ahead and drool over the graphics, but when will you guys learn, how many times does it take for VC to do this in order for yall to learn Graphics is all there good at, and unless their on one console(dreamcast anyone) their gameplay will suck.

One holla, at this brooklyn, NY Kid, shouts out to ma$e, welcome back is fire! open your minds!

aiLive2005
Well Said, I know

[Andre]

To those who play ESPN rather than LIVE:
I was one of you. In 2001 and 2002, I simply didn't like LIVE at all, it was boring to death. the NBA 2K series was much more entertaining and the graphic was great (on dreamcast). To me, there WAS no competition: NBA 2K > NBA Live, even if I played LIVE 97,98,99 and 2000. IN other words, I was a loyal LIVE fan who switched to NBA 2K because it was better.

Now, listen up: Things have changed since then. LIVE has improved so much with the 2004 version. It combines the same strong NBA feeling with a funny and realistic gameplay (yes, there are some bugs, but it's still great). So I switched back to LIVE, caz recently it's better game. We don't know about the 2005 versions..none of them are out yet, so the all this discussion is pointless.

My point is, don't stuck to a series just because it's usually better, things changes...as I switched to NBA 2K years ago...I also switched back to LIVE last year....just be open-minded.

[John-John Joe]

Check this out, I am not sweating NBA 2k5 graphic's because thats what they showed first for NBA 2k4 and that game sucks. Plus even though they are teamed up with Take 2, take 2 is not gonna stay with them if they can't sell under regular price because no compamy wants to lose money.NFL 2k5 sold over 800 thousand copies, but thats at the price of $20 so if you ask me the did horribly. In just a matter of time, take 2 will end their partener ship with sega, sega will sell VC since it's known that they don't want them anymore, and EA will purchase High Volatage's (inside drive crew) Ai team, and VC's graphics team and then they will be the winner. Being that take 2 is not a sports developer or maybe there just testing the sports water, but if there not sucessful they will not continue with this if it bring thems down. So the safest bet is EA. Even if this doesn't matter to you, EA should be on the top of the list anyway, dunk contest anyone. VC is saving there info because there isn't much for them to say, they will have four tip-off tuesdays, which includes developer interviews that lie to us, and then after the fourth Tip off they will release NBA 2k5 early, to some surprise, to others it will be the same ol' thing. Then some will spend there $20 see some things that are amazing and some things that are pure sega sports which mean half-stepped, half-done, or plain wack in attempt to be urban and cool like EA. So all i'm saying go ahead and drool over the graphics, but when will you guys learn, how many times does it take for VC to do this in order for yall to learn Graphics is all there good at, and unless their on one console(dreamcast anyone) their gameplay will suck.

One holla, at this brooklyn, NY Kid, shouts out to ma$e, welcome back is fire! open your minds!

aiLive2005
Well Said, I know

Well said, Brooklyn! Holla back at'cha boy man! D amn, everytime I turn around I'm meeting fellow Brooklynites on the web. Since when did thugs start getting on the 'Net?

Anyway, I'm glad to hear that someone is acknowledging High Voltage's amazing job with AI and gameplay. Frankly there's hardly any dribble moves and their graphics look like they came straight from Nintendo 64, but the AI is SOLID. It would be a dream for them to handle EA Canada's AI issues. Inside Drive always gets forgotten when arguing over Live vs the Comp.....

[John-John Joe]

To those who play ESPN rather than LIVE:
I was one of you. In 2001 and 2002, I simply didn't like LIVE at all, it was boring to death. the NBA 2K series was much more entertaining and the graphic was great (on dreamcast). To me, there WAS no competition: NBA 2K > NBA Live, even if I played LIVE 97,98,99 and 2000. IN other words, I was a loyal LIVE fan who switched to NBA 2K because it was better.

Now, listen up: Things have changed since then. LIVE has improved so much with the 2004 version. It combines the same strong NBA feeling with a funny and realistic gameplay (yes, there are some bugs, but it's still great). So I switched back to LIVE, caz recently it's better game. We don't know about the 2005 versions..none of them are out yet, so the all this discussion is pointless.

My point is, don't stuck to a series just because it's usually better, things changes...as I switched to NBA 2K years ago...I also switched back to LIVE last year....just be open-minded.

Wow, wussup Andre! How uncanny that we have not only the same name (Andre, but I go by Dre) but the same exact story when it comes to Live. Anybody who was here on this site way back in 2000 (before all these changes, when the "posting background" was all-black, Tim had just left and Lutz was holding down the fort) will remember me championing the greatness of NBA 2K1. At the time, I had bought Live 2001 and was utterly disgusted with it. 2002 was even worse on the PS2, those two years I became a "2K guy" but alas, I'm back where I belong.........

I agree about staying open-minded, only a fool has options open to them and refuses to at least give them a gander.....Of course, this applies more to us console gamers and not to the PC dudes.....hmm..., wonder if they'll ever come out with the 2K series on the PC? Regardless, 2K's gameplay is trash right now......

[Metsis]

I wonder what kind of a picture would Live series graphics engine pull off, if it was pushed to the maximums. Just add 2000x1600 resolution and do a little brush ups here and there and you have a perfect image straight from the game.

Gaming screens are rarely what we get... No matter what the game. What it looks like in motion is really all the more important. EA gives us video footage and that we can expect from the game...

There are always pictures that look super cool just because they can be made... But no matter how good Big Ben and his hair look on this sweet ass PC screen, it's going to be a total mess with the 640x480 graphics you guys get through the television... And that's the bottom line... Telly just sucks in comparison and the game will never be as sharp as these advertisement pictures.

Pictures are never the total tale... This goes for PC games as well... You can render a picture to look great. Often when something looks to good to be true, it usually is... So don't get carried away with all this picture stuff.

Let's see gameplay vs gameplay videos and judge then...

And Live is still the only way to go as it is the only game coming out on PC.