1970s Post-Merger Era: Possibility or Pipe Dream?

[jfran1524]

The addition of MyNBA Eras in NBA2K23 re-awakened in me a long-dormant love of basketball video gaming. Bugs, flaws, and limitations aside (I acknowledge them and do my best to work within or around them), it is, for my money, the single greatest sports video game addition/mode in my 30+ years of video gaming. Since then, players such as myself have been rabidly speculating on the future of the mode and what new Eras could someday join the game. The additions of the LeBron and Steph Eras in NBA 2K24 and NBA 2K25 focused heavily on recent history, and with such a large gap in time between 2002-03 and 2024-25, it makes sense to add new jumping-on points over the last two decades. I appreciate those additions and have enjoyed playing in those Eras, but old heads and NBA history fanatics such as myself also long for an Eras expansion in the more distant past...

I have seen numerous requests for 60s and 70s Eras. Others wish to someday be able to start from any season in NBA history. Skeptics will counter those wishes with statements such as, "2K will never be able to license enough players to make that a reality" or "2K needs to fix the game before adding any new Eras". I believe both of those arguments have a lot of validity as I often found 2K24 gameplay quite frustrating, but also, I would absolutely love a 1970s Era. I would love to start an Era with the ability to play as prime (or-near prime) versions of Pistol Pete, Rick Barry, Dave Cowens and Jo Jo White, Dr. J, Kareem, Bob McAdoo, etc. How about playing as young versions of Moses, Alex English, or Adrian Dantley? With numerous players from the late 1960s through 1970s already in the game, either on Classic Teams or on the Magic vs. Bird rosters, I decided to see just how feasible a 1970s Era could be.

With 2K24, I was inspired by Pete Toal's knowledge of who is in the game and who is missing, and I began a roster tracking spreadsheet of my own. When 2K25 released last week, one of my first missions was to update this spreadsheet and see how many players were added to/dropped from the game. I reviewed each draft class from 1969 through 2017 based on the updated 2K25 rosters and figured out who is here and who is not. This review did not account for the hidden faces as it was done before The Goods had his weekend steams uncovering the hidden faces (streams in which I played an active part in requesting actual missing faces still in the code, not just throwing names at the wall like many in the chat were). Based on that review, I noticed that 2K's roster depth first started to show in the 1974 draft and again in the 1977 draft moving forward. Here is a breakdown of the 1969 through 1983 NBA drafts showing how many real players from those drafts are included somewhere in the default (i.e., not hidden) 2K25 roster:

1969 - 8 players
1970 - 10 players
1971 - 7 players
1972 - 7 players
1973 - 8 players
1974 - 15 players
1975 - 13 players
1976 - 11 players
1977 - 24 players
1978 - 16 players
1979 - 23 players
1980 - 17 players
1981 - 28 players
1982 - 32 players
1983 - 31 players
*Bonus* 1984 - only 18 players, the lowest amount of any draft between 1981 and 2017

My next step was to review each team's roster in specific seasons to see how many players were already in 2K's roster. As this next process took place after The Goods added the hidden faces - most of the 1970s players with hidden faces were MyTeam exclusives over the last 2-3 years - I decided to include them in my analysis. Given the inherent complications of having a pre-merger Era or an NBA vs ABA Era (e.g. licensing ABA assets) and the strength of the draft classes listed above, I decided to focus on the 1976-77 through 1979-80 seasons as possible starting points for a post-merger Era. For now, I have stopped with the 1979-80 season as it was Magic and Bird's rookie season and felt like a natural beginning of a new Era with enough space before the already-included 1983-84 season. Also, in this analysis, I kept in mind that beginning in 1977, the NBA roster size was 11 players. I know 2K still requires 13-14 players minimum, but my notes will be based on roster sizes of 11 players. Also, I know Eras rosters are based on opening night rosters, but for this exercise, I used the roster pages from Basketball Reference, so I am accounting for all players that played on a given team in each season. I made note of those players who were on multiple teams during a season and did my best to not double count them. If there's a margin of error here, it would at most be 1-2 players total per season.

Based on my review of the CFID list shared last week on the NLSC forum, the following players were on rosters during the 1976-77 season and have hidden faces in game:
- Gus Gerard
- Mike Bantom
- Mike D'Antoni (may be a coach face, not sure on that one)
- George Karl (again, may just be a coach face)
- Paul Silas
- Eric Money
- Ron Boone
- Cazzie Russell
- Kermit Washington
- Slick Watts
- Gar Heard
- Tom Van Arsdale
- Mack Calvin

Below is the total and per-team average number of in-game real players, both in the default roster and hidden faces, for each of the seasons in question. Also included is the roster depth of the default in-game classic Eras:
1976-77 - 109 players; average of 4.95 players per team
1977-78 - 118 players; average of 5.36 players per team
1978-79 - 126 players; average of 5.73 players per team
1979-80 - 139 players; average of 6.32 players per team
1983-84 - 219 players; average of 9.5 players per team
1991-92 - 289 players; average of 10.7 players per team
2002-03 - 327 players; average of 11.3 players per team
2010-11 - 304 players; average of 10.1 players per team
2016-17 - 269 players; average of 9.0 players per team

As you can see, the 1970s are far behind the more modern Eras in terms of player depth, although perhaps not as shallow as some might have expected. By 1979-80, most teams could have a full starting 5 and 1-2 bench players. 2K tends to need a minimum of 6 players in order to add a team; although, I suspect they would not want every team to have so few players. I'm a fan of MJWizards' rosters, and they do a great job of aging-up retired players and including them in the free agent pool for each Era. You could do the same here with players like Jerry West, Oscar Robertson, Don Nelson, Wayne Embry, Jerry Lucas, etc. to add even more real player depth (albeit at the expense of some of the realism) to the rosters.

Also of note: there is a noticeable dip in depth for the LeBron and Curry Eras compared to the Jordan and Kobe Eras, which to me, seems counter-intuitive. Although, I suppose it has been difficult for 2K to license modern players who fell out of the NBA but are not yet ready to sign with the NBRPA. It's also possible they have been lazy on that front, but for the purposes of this post, I will give them the benefit of the doubt.

My next calculation was to see how many additional players would need licensed for each of the 4 years in question to reach higher roster coverage:

1976-77:
- 23 additional players needed for an average roster size of 6 per team
- 45 additional players needed for an average roster size of 7 per team
- 67 additional players needed for an average roster size of 8 per team
- 89 additional players needed for an average roster size of 9 per team
- 111 additional players needed for an average roster size of 10 per team
- 133 additional players needed for an average roster size of 11 per team

1977-78:
- 14 additional players needed for an average roster size of 6 per team
- 36 additional players needed for an average roster size of 7 per team
- 58 additional players needed for an average roster size of 8 per team
- 80 additional players needed for an average roster size of 9 per team
- 102 additional players needed for an average roster size of 10 per team
- 124 additional players needed for an average roster size of 11 per team

1978-79:
- 6 additional players needed for an average roster size of 6 per team
- 28 additional players needed for an average roster size of 7 per team
- 50 additional players needed for an average roster size of 8 per team
- 72 additional players needed for an average roster size of 9 per team
- 94 additional players needed for an average roster size of 10 per team
- 116 additional players needed for an average roster size of 11 per team

1979-80:
- 0 additional players needed for an average roster size of 6 per team
- 15 additional players needed for an average roster size of 7 per team
- 37 additional players needed for an average roster size of 8 per team
- 59 additional players needed for an average roster size of 9 per team
- 81 additional players needed for an average roster size of 10 per team
- 103 additional players needed for an average roster size of 11 per team

Based on this info, do I believe there is a chance of a post-merger 1970s Era being added to a future NBA 2K? I think there is at least a remote chance if it could be accomplished soon. Many of these legends are in or approaching their 80s. Also, we as players of the game would need to accept that the rosters might not be as deep as the other Eras. For me personally, that is something I could easily live with as just playing in the 1970s with some of those legends would be a treat in and of itself. And the depth issues work themselves out over time. With the 50th anniversary of the merger coming up during the 2026-2027 season, perhaps such an Era could be a marquee feature of NBA 2K27. On that note, NBA 2K26 could be a good release to add in a new mid-to-late 90s Era beginning with the 1995-96 season in honor of the 30th anniversary of the 1995 expansion and 1996 draft. Ultimately, this is all speculation and a mental exercise for myself, but hopefully this provides an illustration of just how realistic or unrealistic it would be for 2K to add a 1970s Era. Thanks for reading, and take care.

[jfran1524]

After making this ridiculously long post, I started digging through the MyTeam card catalog looking for MyTeam exclusive players. There's usually a dozen or so each year. This year is different. Way different. I counted almost 170 MyTeam exclusive players, most of whom played in the league between the late 60s and early 80s. A few of these guys are the usual suspects like Kermit Washington and Cazzie Russell. The news here is a treasure trove of 1950s, 1960s, 1970s, and early 1980s players. So many 1970s players, that if they were added to the default rosters, it would completely throw off my calculations above. This is still purely speculation, but based on this info, I think not only is 2K working towards a post-merger Era, but they look to have an eye on the pre-merger NBA as well. Only time will tell, but this is VERY promising to me. It's late, and I've been compiling this list for a few hours now, so there may be a mistake or two, but the full list is below. Notable names include former #1 pick LaRue Martin, Kevin Porter, Al Attles, and some of the 1964-65 Celtics:

Player Name Years Active
Bob Brown 1949-50
Bob Harrison 1950-58
George Dempsey 1955-59
Togo Palazzi 1955-60
Frank Selvy 1955-64
Chuck Noble 1956-62
Bill Thieben 1957-58
Doug Bolstorff 1958
Sam Jones 1958-69
Tommy Kearns 1959
Barney Cable 1959-64
Mike Farmer 1959-66
K.C. Jones 1959-67
Dave Gambee 1959-70
Gene Guarilia 1960-63
Tom Hawkins 1960-69
Dave Budd 1961-65
Al Attles 1961-71
Tom Sanders 1961-73
George Blaney 1962
Sam Stith 1962
Lee Shaffer 1962-64
Gary Phillips 1962-66
Tom Meschery 1962-71
Adrian Smith 1962-72
Ray Scott 1962-72
Kevin Loughery 1963-73
Terry Dischinger 1963-73
Johnny Cox 1963
Gerry Ward 1964-67
Tom Hoover 1964-69
Rod Thorn 1964-71
Tom Thacker 1964-71
Larry Siegfried 1964-72
John Thompson 1965-66
George Wilson 1965-71
Jeff Mullins 1965-76
Mel Counts 1965-76
Wali Jones 1965-76
Jim Washington 1966-76
Dorie Murrey 1967-72
Jerry Chambers 1967-74
Hank Finkel 1967-75
Archie Clark 1967-76
Clyde Lee 1967-76
John Block 1967-76
Matt Guokas 1967-76
Walt Wesley 1967-76
Jim Barnett 1967-77
Cazzie Russell 1967-78
Paul Long 1968-71
Clem Haskins 1968-76
Connie Hawkins 1968-76
John Wetzel 1968-76
Jim Fox 1968-77
Rick Weitzman 1968
Joe Kennedy 1969-71
Gary Gregor 1969-74
Don May 1969-75
Rick Adelman 1969-75
Otto Moore 1969-77
Jim Eakins 1969-78
Ron Boone 1969-81
Bud Ogden 1970-71
Bob Arnzen 1970-74
Lamar Green 1970-75
Rick Roberson 1970-76
Rich Jones 1970-77
Mack Calvin 1970-81
John Vallely 1971-72
Terry Driscoll 1971-75
Paul Ruffner 1971-76
Jim Ard 1971-78
Coby Dietrick 1971-83
Isaiah Wilson 1972-72
Rich Rinaldi 1972-74
Jim McDaniels 1972-78
Mo Layton 1972-78
Curtis Rowe 1972-79
Nate Williams 1972-79
Jim Cleamons 1972-80
Larry Steele 1972-80
John Mengelt 1972-81
Dennis Awtrey 1972-82
John Roche 1972-82
Vic Bartolome 1972
Tom Riker 1973-75
LaRue Martin 1973-76
Ron Riley 1973-76
Travis Grant 1973-76
Bud Stallworth 1973-77
Dwight Davis 1973-77
Charles Dudley 1973-79
Dave Twardzik 1973-80
Brian Taylor 1973-82
Ollie Johnson 1973-82
Kevin Porter 1973-83
Sam Sibert 1973
Luke Witte 1974-76
Mike D'Antoni 1974-77
Ed Ratleff 1974-78
Ernie DiGregorio 1974-78
George Karl 1974-78
Ron Behagen 1974-80
Mike Bantom 1974-82
Dwight Jones 1974-83
Kermit Washington 1974-88
Glenn McDonald 1975-77
Mike Sojourner 1975-77
Al Eberhard 1975-78
Dean Tolson 1975-78
Fred Saunders 1975-78
Gary Brokaw 1975-78
Al Skinner 1975-80
Eric Money 1975-80
Gus Gerard 1975-81
Tom Burleson 1975-81
Tom Henderson 1975-83
Rudy Hackett 1976-77
John Shumate 1976-81
Don Ford 1976-82
John Lambert 1976-82
Larry Wright 1977-82
Paul Griffin 1977-83
Scott May 1977-83
Jacky Dorsey 1978-81
Robert Smith 1978-85
Tom Lagarde 1978-85
Phil Walker 1978
Bob Elliot 1979-81
James Hardy 1979-82
Keith Herron 1979-82
Joel Kramer 1979-83
Hollis Copeland 1980-82
Larry Demic 1980-82
Lawrence Boston 1980
Lee Johnson 1981
Cedrick Hordges 1981-82
Craig Shelton 1981-82
Mike Harper 1981-82
Sam Worthen 1981-82
John Duren 1981-83
Jim Brogan 1982-83
Petur Gudmundsson 1982-89
Jerome Henderson 1986-87
David Cooke 1986
Steve Alford 1988-91
Joe Courtney 1993-97
Stephen Howard 1993-98
Bob Martin 1994-95
Keith Tower 1994-97
Harold Ellis 1994-98
Andrew Gaze 1994-99
Stanley Jackson 1994
Eldridge Recasner 1995-2002
Askia Jones 1995
Corey Beck 1996-99
Gerald Brown 1999
Marcus Haislip 2003-10
Linton Johnson 2004-09
Yuta Tabuse 2005
Alex Scales 2006
Sharrod Ford 2006
Robert Hite 2007
Andre Brown 2007-09
Desmon Farmer 2007-09
Coby Karl 2008-10
Sim Bhullar 2015

[ShowtimeLakers85]

This is absolutely brilliant work, and it gives me great hope for the earlier Eras being added eventually.

[Coldfusion30]

Great job! I could definitely see 1977 being added, not really any other time frame to add at this point tbh. Only issue I can see is them thinking not enough people would care for it to be worth the dev time/money. As much as it sucks, I bet the earlier guys would be cheaper to acquire rights to since they made much less than the modern guys which may make it a bit more likely.

[dewjo]

Makes me think of the 2K77 mod that was done on PC for 2K21 and 2K22
viewtopic.php?f=267&t=112143

[Andrew]

Excellent research! Accepting thinner rosters that cover the starting fives and a couple of key reserves definitely make a 70s era viable. Licensing an additional 45-67 players for thin but viable rosters seems doable, if not necessarily likely.

To that point, it's probably still a long shot because of the age of the players and the fact that some of them have passed away. Getting their likenesses may be easier said than done, especially if 2K is lowballing on their offers as Rasheed Wallace has insinuated. However, it's interesting that by licensing around 100 players from the span you researched, 1976-77 could indeed be a viable starting point.

[jfran1524]

I appreciate all of your comments and enthusiasm! Thank you for taking the time to read my lengthy posts and reply! I didn't play the 2K77 mod, but I did watch Clique Productions videos using those rosters, and they were a blast. Also, Andrew, I want to say that I am not someone who normally posts in forums or tweets stuff out, but the positive attitude that you maintain throughout your post history here made me feel comfortable sharing my thoughts on your forum. Thank you for cultivating that positive atmosphere.

Admittedly, this has all been speculation on my part, and my original intention was not to create false hope or set unreasonable expectations. I would often read comments about how anything pre-1983 would be impossible, so my initial intent was to see where we actually were as of today's base roster and set our expectations accordingly. Obviously, most rosters having only 5-6 real players max is not ideal (albeit better than nothing in my opinion), but considering the age of the players involved and the fact that roster sizes were smaller back then, it is no small feat to have 5 players per team without a dedicated Era/roster for them, and likewise, getting 6-7 players per team would also be no small feat.

However, once I dove into the MyTeam cards and identified just how many 70s guys they had quietly added, in addition to the 50s, 60s, and 80s guys, my excitement about the possibility of a 70s Era grew exponentially. My second post does not include this info, although I did tweet this out separately, but if everyone of the MyTeam exclusive guys that was on a 1976-77 roster (not necessarily opening night, but at some point in during the season) was added to the offline default rosters, our average moves up to just under 7 players per team. Again, 8-10 players would be ideal, but 7 is impressive, and to me at least, would certainly be playable. There is also the possibility of adding guys who are in game but retired prior to 1976-77 (or were injured or otherwise not on a roster) into the free agent pool as age-appropriate versions of themselves. MJ Wizards does this with their rosters, and that is another way to add depth to the player pool. Some might argue that this isn't historically accurate, and I understand that, but for me, I don't see that as an issue. I am not trying to re-create history 1:1, I am trying to experience and play through my own version of it and to strengthen my appreciation for these players and NBA history. So having a 38 year old Jerry West in the FA pool in 1976-77 would be fun to me.

I have no inside knowledge of 2K's plans, nor do I want to claim that it is a foregone conclusion that older Eras will be added to future 2Ks, but it seems to me like there is at least a remote possibility of this happening. Nothing is guaranteed, but I think the numbers I found support that. 2K seems to be making an effort to obtain likeness rights for older players. Whether that is solely for MyTeam, I cannot say, but they have a history of doing things tied to years, dates, Jersey #s, etc. (Jordan challenge for 2K23; Mamba moments for 2K24). I would not be surprised at all if they are working on acquiring player rights for a post-merger Era to be included as a feature for NBA 2K27 and the 50th anniversary of the merger. They need to have new "features" to market that future game, and I think that would be a fantastic one if done correctly. Again, this is purely speculative on my part, but I think the numbers show that it could be done if they wanted to.

Speaking of which, I am reminded of what Erick Boenisch said in Polygon's profile of the original iteration of MyNBA Eras three years ago: “If you’ve astutely paid attention, we’ve been working toward this for a long time,” Boenisch said. “We’ve been adding classic teams and cities for years and years and years — and getting players’ [likeness] rights along the way — [and] creating historic uniforms, court floors; the MyTeam mode has so many historic uniforms and players. We were building up our library to pull this off."

I will keep my eyes peeled for hints of future retro Eras, but for now, let us all (especially me) not get too carried away and fail to appreciate what we have in front of us: a promising, albeit imperfect, NBA 2K25.

[Brisket]

I think they're definitely interested in making Kareem the face of this new 70's era. Probably the worst kept secret in the industry since making him a triplet cover athlete back in 2K22. And even though they're probably not going to do the start of the 70's when he won the ring with Big O, it'll make sense to have him at the start of his long Lakers career.

[Andrew]

Also, Andrew, I want to say that I am not someone who normally posts in forums or tweets stuff out, but the positive attitude that you maintain throughout your post history here made me feel comfortable sharing my thoughts on your forum. Thank you for cultivating that positive atmosphere.

Thanks for the kind words! I'm glad to hear that, as that's what we've always strived for. It's good to know that people feel that way!

I think it's definitely worth considering the possibility, and examining how likely it is, from all angles. As I said, it may be tough because getting the likeness rights might be challenging when you're dealing with much older players (or indeed, their estates), but it's interesting when you crunch the numbers as you have. It's a lower number than what I might've expected, to the point of being quite viable if we accept thinner rosters (which for the era we certainly could, at least to begin with). It'd be a good start.

That quote from Erick Boenisch is one to keep in mind for sure, and it's a good example of why we can't and shouldn't rule this stuff out; especially if expressing interest in it will encourage 2K to follow through because it's something people want. It's obviously not a done deal - or at least, we're not in a position to confidently declare that - but yeah, the numbers suggest that it's perhaps not as unlikely as originally thought. I've been wrong on enough "oh, they'll never do that!" predictions to know not to dismiss possibilities too readily, while also tempering my expectations on lofty goals. A 70s era would be very cool though, so here's hoping they're at least exploring the possibility!

[jfran1524]

One last big post on this topic for now:

Based on my second post and all of the older players that are currently MyTeam exclusives (which I suspect for most is only temporary until they have proper faces and/or in-game rosters on which to place them), I decided to re-calculate some of the data from my first post AND go back even further in time to see where we are at in terms of roster completeness and what could realistically be fleshed out in the future.

First, here are some assumptions, not guaranteed to be correct, I am making for this mental exercise:

1) Assume all retro players currently-available in NBA 2K25, either on the default rosters or as hidden faces, will remain available in the game,

2) Assume all retro players currently exclusive to MyTeam in NBA 2K25 will eventually find their way into the default in-game roster and/or receive proper faces to be modded into the default roster by PC users, and

3) Assume the handful of players exclusive to MyTeam in the last few 2Ks, though not currently found in NBA 2K25's MyTeam, will return in some capacity and be usable in game (e.g., Nat Clifton, Earl Lloyd, Chuck Cooper, etc.).

Based on those assumptions, I then reviewed every draft class available on Basketball Reference from 1947 through 1984 and determined how many players could theoretically be in the game in the future. (Please note, for undrafted players, I used a Google search to reasonably place them into a draft class. Although there is some possibility for error there, it should be insignificant overall). Here is what I found:

Season Players from Draft Class Possible in Game
1947 0
1948 3
1949 1
1950 6
1951 1
1952 0
1953 1
1954 5
1955 0
1956 4
1957 2
1958 9
1959 7
1960 8
1961 5
1962 6
1963 7
1964 10
1965 14
1966 15
1967 10
1968 12
1969 15
1970 18
1971 17
1972 19
1973 17
1974 27
1975 18
1976 15
1977 28
1978 22
1979 25
1980 23
1981 31
1982 32
1983 30
1984 18

Draft classes were pretty sparse until about 1958. Considering there were only 8 teams in the league at that time, 1958's 9-player draft class isn't all that bad. Neither were the draft classes from 1964-1967, when there were still only 9-10 teams in the league and the in-game draft classes could potentially have 10-15 players per draft. Compare that to what we already do have in game: the Magic v. Bird Era with the much-lauded 1984 draft only having 18 real players in the game for a then 23-team league. Most other drafts from the 1980s onward are much deeper, but my point is there's more depth, relative to league size, in those 1960s drafts that we might initially expect.

My next step involved going through each team's rosters for every season and comparing them to what I found with each of the draft classes above in order to see how many players from those seasons are either 1) already in default rosters, 2) hidden faces still in the game files, or 3) current MyTeam exclusives that I suspect will eventually get fleshed out in the default roster in a future game. The was a lengthy, informative, and at times, exhausting process.

I decided to start with the 1962-63 season, as I figured it would allow some of those early draft classes to build player depth. Based on those results, I then went backwards in time until the numbers became too small. Then, I went forward in time through the 1979-80 season as I had in my original post (I excluded 1980-81 thru 1982-83 for now to save time and allow enough space for a different Era from Magic v. Bird).

I accounted for players that were traded mid-season so as to not double count them. There is also some margin of error here as this review was performed manually, so I may have missed a player here or there. However, I suspect any such error would cause my results to be understated rather than overstated.

Here are those results:

Season # of Teams Total Players Per Team Avg
1952 10 8 0.8
1953 10 8 0.8
1954 9 8 0.9
1955 8 12 1.5
1956 8 14 1.8
1957 8 16 2.0
1958 8 19 2.4
1959 8 23 2.9
1960 8 27 3.4
1961 8 31 3.9
1962 9 35 3.9
1963 9 40 4.4
1964 9 46 5.1
1965 9 51 5.7
1966 9 57 6.3
1967 10 67 6.7
1968 12 71 5.9
1969 14 77 5.5
1970 14 87 6.2
1971 17 97 5.7
1972 17 98 5.8
1973 17 104 6.1
1974 17 104 6.1
1975 18 117 6.5
1976 18 125 6.9
1977 22 150 6.8
1978 22 155 7.0
1979 22 156 7.1
1980 22 169 7.7

Keeping in mind that rosters were limited to 11-12 active players for much of NBA history, some of these averages are quite promising. The 1966-67 season stands out to me as it has an average of 6.7 players per roster. That is an already-strong foundation from which 2K can hopefully expand a little further. The numbers retract slightly and then stagnate over the next decade for a couple of reasons: 1) the league aggressively expanded from 10 teams to 17 teams over a 5 year span, and 2) during that same time-span, many players chose the ABA over the NBA.

Overall, from about 1964 onward, I argue that 2K has strong roster foundation potential, and only a few players here and there could really make a difference should 2K eventually be able to acquire their likeness rights (a huge "if", I know). Obviously, the more players, the merrier, but would you have suspected that 2K could already have the rights for enough players to have a 5-person rotation for nearly every single team from 1963-64 through 1979-80? I know my initial expectations were not that ambitious.

Another thing to keep in mind is that throughout the 1950s and 1960s, a number of players lost a year or two of their playing careers due to serving in the military. I did not include those players in my calculations, because they were not on a roster for those seasons, but in a possible MyNBA Eras situation, those players would not miss that time (unless the user wanted them to, of course) and the rosters could be a little deeper than shown above.

Furthermore, depending on whether or not 2K could (or would even want to attempt to) license the ABA to include in my theoretical late 1960s/early 1970s Era(s), those players who spent time in the ABA could be placed on NBA rosters or in free agency for a given season to further add depth to the league. This could represent a not-insignificant number of high-quality players who either never joined the NBA (e.g., Bob Netolicky from the base game, and Cincinnatus Powell who was exclusive to MyTeam as recently as 2K22 and 2K23), left for a while and came back (e.g., Rick Barry), or did not join the NBA until after the merger (e.g., Julius Erving, Artis Gilmore, Mel Daniels, etc.).

As stated previously, I have no inside knowledge of the situation, and this is all speculation/educated guessing on my part. I used to think 2K MIGHT be able to pull off a post-merger Era, maybe, and anything before that would require a miracle. However, based on the above info, I think 2K could realistically eventually add Eras for the 1960s and early 1970s. Will they actually do it? Who knows for sure (see the Erick Boenisch quote from my previous post if you need some inspiration). What I do know is they already have a strong foundation for almost every team from back then, and the next time somebody gets blindly shouted down on an X or Reddit post for voicing their desire for a Wilt vs Bill Era or a Kareem Era, because it "could never happen", we now have the proof to show that it actually could happen. And maybe, as Andrew said in his last post, if we continue to express our interest in such a mode, 2K will be encouraged to follow-through on bringing it to us.

I won't keep spamming the forum with more data, but I will keep an eye on the situation, and should things change significantly, I will provide an update. For now, enjoy 2K25 (or whatever release you prefer to play) and let's see what happens!

[jfran1524]

I tried to format the tables better than what it ultimately shows. Hopefully this doesn't violate any forum rules, but I'll link to my tweet which shows the data in a spreadsheet. Will be much easier to read.

https://twitter.com/JustinFrancis7/stat ... 2285463031

[Andrew]

Again, I love the research here! Makes a post-merger starting point feel tantalisingly viable. In the meantime, it also suggests some modding possibilities.

[jfran1524]

So many possibilities. If/when that time comes, I will be ready to share whatever knowledge I have gained from these exercises.

I forget the roster-maker's name, but one of my favorite rosters from 2K24 was a 1963-64 roster using as many in-game players as possible and CAPs for the rest. It was playable in the Magic vs. Bird Era and was a good bit of fun. If these My team exclusive guys start getting in-game faces, even if hidden, the opportunities will start opening up!

[jfran1524]

Hello again everyone. I am back with an update on my earlier post. There have not been major changes since my last post, but some new legends have been found in the game files, and I have re-reviewed in great detail the rosters and draft classes from 1946-47 thru 1983-84. This will likely be my last big post about this information until 2K26 is released in the fall and we have a better idea of where things are headed. My intention is not to recklessly build up hopes based on conjecture, it is to build excitement at the very real possibilities of more retro Eras coming in the next few releases (I dislike when people blindly shout down these possibilities based on the ages of the players in question and without any real knowledge of the actual data). And by building that excitement, hopefully 2K sees that there is a passionate audience for these retro Eras/rosters.

PTSports84 recently posted a video to his YouTube channel showing that faces for Andy Phillip, Dick McGuire, and Bill Melchionni have been added to the game files. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4WpkzBhK3rs&t=5s&ab_channel=PeteToal

Andy Philip was drafted in the 1947 BAA draft, played from 1948 thru 1958, and has been deceased since 2001. Dick McGuire was drafted in the 1949 BAA draft, played from 1950 thru 1960, and has been deceased since 2010. Bill Melchionni was drafted in 1966 and played from 1967 thru 1976 (2 years in the NBA and 7 years in the ABA). Thankfully he is still with us. The addition of two BAA players to the game files, especially two that passed away so long ago, is promising to me. Obviously, not all of those guys' rights will be obtainable, but this does show that when 2K puts their minds and resources to something, they can get things done. Another player that was added to the game since my original post is Aaron James. He is currently a MyTeam exclusive player, and as far as I am aware, he does not have a face in the game files (so essentially, he is in the game right now in name only). He was drafted in 1974, played from 1975 thru 1979, and spent his entire career w/ the New Orleans Jazz.

So, only four or so new retro players have been added to the game in the last 4-5 months. Big deal, right? Well, maybe not a huge deal, but like I said, I do see all of this as promising.

With these new players being added and with me getting more and more excited at the possibility of future iterations of 2K having Eras set in the 1960s and 1970s (and if we're lucky enough, maybe the 1950s?), I spent much of the last several weeks updating my spreadsheets and reviewing all rosters and draft classes from 1946-47 thru 1983-84. This time, for the rosters, I took the time to figure out each team's opening night roster (or a close approximation of it - Basketball-Reference's info on the 1940s and 50s is sparse), since that is the roster (generally speaking) that 2K uses for Eras rosters. In my original post, I had simply looked at B-R's roster pages for each team which list all players to have played a game for said team in a season. I had made a point to try not to double count guys that spent time with multiple teams, but I wasn't concerned with opening night rosters. Some of the players included in my original list were not signed until after opening night, so they would likely be considered free agents were 2K to make an Era for that season (think Rafer Alston in the Kobe Era or Eddie Jordan in the Magic-Bird Era).

I am going to provide some updated numbers, but before I do, please allow me to restate some of my caveats and assumptions:

1) I don't have any special/insider knowledge of what 2K is doing. I am just compiling the data and making educated guesses based on what is in MyTeam, the game files, and what 2K has done/said in the past. I've done the homework, but these are still just educated guesses, and I could be completely wrong about all of this and 2K has no intention of making older Eras.

2) I am assuming that all players with faces in the game files (either in a default roster or as hidden face) will remain in the game for the foreseeable future. I am also assuming that all the new MyTeam exclusive players from the 1950s, 60s, and 70s will eventually get their own faces in the game (the vast majority of them currently just have CAP faces). Again, no guarantees here, but history would suggest that they will. I am also assuming that 2K will eventually get Bill Russell's rights back. Nothing is guaranteed, but if they want to go back to the 1950s or 60s, he's too important to not have in game in an official capacity (only having a hidden face for him just isn't enough).

3) A small number of players were MyTeam exclusive in 2K23 (Chuck Cooper, Nat Clifton, Earl Lloyd, and Cincy Powell) but have not been in the game since. They do not have hidden faces in the files, so they essentially do not exist in NBA 2K25. For the purpose of this exercise, I am assuming 2K could obtain the rights for these players again (if they don't already have them). Two years ago, the sons of Nat Clifton and Earl Lloyd were interviewed on NBA Radio on SiriusXM, and they are very much in favor of keeping their fathers' legacies of breaking the NBA's color barrier alive, so I don't think my assumptions here are too much of a stretch.

4) As mentioned above, new for this post is the emphasis on opening night rosters. If a player is in the game (either in default rosters, as a hidden face, or as a MyTeam exclusive without a face) but was not on the opening night roster, I consider them a free agent for that season. I have kept track of them, but have not factored them in to my "number of players per team" calculations. In the case of the late 1960s and 1970s, I am considering ABA players to be free agents for those seasons. I would love for their to be some sort of ABA inclusion, but I just don't think it's realistic at this point based on the numbers. But, those ABA guys being free agents in a 1960s/70s Era could help flesh out the rosters. In some early 1970s seasons, we're talking about 30-40 possible free agents if the ABA guys are included in this calculation. Some may prefer not to include them as such, and that's fine. There's no need to. I am just showing what is possible.

5) I did clean up some errors on my part. They were immaterial in the grand scheme of things and did not significantly impact my original calculations. They are bound to happen with this much manually-entered data, so even my updated numbers could still have some errors, but again, I do not think they will significantly impact my calculations.

6) It is important to remember that rosters were smaller back then than they are now with some teams only carrying 10-11 players all season. As such, having 6 guys from a 10 player roster is equivalent to having 8-9 guys from a 13-15 player roster. Obviously, we want as many rotation players as possible here, but the context is important and having ONLY 6 players from those teams really isn't as bad as it sounds.

Alright, now for some updated data! Spoiler alert: there aren't significant changes from my original data, so I will do my best to provide additional context to make reading all of this worth your time.

Let's start with the draft classes. The 1947 draft has 1 player: the aforementioned Andy Phillip. The 1948 thru 1957 drafts have between 0 and 6 players per class. The 1958 class has 9 players in it. Not bad considering there were only 8 teams in the league at that time, so hypothetically, each team could have a first round draft pick. By comparison, the 1984 draft class with MJ and Hakeem only has 18 players in it (and that's if you manually add Kenny Fields to the draft class - he's in the game on the 84-85 Bucks, but not in the default 1984 draft class) yet the league had 23 teams, so not every team gets a real player as a first round pick. The 1959 thru 1963 drafts have between 5 and 8 players in them, so not as good as 1959, but again, there were only 8-9 teams in the league at this time, so it's not AS bad as it sounds. All draft classes between 1964 and 1973 have between 10 and 19 players in them. The 1974 draft class has a whopping 28 players in it at a time when there were only 17 teams in the league. The 1975 and 1976 draft classes dip down to 18 and 16, respectively, but the 1977 draft class jumps back up to 28. From 1978 thru 1983, there are between 22 and 32 players per draft class. In total, the draft classes from 1958 thru 1983 are pretty strong relative to the number of teams in the league at the time, with 20 out of 26 of those seasons having enough real players in them for each team to have a real player as a first round draft pick.

Now on to the roster info!

The rosters are pretty barren for the first 12 seasons with 0 players from the 1946-47 season in game and an average of 2.6 players per team from 1957-58. In 1958-59, we crack a 3 player per team average for the first time. There were 8 teams in the league at this time, so that is a total of 24 players, 6 of which were on the Celtics. We'd still need another 40 players to get roughly 8 players per team. I don't know how attainable that is for 2K, but would you have thought that they already have an average of 3 per team (or 2.5 per team if you exclude the Celtics from the calculation)? It may not sound like much, but I look at it as a very strong foundation.

The numbers slowly creep up over the next 4 seasons until we reach a 5.1 player per team average in 1964. In other words, on average, there are already enough players in game for a full starting rotation for all teams going as far back as Wilt Chamberlain's 5th season! Bill Russell played until 1969, so for those hoping for a Bill vs Wilt Era (count me among them) may not be completely out of our minds. Currently, by my calculations, no 1963-64 team would fewer than 3 players, and 6 of the 9 teams in the league that season have between 5-7 players. Work is still needed on this season's 76ers (4 players), Knicks (3 players), and Bullets (4 players).

By 1966-67, we jump up to an average of 6.7 players per team (10 teams in the league). For the champion 76ers, 8 out of their 11 players are in 2K25 in some form. They would make for a great addition to the classic teams. The Cincinnati Royals and San Francisco Warriors also each have 8 players in 2K25 in some form. The Knicks and Bulls only have 4 players in 2K25, so they would still need some work, but all other teams have 5+ players.

Rosters thin out from 1967-68 thru 1973-74 as the NBA rapidly expanded from 10 teams to 18 teams in 8 the span of 8 seasons and many players chose the ABA over the NBA. During this stretch, the average of players per team fluctuates between 5.5 and 6.2 players per season. The 1967-68 season is the first season with 12 teams (since the league contracted down to 8 teams in the 1950s). The current game engine allows for leagues with as few as 12 teams, so could this be a good starting point for a 1960s Era? 2K has shown a desire to base Eras around draft classes with strong headlining players (e.g. 1984, 1992, and 2003). In that case, how about starting an Era in the 1968-69 season (Bill Russell's last) where you have an opportunity to draft Kareem? This season already has an average of 5.5 players per team in the game, with a potential 14 free agents if you include ABA players in the free agent pool. Of the 14 teams in the league that season, 12 have between 5 and 7 players available in 2K25 in some form. The Bulls only have 2 players and the Suns have 4, so they need the most work to make them viable.

The 1976-77 season, the first season after the ABA-NBA merger and the initial reason for me looking into all of this, has an average of 6.8 players per team available in 2K25. Of the 22 teams in the league that season, 4 teams (Rockets, Pistons, Kings, and Pacers) have 5 players each, while all remaining teams have between 6 and 11 players available in 2K25 in some form. So in this case, 1-2 players per team could really flesh things out and make this Era a reality.

Here's my wild guess at the current Eras roadmap over the next 5 years or so: I think the new Era for 2K26 will be the 1995-96 season for its 30th anniversary. You get the 72-10 Bulls, Shaq and Penny on the Magic, expansion Raptors and Grizzlies, and can play for the 1996 draft class. I think the 1976-77 season would be a great inclusion for 2K27. What better way to virtually celebrate the 50th anniversary of the merger than this? For 2K28, how about adding an Era in the late 80s based around the Bad Boys and the league expansion? Then 2K29 would be the perfect time to add that 1968-69 Era for the 60th anniversary of that season. By then, it will be time for a 2020s Era between the Steph and Modern Eras. Could we possibly see a 1950s Era by then? The groundwork may have already been laid for 1959. Who knows if any of this will come true, or if I am just too focused on adding Eras based around anniversaries of seasons; however, when I started all of this research, I was just hoping that a post-merger Era could be possible. I now firmly believe a post-merger Era is headed our way and that 1950s/60s Eras are a real possibility.

My current plan is to continue reviewing all of the seasons between 1985 and the present day. Ultimately, I would like to have a spreadsheet with opening night rosters for every BAA/NBA season that indicates which players from those rosters are available in game and how. I'm about halfway done, but the modern seasons take more time. When this spreadsheet project is ready, it is my intention to share it with the community. I think more retro Eras are coming, and as a result, roster makers will be able to make rosters for more seasons. I want this spreadsheet to assist in those endeavors.

I'm on X/Twitter @JustinFrancis7. I don't post often, but when I do, it is usually about Eras, retro players, my 2K spreadsheets, and the like.

To those who read all of this, thank you very much for your time! If you ever see someone on Twitter or Reddit shoot down the idea of a Bill vs Wilt Era or a 1970s Era, refer them to this post. I don't want people blindly thinking that 2K could never pull off these Eras. I want people to know that they are a real possibility and to spread that excitement. Hopefully 2K will see the passion we have for this and make it a reality for us.

Take care,

-Justin