Baghdad Bombing

[Cloudy]

About an hour ago a hotel in Baghdad is bombed.
Right now 11 is found dead.
2 Suicide Trucks..
Terrorist are the one
Hotel is a famous hotel.

From CNN:
Three explosions rock Iraq's capital at sunset near two hotels housing international journalists. Police said the three blasts were car bombs, but journalists in one of the hotels said the first two explosions were rockets, followed by a car bomb.

Authorities said there were casualties in the attack, but there were no details on how many people were hurt.

----
Known as Journalists' Hotel..

[Cloudy]

from YAHOO!
By ROBERT H. REID, Associated Press Writer 25 minutes ago

BAGHDAD, Iraq - Rockets and car bombs hit the Palestine Hotel on Monday, wounding at least five people and causing considerable damage to the building that houses many foreign journalists, Iraqi police and journalists said.

Associated Press Television News pictures showed a huge explosion on the northwest side of Firdous Square, which is adjacent to the hotel. Thick clouds of smoke and dust billowed from the area, and at least one fire was started by falling debris.

Security sources said the explosions occurred two minutes apart.

Inside the hotel, light fixtures were blown down, pictures were blasted off the walls and windows were shattered.

An AP photographer at a checkpoint at the northwest corner of the hotel said at least three fellow photographers were injured and taken away by ambulance. Two TV personnel inside the hotel also sustained minor injuries.

The attacks caused heavy damage to the south side of the 19-story hotel, forcing journalists, including those from AP, Fox News and the U.S. government-funded Alhurra TV station to take refuge in the corridor. I

After the bombing, Iraqi forces opened up with heavy automatic weapons fire, apparently firing at random. There was no sign of a further assault on the hotel.

It did not appear that the car bombers managed to penetrate the high concrete blast walls around the Palestine Hotel, which was last hit by an insurgent rocket attack on Oct. 7, 2004.

Maj. Abbas Mohammed Suleiman said the hotel compound was hit by rockets and car bombs.

APTN video taken immediately after the explosions from inside the hotel showed people evacuating through damaged hallways with panels from the ceilings and walls blown out in the stairwell. Debris from the blasts were seen on the floor of one empty room, where a television set was still turned on.

The hotel has been attacked several times since the war started in March 2003. On April 8, 2003 — the day before
Saddam Hussein's regime fell — U.S. tank fire killed two TV cameramen — a Spaniard and a Ukrainian — at the hotel.

The nearby Firdous Square was the site of a statue of Saddam Hussein that was toppled as Baghdad fell to the U.S.-led coalition. Concrete barriers topped with barbed wire guard the Palestine and the nearby Sheraton, which is also home to foreigners.

[Jing]

yeah, was doing some work at pita pit and saw it on the flatscreen tv...i was like holy shit.

[Riot]

Very sad, sad event indeed.

[Cloudy]

And no one here cares...sigh

[Andrew]

The news often seems to be one sad event after another, but it seems to be case more than ever lately. May those killed rest in peace, condolences to their families.

[Blasphemy]

Domn, this war is fucked up. Hope they rest in peace and hope the injured survive.

[shadowgrin]

Strike the journalists = create more fear for the media to report.
Damn terrorists.

[Riot]

Terrorists resort to fear to try to win the war. They want to strike fear in the people's eyes so they retreat and hide. That isn't going to happen though, they know that their time is limited in the Middle East.

[cyanide]

Hold the phone.

Did it ever occur to you that these bombings weren't just a result of "terrorist" behavior? There's something behind these bombings. Take, for instance, the fact that these people don't want a democratic Iraq. You might ask, why the fuck would they not want a democratic state? Think about it, they will lose some of their culture, and they don't want that. Democracy gives more power to women, a change that hasn't been done since the dawn of the patriarchal order in the lands of Mesopotamia, which happens to be in Iraq, coincidentially. Do you think these men with power would want a woman to have equal status with them? For those who are power hungry and see this change as "morally wrong" or hurting their culture, they will resort to opposition and violence.

These three times a day bombings aren't just a result of the American invasion, there's more to it than what it appears on the surface.

[Riot]

You are right, the people making the attacks don't want a democracy. But what you must know is the people carrying out the attacks IS A SMALL PERCENT of the Iraqi population. Matter of fact, most of the terrorist attacks and car bombs in Iraq aren't even done by Iraqis.

They won't lose a lot of their culture because they wrote their own constitution. Islam will have a big effect on the government in Iraq. There is no such thing as seperation of church and state in Iraq.

But once again, the people carrying out the attacks are a small percent. But these kind of attacks get the headlines because that is what sells. It's a big story and people dying is horrible but at the same time they refuse to point out that the people making the attacks are anti-American and anti-democratic but they aren't all like that! If they didn't want democracy so bad they wouldn't risk their lives going to the polls to vote if it wasn't important to them.

You realize that if the entire Iraqi population was really opposed to American troops they could get America to pull out in a day? US Troops patrol the streets where they are out-numbered by the thousands. Perfect spot for an ambush or a sniper. But the people WANT THEM THERE! They want a democratic state. They thank the US for ousting Saddam. They want their own rights to vote and spend the countries money ON THE PEOPLE, something Saddam hardly did.

So you are right, in a way, Cyanide. The people holding the attacks are anti-American and are anti-democratic. However you failed to mention that the people holding and carrying out the attacks are a very, very small percentage of the population.

[cyanide]

Can you find stats to prove that only a small percentage is carrying this out? 3 times a day for the last couple years or so doesn't seem like a small percentage...

People could've outsed Saddam themselves, so it's not like they can take on the American troops if they wanted to

What about the women? Do Iraqi men find it ok for women to have the same status as them?

[Riot]

Can you find stats to prove that only a small percentage is carrying this out? 3 times a day for the last couple years or so doesn't seem like a small percentage...

People could've outsed Saddam themselves, so it's not like they can take on the American troops if they wanted to

What about the women? Do Iraqi men find it ok for women to have the same status as them?

I found this link that says most of the suicide bombs are coming from foreign fighters that are smuggled across the border. However, this one expert says he feels about 80% of the attacks are by Iraqis. But he does stress that of those attacks most of them are just small arm attacks and mortars. Now, I do no that some Iraqis are paid to fire off mortars at US convoys. I also know that a lot of them are threatened to do so. So I don't know if it directly reflects the opinion of democracy. link here

Now, you say 3 attacks a day. How about roughly 60 to 80 attacks a day in Iraq? The military forces are under a lot of pressure and heat, however the number of attacks is decreasing but the velocity of them is increasing. Which tells America this, the insurgents are getting bigger and better bombs. Who could be giving them those? They have intelligence that says Iran is funding insurgents in Iraq to make bigger and stronger bombs to use on US troops. That's why the whole US-Iran conflict is heating up fast and why I would support some military presence in Iran and on the borders and an assination mission on key leaders.

They could easily attack US Troops and get America to pull them out. Easily. If they wanted no democracy and no US soldiers they could get them out by the end of the week. No questions asked. But they see that the Americans are helping them get the country on it's feet and trying to start a successful country in the Middle East again. They really do appreciate it and they realize that the American soldiers are a lot nicer to them than the old Iraqi soldiers. And right to choose and say what's on your mind is a great right to have.

As for the whole women equal rights thing, it's still unclear what will happen. The Iraqis really don't want it but the Americans want to make sure that the women get treated better than they were before. It's kind of one of those things that we don't agree with them on. Like I've said on a previous thread, the Iraqis are a pain to work with. I'm sure the US will be happy when we can finally leave them alone and they can operate by themselves.

[Matthew]

Cyanide, I dont think you understand. Democracy can not be forced on anyone. It just cant happen. In a democractic society, you (the people) have the choice in what they want.

And its very rare that there are 3 bombs a day. Its averaged closer to 3 a week if im not mistaken, and that is quite a small percentage. Also, you have to take into consideration alot of these suicide bombers are from other parts in the middle east, not iraq.

What about the women? Do Iraqi men find it ok for women to have the same status as them?

WHo cares how Iraqi men feel towards how iraqi women should be treated. Thats dependent on iraqi women.

Didnt 80% of Iraqi's just vote of conspriction. 80% is a huge percantage, and thats how many people are in support of this.

What i find interesting is how people say "america should mind its own business", then they criticise the effots over there. Shouldnt these people also mind their own business?

[Riot]

The Iraqi women are pressing hard for woman's rights, they have their own Iraqi Women Civil Rights group/organization.

[Matthew]

Exactly. It shouldnt be upto Iraqi men (let alone terrorists) to decide what rights they get. They should decide on that as a society...

[cyanide]

What about the women? Do Iraqi men find it ok for women to have the same status as them?

WHo cares how Iraqi men feel towards how iraqi women should be treated. Thats dependent on iraqi women.

My point was, since Iraq (and the middle east in general) has been under a patriarchal order for the past 5000 years. Obviously, there will be a lot of men who aren't willing to accept a culture that will be different from their own that they have been conditioned with for generations. I'm sure religion plays a large role in the patriarchal order mindframe. Societies don't become hunters-gatherers overnight.

What i find interesting is how people say "america should mind its own business", then they criticise the effots over there. Shouldnt these people also mind their own business?

Why should America (the gov't) mind their own business if America (the people) can't? I thought America was a democratic nation

[Matthew]

It is. However, it doesnt mean there are hypocrits still.

[Jackal_]

I hope those insurgents keep bombing the shit outta everyone Everytime someone is killed in Iraq I want to hear a reason why the war has been succesful.. it hasnt you fuckin cockmonkeys.

Sit back and watch your soldiers die..

[Matthew]

You pathetic fuck.

I hope those insurgents keep bombing the shit outta everyone

Yeah I hope some junkie from texas goes and blows up a local mosque with civillians, then riot can enjoy it as much as you enjoy this.

If you feel so strongly against america and its allies, why arent you fighting against them? Oh thats right, you dont have the balls too. Its much safer to sit behind a computer than to go and actually fight yourself.

I've lost all respect for you becuase of that last post.

[Jackal_]

You pathetic fuck.

I hope those insurgents keep bombing the shit outta everyone

Yeah I hope some junkie from texas goes and blows up a local mosque with civillians, then riot can enjoy it as much as you enjoy this.

If you feel so strongly against america and its allies, why arent you fighting against them? Oh thats right, you dont have the balls too. Its much safer to sit behind a computer than to go and actually fight yourself.

I've lost all respect for you becuase of that last post.

Rofl... go fuck yourself you dumb shit Feel strongly against America and its allies? You stupid shit, all I hear about every fuckin day is how insurgents keep attacking innocent people and soldiers dying every fucking day.. what will it take for the US to realize they've made a fuckin mistake? The whole world thinks its a mistake.. but nooo almight Matthew thinks it isnt..

Matthew.. I think the problem with you is you dont like it when someone steps up to you.. well fuck that noise.. cuz as long as I'm here I'll step up to your sorry ass as much as I want.. so fucking deal with it.

Lets watch the flaming escalate now

[Riot]

America doesn't know when they made a mistake? Hardly. But the problem is this wasn't a mistake.

But, one again, it doesn't matter if you think it is a mistake or not. We're there until the very end and when America and it's allies achieve their mission you will look like a fool.

Mark my words: In 20 years, Iraq will be a well operating democratic state.

[Matthew]

"legend", you cant "step upto" someone on the internet . But its ok, I didnt expect anyone who feels the need to assemble their own online "gang" for a video game community to know much better .

Rofl... go fuck yourself you dumb shit Laughing Feel strongly against America and its allies? You stupid shit, all I hear about every fuckin day is how insurgents keep attacking innocent people and soldiers dying every fucking day.. what will it take for the US to realize they've made a fuckin mistake? The whole world thinks its a mistake.. but nooo almight Matthew thinks it isnt..

The whole world doesnt think its a mistake. The rest of the world is either 1) gutless, or 2) trying to score cheap political points.

They can criticise all they want, but until they offer an alternative solution, it means nothing. whats that saying? "only god can create a flower, but even the most foolish of children can destroy it".

But hey, if laughing at innocent people dying is what you enjoy becuase it "proves" your point that america sucks, I have nothing really to say to you. You really belong over there if you hold all that hate in your heart... as i said before, if you were legit, you'd be over there fighting the US led coalition.

[cyanide]

It is. However, it doesnt mean there are hypocrits still.

Hypocrites? Elaborate.

America doesn't know when they made a mistake? Hardly. But the problem is this wasn't a mistake.

But, one again, it doesn't matter if you think it is a mistake or not. We're there until the very end and when America and it's allies achieve their mission you will look like a fool.

In a recent poll, 50% of America feels that it's a mistake, and I'm sure most families who lost their son/daughter in the war feels it's a mistake too. So it does matter.

The whole world doesnt think its a mistake. The rest of the world is either 1) gutless, or 2) trying to score cheap political points.

So far what I've seen, the political nations are doing #2, trying to score cheap political points by supporting the war. That was just the government of the countries. As for the civilians from other countries, from what I've seen, most are against the war. We're at a time where we're trying establish peace and avoiding another major war, and America should've set a better example than invade two countries prematurely. Granted, the UN didnt' do a very good job, but with that invasion, the UN lost all credibility, and this gives any other nation to do what America had done. I think it's cheap that since America is a world superpower, they can just go out there and "spread democracy" and establish "peace" when there's obviously another motive behind all this for political or economic gains, otherwise America wouldn't have done this.

[Matthew]

They are still hypocrits becuase the complain that America isnt mindind its own business by going into there. But they arent minding their own business by following and criticising the actions of the US govenrment/army. It doesnt matter if they're from america or not, if they do and say that, they are hypocrits.

So far what I've seen, the political nations are doing #2, trying to score cheap political points by supporting the war. That was just the government of the countries. As for the civilians from other countries, from what I've seen, most are against the war. We're at a time where we're trying establish peace and avoiding another major war, and America should've set a better example than invade two countries prematurely. Granted, the UN didnt' do a very good job, but with that invasion, the UN lost all credibility, and this gives any other nation to do what America had done. I think it's cheap that since America is a world superpower, they can just go out there and "spread democracy" and establish "peace" when there's obviously another motive behind all this for political or economic gains, otherwise America wouldn't have done this.

What countries have stepped up exactly? The UN has always been useless, and how can you say either invasion was premature? They have taken out (evil) dictatorship and put a significant strain on terrosim worldwide. People forget how big of an atrocity 9/11 was, and im not trying to compare terror attacks here, but since the afganistan and iraq wars, terror attacks have not been on the same scale as 9/11.

As for economic gains, i dont think so. I think the reason america (and other countries) went into iraq and afganistan was to contain terrorism. If they wanted economic gain, they would have gone into kuwait. Kuwait has much more oil than iraq.

But maybe you're right. Maybe america should just try to negotiate with terrorist, and let those peices of shit dictate how we should live our lives. How we should slay any infadeles and circumsizewomen so they cant enjoy sex. How we should disrespect our mothers becuase we're males.

Yes, we should have just rolled over for those guys.

Just think for a minute how this war is being faught. The coalition is trying its best to minimise civillian deaths. The terrorists are trying to kill as many civillians as they can when they carry out their attacks. And you're trying to make america the villian here?