The PHILOSOPHY thread...because thinking is for free...

[AlwaysWhat,NeverWhy]

Okay, after the Bible thread took a steep turn towards reciting texts, this is the thread for all you wonderers and thinkers out there. Whatever seems to trouble you philosophically-wise, just state it here. I'm no philosopher, but I have been known as a thinker in my circle.

As the say, to do maths you need a pencil, a piece of paper and an eraser.

To do philosophy, you only need a pencil and a piece of paper.

[Null17]

cool philosophy. one of the most mind-boggling subjects in my school where the people who can talk BS the most gets the better mark

the only philosophy courses i've taken up is the philisophy of man. i think i'm supposed to take up philosophy of religion next. damn school. they force all of us to take so many philosophy courses

[AlwaysWhat,NeverWhy]

Philosophy is good as long as it is not binding your freedom of thought. If tey get you to study Nietczhe (sp?) and just memorize him rather than understand him than it's no good... It's like th efirst time you ever watched a basketball game. You like what you see, but cannot fully grasp it and understand it. Only time and conviction can open one's eyes...

[Goldberg]

Lets talk about sleeping in a bed; not sex just sleeping.

In all seriousness, how come people are always relunctant to get in and always relunctant to get out.

Thats the only experience I can think of where there is such a contradiction.

[Indy]

I philosiphise all the time.

But, you have to give me a subject first...

[Andreas Dahl]

In all seriousness, how come people are always relunctant to get in and always relunctant to get out.

Perhaps it reminds you of the mothers womb. You don't want to leave the secure and warm place that you are in, and enter into the big cold world.
I'm just guessing here, but I think that's a reasonable explanation... or?

[cyanide]

I'm going to enjoy this thread, and like Indy, I philosophize a lot too.

For Goldberg's post, I like Andreas response. But my answer is blunt: Night time is where the fun is, where you finally get a chance to relax or use your own quality time and you don't want the fun to end, but after sleep, it's hard to get up because you're so comfortable in sleep and you just feel so damn tired upon waking up. I think work has a lot to do with it. You don't want to start your day working, and you don't want your night of fun to end.

[AlwaysWhat,NeverWhy]

Perhaps it reminds you of the mothers womb. You don't want to leave the secure and warm place that you are in, and enter into the big cold world.

I did not expect Froydian analysis so early in this thread... a goodpoint though

Night time is where the fun is, where you finally get a chance to relax or use your own quality time and you don't want the fun to end, but after sleep, it's hard to get up because you're so comfortable in sleep and you just feel so damn tired upon waking up. I think work has a lot to do with it. You don't want to start your day working, and you don't want your night of fun to end.

It really depends on the situation and your life conditions at the moment. Let's say it's a cold winter night, it's snowing out, there's a fireplace in the corner, and you have spent most of your day working your butt off. The bed must seem enticing then, no? Think about it, cuddling under multiple blankets, reading a good book, and then dozing off peacefully.
Now visualize this: It's summer, it's hot, you're sweating non-stop, and there is no aircondinioning to be found. It's 12 at midnight and you feel tired. But you know you'll probably be rolling in your sheets for about an hour soaking wet before you fall asleep.Not so enticing then, isn't it?

Similar examples can be used for getting out of bed, with the work one already mentioned being a good one...

So what I am saying is that it all depends on the various conditions at that exact moment when you think 'bed'...

[cyanide]

I agree it depends on the situation, but I gave a restrictive answer to a restricted question, "how come people are always relunctant to get in and always relunctant to get out." Where the question is more of a generalization rather than a fact

[bullsfan009]

I was wondering when you were going to start this, Dweaver...good luck to you guys. I might pop in and contribute once and awhile- religion & philosophy is not one or the other, you know...

lol I feel the same way about the bed- never want to go to sleep, then never want to get up, then tired all day but do it all over again anyways

[Riot]

You don't want go to bed because you might have a heart attack and die.

[Jona]

Oh man, thank you so much for starting this thread!!

On the bed subject, I absolutely agree with Cy, let's try hard to keep the generalizations aside in this topic, like "All, everybody, always, never, blablablabla..."

I would like to know who in here can notice a difference (sensible or rational) when they are dreaming and when they are awake? (I'm reading a lot of Descartes right now, so any answer can be contributing.)

[Strike Freedom]

Here's a theory:

A > B
B > C
therefore, A > C .

is this true??

[cyanide]

I would like to know who in here can notice a difference (sensible or rational) when they are dreaming and when they are awake? (I'm reading a lot of Descartes right now, so any answer can be contributing.)

Might want to read Freud too, as he delves into the unconscious a lot. I find a very strong correlation between my fears and desires in dreams and in my conscious state. It seems that my nightmares relate to my fears or having some symbolic meaning to a present suffering. Good dreams seem to relate to a desire pursued or fulfilled. Sometimes dreams that never happened before actually happens in the future, even when I least expect it, which is a little bit meddling into the spiritual aspect of things... Nice topic to keep things going here!

[Jona]

Here's a theory:

A > B
B > C
therefore, A > C .

is this true??

That is called a syllogism, it is not always done that way, but that is a good example!

To Cy, although I agree that some of Freud's theories are brilliant (unconscious links, neuroses), I find myself not liking his work.
In my country, the psychoanalysis is greatly appreciated and looked upon like it was some kind of heavenly discovery.
I think that nowadays it is almost useless. In my country at least, less than 3% of the population can pay for 5 years, 4 days a week counseling.
It was also a great relief for the international aristocrat of the 19th century, but for the modern man, who has limited monetary resources and time to spend, the treatment is obsolete.
Also, the sex part of the libido description is REALLY stressed out.
Just because he sexually craved his mother and felt a strong rivalry with his father, not all people have those compelling neuroses.

I Jung btw...

[Filip]

Cool thread

Anyway, a question that I believe never been answered properly which is also known as the theoder-issue (if I'm not greatly mistaken) is how there can be a GOD when all this misery in the world exists.

My theory is (in pure religious perspective) is that there is a GOD as well as a SATAN. Somtimes GOD wins and good things happend (e.g A kid who is borned blind get his vision back) and sometimes Satan aka Lucifer wins and bad things happends (e.g A fully normal boy gets crazy and suddently murders both his parents, sorry for the bad example).

What do you think? If there only were a GOD there would be no misery, right? So if you believe in GOD you have to believe in Satan to since there is misery in this world.

Or maybe GOD just didn't want us to live happy all the time since sunshine can't be appreciated without rain.

[AlwaysWhat,NeverWhy]

Filip, I believe your topic has been discussed extensively in the Bible thread. If you wish to bring the topic to this thread, then it is fine.

Although I would suggest that we should not all talk simultaneously about many different topics, as there would be a mess ensuing...Thanks.

I would like to know who in here can notice a difference (sensible or rational) when they are dreaming and when they are awake?

" find a very strong correlation between my fears and desires in dreams and in my conscious state. It seems that my nightmares relate to my fears or having some symbolic meaning to a present suffering. Good dreams seem to relate to a desire pursued or fulfilled" Cyanide said it better than I could.

Dreams usually represent your subconscious definition of truth. You may attempt to constantly convince you rconscious self that you are fine, happy, etc, but then the subconscious part of you will kick in , in your dreams and spoil your fun. So just stay real The opposite happens when your conscious truth happens to identify with your subconscious one. In a few words, one can say that dreams are in fact the best way to communicate with your true, deeper self.
As I always like to say: "Strive to become who you are"

Sometimes dreams that never happened before actually happens in the future, even when I least expect it, which is a little bit meddling into the spiritual aspect of things...

That is a little hard to swallow, although I have heard similar experiences from others. Having not experienced anything remotely like that, I have to remain a skeptic.

Just because he sexually craved his mother and felt a strong rivalry with his father, not all people have those compelling neuroses.

Usually it takes a madman or an even just a littl ebit psychotic individual to understand the mind of a madman. Froyd was a littl epsychotic himself, and saw familiarity in many of his 'patients', being able to analyze things further. I agree that some of his theories are a little off, especially considering the present social context...

[Andreas Dahl]

Also, the sex part of the libido description is REALLY stressed out.
Just because he sexually craved his mother and felt a strong rivalry with his father, not all people have those compelling neuroses.

I actually do believe that the oedipus-complex is true. Men do in general seek what they find characteristic in their mother, in women. And that being passed on from their youth is nothing weird at all, it's just a fair reaction to the first contact with the opposite sex; and as the mother is the one that tends to your needs as a kid, how could the kid be aware of the social standards we have and that our "other" needs that we start to develop are considered tabu (and therefore reject them)?

[Big-D]

if a tree falls in the forest and nobody is around does it make a sound?

if you have a cup filled to the middle with water is it half full or empty?

[AlwaysWhat,NeverWhy]

if a tree falls in the forest and nobody is around does it make a sound?

if you have a cup filled to the middle with water is it half full or empty?

I would suggest that we should not all talk simultaneously about many different topics, as there would be a mess ensuing...Thanks.

Interesting topic though. Involves perception and definition.

[Jona]

MHO :

1) We can never know the answer to that one.
2) I think it is both.

[AlwaysWhat,NeverWhy]

if a tree falls in the forest and nobody is around does it make a sound?

First you will have to define "sound" accurately. Make an attempt.

if you have a cup filled to the middle with water is it half full or empty?

Matter of perception. Even changing the angle of view can change our opinion. Jona is right, it is both, since semantically 'half-full' and 'half-empty' both equal 50%.

As an abstract issue, though, it is a matter of mental involuntary perception.Same as optimism or pessimism. You cannot control which one you are, it just imposes itself on you, except in the case of a rare few individuals. So the glass is half-empty or half-full, depending on what each one's first thought upon laying his/her eyes on it is. There is no subjective truth on the subject, only objective opinion. In my opinion that fact stretches out on just about everything, but that is a discussion for another time.

[COOLmac©]

interesting philosophy has become....post stuff someday i will....later still talk to you guys.....

[Null17]

never knew there were so many philosophy nerds here...

[cyanide]

if a tree falls in the forest and nobody is around does it make a sound?

Yes, it makes a sound, but nobody is around to hear it

if you have a cup filled to the middle with water is it half full or empty?

Like Jona said, it's both... and as Dweaver said, the person's answer may depend on whether the person is optimistic or pessimistic. Half full = optimistic, half empty = pessimistic. But that's subjective, as even an optimistic person can say, "half empty."