9/11 Conspiracy? (Riot, you're gonna hate this)

I don't like to view those videos. It's a disrespect to those who died that day and those who died avenging that day. If people want think something that disgusting actually happened then they can live in their "reality". I think deep inside you guys all realize that isn't really what happened. We all know happened...we were attacked. It sounds weird but we were attacked.

There are people who want to kill me and any other America just for the sake that we are Americans. Bottom line. They are sick fucks and they will, and most of them have, been brought to justice.

Oh fuck you. This has proved that you're an ignorant close-minded, blinded little fuckwit waving an american flag who has no idea, and doesn't want one.


Riot. Learn something.

YOU. DO. NOT. SPEAK. FOR. EVERYONE. AND. YOUR. OPINION. IS. NOT. FACT. OPINION. IS. NEVER. FACT.

You are forcefed media just like the rest of us. You just choose to think that one source is fact, and disregard and totally ignore another. You were not there, you were not involved. Neither was I, but at least I just don't take the almighty government's every word as fact- I look at all angles. You don't.

Notice that YOU are the only one believing one thing or another. The rest of us, I think, are smart enough to wonder, and say "Gee, I don't really know...." since we realize that NONE OF US ARE ON THE INSIDE OF THIS.

Oh fuck you. This has proved that you're an ignorant close-minded, blinded little fuckwit waving an american flag who has no idea, and doesn't want one.


Riot. Learn something.

YOU. DO. NOT. SPEAK. FOR. EVERYONE. AND. YOUR. OPINION. IS. NOT. FACT. OPINION. IS. NEVER. FACT.

You are forcefed media just like the rest of us. You just choose to think that one source is fact, and disregard and totally ignore another. You were not there, you were not involved. Neither was I, but at least I just don't take the almighty government's every word as fact- I look at all angles. You don't.

Notice that YOU are the only one believing one thing or another. The rest of us, I think, are smart enough to wonder since we realize that NONE OF US ARE ON THE INSIDE OF THIS.

I didn't speak for anyone but myself, but I did give my opinion on what I think other people feel. I think deep down every knows that these conspiracy theories are bogus. I've seen enough of them and I've had this debate too many times to do it again. If I want to see footage of the attacks I'll turn on the tape I have of them in my VCR. I don't need some random internet loser to sit here and tell me that he can't see an airplane in this photo so let's blame the government.

Riot, I dont see how watching the video is a disrespect. The people who made the video care just as much for the people who died as you do. If you look at their website theres memorial stuff on it.

If you watched the video and it didnt change your opinion, thats fine, but you cant really comment on something you havent seen. Thats like someone whos never played football saying its stupid, easy, and a pussy sport.

I just watched about 5 minutes of it (I skipped ahead to when they talked about the Pentagon). They mentioned the lightpoles, which were knocked over by the aircraft. It was a large aircraft going in at high speeds. I'm pretty sure it can knock a lightpole out of the ground.

Secondly, there were no marks on the lawn because they poured dirt over the lawn so the trucks wouldn't ruin the lawn. You really couldn't see the lawn in front of the building very well.

Thirdly, it used the reporter's quote that I was talking about. He never said there was no aircraft he just said there were no traces. They did find parts of the aircraft all around the lawn and what not (you can see some of it in some photos). The plane was going at like 500mph or something (I don't know) and it smalled into re-enforced concrete walls. Of course you won't see a plane sticking out of the building. They later found other parts of the aircraft as they cleaned out the Pentagon.

Riot, I dont see how watching the video is a disrespect. The people who made the video care just as much for the people who died as you do. If you look at their website theres memorial stuff on it.

I have to agree. The reason people make these videos isn't to disrespect those who lost their lives...it's to try to find the truth.

I watched about 30 minutes of the video, and I must say, they did make some interesting arguments.

Here's what troubles me: There are SOOOOOO many holes and SO MUCH evidence pointing to foul play. You'd think that if this really was a coverup, the government would do a better job of it? Such as maybe leaving more debris at the pentagon...I don't know. And there's a lot of stuff in there that we don't know is true or not. Did Osama really get admitted into an American hospital in Dubai shortly before the attacks?

Secondly, there were no marks on the lawn because they poured dirt over the lawn so the trucks wouldn't ruin the lawn. You really couldn't see the lawn in front of the building very well.

Thirdly, it used the reporter's quote that I was talking about. He never said there was no aircraft he just said there were no traces. They did find parts of the aircraft all around the lawn and what not (you can see some of it in some photos). The plane was going at like 500mph or something (I don't know) and it smalled into re-enforced concrete walls. Of course you won't see a plane sticking out of the building. They later found other parts of the aircraft as they cleaned out the Pentagon.

You should've watched more...the few parts of the "plane" they found are not parts of the plane that supposedly crashed into the Pentagon...they're from some type of missile.

They also used a mathematical formula to figure out that the plane could not have dissolved as officials said it did.

How do we know if a plane can't dissolve? Did they go and test a commerical jet packed with fuel and crash it into a re-enforced concrete. Nobody knew what this kind of damage could do.

And I didn't know missile's had the same design as American Airlines.

How do we know if a plane can't dissolve? Did they go and test a commerical jet packed with fuel and crash it into a re-enforced concrete. Nobody knew what this kind of damage could do.

And I didn't know missile's had the same design as American Airlines.

Watch the video Riot. They used a proven mathematical formula using the elements the jet fuel is made from and the element the body of the plane is made from. They figured out that the jet fuel would not be hot enough to dissolve the plane.

Missiles don't have the same design as American Airlines. The pieces that were found at the scene do not match the parts on the plane.

Riot, have you ever considered writing books? I'd buy your books. Seriously.

It would take 40 minutes of 2,000+ temperatures to completely burn the plane off, and that's if the fuel is constantly being fed. But in this crash, all of the fuel would have burned off immediately.

This is scientific fact, not conspiracy.

Riot you need to watch the entire video, not 5 minutes. Five minutes doesnt validate your opinions. The whole video would though

How do we know if a plane can't dissolve? Did they go and test a commerical jet packed with fuel and crash it into a re-enforced concrete. Nobody knew what this kind of damage could do.

And I didn't know missile's had the same design as American Airlines.

Missiles don't have the same design as American Airlines. The pieces that were found at the scene do not match the parts on the plane.

Debris found in Pentagon


Does that not look like this?



There are is a lot of talk about the SIZE of the hole in the building. The hole in the building was about 13 feet to 20 feet. A boeing aircraft cylinder is roughly 13 feet tall. Now, the hanger that they park in and the actual aircraft (from landing gear to top fin) is a lot taller and that is the figure that most conspiracy theorists use when they talk about the size of the aircraft creating that little hole. However, I think it's fair to say that the fin would not penerate the wall enough to make a hole and that the size of the whole should be roughly the size of the cabin, which is about 13 feet. So if that was in the video do not believe that. A 40 foot object did not hit pentagon, it was a 13 foot cylinder.

Here are some more photos that show debris from a boeing 757 aircraft at the crash site.








This photo right here shows part of the engine used on a 757 aircraft. Experts say that is the APU (Aux Power Unit) that is equppied with the RB211 engines on a typical 757 aircraft (they use 6 different engines on 757 across the globe, but this aircraft was using Rolls-Royce RB211 engines). So as you can see, part of the engine and other parts of the landing gear and aircraft were captured in photographs on the crash site. Just because you see a photo and there isn't any there doesn't mean that there aren't there. You just have to find the right photographs. The conspiracy theories do a good job of not showing these ones.


That is another part of the engine that was found in the wreckage. Once again, experts say that looks like the diffusor section of the compressor in a RB211 engine. I, obviously, am not certified or have enough knowledge to tell that myself but it appears that that is excatly what it is.


Another piece of debris that came from an American Airlines flight. Witnesses say that debris was "raining down from the sky for minutes after the crash".

A very heavy desil generator was smashed and moved during the crash. Do you think a missle of some sort would have been able to do that? Only something extremely heavy would be able to do that kind of damage to the generator.




Here are numerous eyewitness reports that say they saw an airliner. Don't tell me that the government paid them off.

"Aydan Kizildrgli, an English language student who is a native of Turkey, saw the jetliner bank slightly then strike a western wall of the huge five-sided building that is the headquarters of the nation's military. 'There was a big boom,' he said. 'Everybody was in shock. I turned around to the car behind me and yelled "Did you see that?" Nobody could believe it.'"
- "Bush Vows Retaliation for 'Evil Acts'." USA Today, 11 Sep 2001

"Frank Probst, an information management specialist for the Pentagon Renovation Program, left his office trailer near the Pentagon's south parking lot at 9:36 a.m. Sept. 11. Walking north beside Route 27, he suddenly saw a commercial airliner crest the hilltop Navy Annex. American Airlines Flight 77 reached him so fast and flew so low that Probst dropped to the ground, fearing he'd lose his head to its right engine."
- "A Defiant Recovery." The Retired Officer Magazine, January 2002

"Omar Campo, a Salvadorean, was cutting the grass on the other side of the road when the plane flew over his head. 'It was a passenger plane. I think an American Airways plane,' Mr Campo said. 'I was cutting the grass and it came in screaming over my head. I felt the impact. The whole ground shook and the whole area was full of fire. I could never imagine I would see anything like that here.'"
- "Pentagon Eyewitness Accounts." The Guardian, 12 Sep 2001

"Afework Hagos, a computer programmer, was on his way to work but stuck in a traffic jam near the Pentagon when the plane flew over. 'There was a huge screaming noise and I got out of the car as the plane came over. Everybody was running away in different directions. It was tilting its wings up and down like it was trying to balance. It hit some lampposts on the way in.'"
- "Pentagon Eyewitness Accounts." The Guardian, 12 Sep 2001

"Henry Ticknor, intern minister at the Unitarian Universalist Church of Arlington, Virginia, was driving to church that Tuesday morning when American Airlines Flight 77 came in fast and low over his car and struck the Pentagon. 'There was a puff of white smoke and then a huge billowing black cloud,' he said."
- "Hell on Earth." UU World, Jan/Feb 20

"We were the only people, we think, who saw it live," Dan Creed said. He and two colleagues from Oracle software were stopped in a car near the Naval Annex, next to the Pentagon, when they saw the plane dive down and level off. "It was no more than 30 feet off the ground, and it was screaming. It was just screaming. It was nothing more than a guided missile at that point," Creed said. "I can still see the plane. I can still see it right now. It's just the most frightening thing in the world, going full speed, going full throttle, its wheels up," - Ahwatukee Foothill News

Gary Bauer former Presidential candidate, "I looked at the woman sitting in the car next to me. She had this startled look on her face. We were all thinking the same thing. We looked out the front of our windows to try to see the plane, and it wasn�t until a few seconds later that we realized the jet was coming up behind us on that major highway. And it veered to the right into the Pentagon. The blast literally rocked all of our cars. It was an incredible moment." Massachusetts News

Sean Boger, Air Traffic Controller and Pentagon tower chief - "I just looked up and I saw the big nose and the wings of the aircraft coming right at us and I just watched it hit the building," Air Traffic Controller and Pentagon tower chief Sean Boger said. "It exploded. I fell to the ground and covered my head. I could actually hear the metal going through the building." dcmilitary.com November 16, 2001

"The only way you could tell that an aircraft was inside was that we saw pieces of the nose gear. The devastation was horrific. It was obvious that some of the victims we found had no time to react. The distance the firefighters had to travel down corridors to reach the fires was a problem. With only a good 25 minutes of air in their SCBA bottles, to save air they left off their face pieces as they walked and took in a lot of smoke," Captain Defina said. Captain Defina was the shift commander [of an aircraft rescue firefighters crew.] NFPA Journal November 1, 2001

Review of facts-

* Size of 757 matches the initial size of hole in the building - somewhere between 13 and 16 feet (757 is 13 feet wide/high)
* Rims found in building match those of a 757
* Small turbine engine outside is an APU
* Same engine has been clearly stated to not match a Global Hawk engine
* Blue seats from 757 laying on ground in photos
* Part of "American" fuselage logo visible in more than 1 photo
* Engine parts photographed inside match a Rolls-Royce RB211
* Structural components photographed in wreckage match Boeing paint primer schemes
* Large deisel generator in front of building hit by a large heavy object
* Large deisel engine outside is spun towards the building - could not be result of bomb blast or missile explosion
* Multiple eye witnesses say they saw an airliner
* Multiple eye witnesses say they saw an airliner hit the Pentagon
* 60+ bodies, matching the passenger list and flight crew roster identified and returned to families from Pentagon wreckage

I got most of my sources from here .

I hope you take this post seriously and try not to call me brainwashed and ignorant.

Riot.

WATCH THE FUCKING VIDEO.

You're making a damned fool of yourself. Several pieces of that 'wreckage' are NOT the correct parts from the plane, as the video clearly shows. You could have watched the whole goddamn thing by now, but instead you keep responding to the video with SHIT THAT IS DISPROVEN IN IT. Watch the video before you argue the video anymore.

^^^That is no where near the size of the planes actual engine. The video addresses that.



^^^Also addressed in the video. That is actually one of the parts found in the missile the conspirators think hit the pentagon.



^^^Also addressed in the video, though I don't remember exactly what they said about it.

And how do you explain the hole? No evidence of wings, engines, tail, etc.

Riot.

WATCH THE FUCKING VIDEO.

You're making a damned fool of yourself. Several pieces of that 'wreckage' are NOT the correct parts from the plane, as the video clearly shows. You could have watched the whole goddamn thing by now, but instead you keep responding to the video with SHIT THAT IS DISPROVEN IN IT. Watch the video before you argue the video anymore.

Those parts have been CONFIRMED by INDEPENDENT inspectors that they are in fact from a 757 airliner.

^^^That is no where near the size of the planes actual engine. The video addresses that.

It is not the actual full engine, it is the APU of the engine.

Here's another site that debunks more myths:

http://www.popularmechanics.com/science ... 27842.html

FACT: When American Airlines Flight 77 hit the Pentagon's exterior wall, Ring E, it created a hole approximately 75 ft. wide, according to the ASCE Pentagon Building Performance Report. The exterior facade collapsed about 20 minutes after impact, but ASCE based its measurements of the original hole on the number of first-floor support columns that were destroyed or damaged. Computer simulations confirmed the findings.

Why wasn't the hole as wide as a 757's 124-ft.-10-in. wingspan? A crashing jet doesn't punch a cartoon-like outline of itself into a reinforced concrete building, says ASCE team member Mete Sozen, a professor of structural engineering at Purdue University. In this case, one wing hit the ground; the other was sheared off by the force of the impact with the Pentagon's load-bearing columns, explains Sozen, who specializes in the behavior of concrete buildings. What was left of the plane flowed into the structure in a state closer to a liquid than a solid mass. "If you expected the entire wing to cut into the building," Sozen tells PM, "it didn't happen."

The tidy hole in Ring C was 12 ft. wide--not 16 ft. ASCE concludes it was made by the jet's landing gear, not by the fuselage.

As for the videos , I absolutely refuse to view any of them because I am convinced from what I saw that day that 2 planes hit the WTC , a plane was crashed in Pennsylvania , and a plane hit the Pentagon. I was extremely angered a couple of months ago when students who were trying to spread the word posted yellow papers all over a college building trying to persuade people to watch the loose change videos and asking theoretical questions like "Can fire burn through steel?". To me , any 9/11 conspiracy is a load of crap and as Riot said , any conspiracy to cover this up would be absolutely huge.

The biggest thing I wonder is this:

The plane body itself could probably punch a hole in a wall like the one in the Pentagon, but there are absolutely no marks on the walls around the hole where the wings would have hit the walls, and if they didnt come off knocking down light poles they would have been on the plane strong enough to make some sort of dent, crack, or at least mark on the walls.

On top of that the hole punched through multiple layers of steel reenforced concrete and nothing came out on the other side. (except maybe what was carried away under the blue tarps that the gov't has refused to show us.

If you've ever seen a video of a plane crashing into a concrete barrier you know that it literraly desenegrates into dust, and after blasting through one layer of steel reenforced concrete you'd think it would have the strength, momentum, or mass to punch through multiple layers.

It'd be one thing if it punched through a bunch of layers and finally crashed into a wall where it had no more force left and there was a little wreckage left, but it punched through layers and made an exit hole and nothing was there.

Riot.

WATCH THE FUCKING VIDEO.

You're making a damned fool of yourself. Several pieces of that 'wreckage' are NOT the correct parts from the plane, as the video clearly shows. You could have watched the whole goddamn thing by now, but instead you keep responding to the video with SHIT THAT IS DISPROVEN IN IT. Watch the video before you argue the video anymore.

"WATCH THE VIDEO, BE BRAINWAHSED LIKE ME <chuckle.". He doesn't have to watch anything he doesnt wish to. Additionally, how can you put the word wreckage in inverted comma's. Whats interesting to me is you have such a no sympathy stance with someone in a motorcycle accident, but then you try to gloirfy (or at least pass the blame) with terrorists. You are a cocksucker ... oh wait, in your mind is that further evolution of humans, with a homosexual act? Spastic.

He doesnt have to watch the video, but to have a valid argument against it he does.

Thats like saying that you have to go into iraq to criticise it...

Thats like saying that you have to go into iraq to criticise it...

No it's not. We criticise the War in Iraq because of the reason we went to war. You don't have to be in Iraq to critisice that.

But you can't critisice a video you didn't watch, or a movie you didn't watch.

Stop arguing just to argue.

Thats like saying that you have to go into iraq to criticise it...

No, It's like saying "I refuse to look at any fossils of Neanderthals, Dinosaurs, and Homo Erectus because evolution is not real"

Or like saying, "Bill and Ted's excellent adventure sucks, but I havent seen it"

You would have to watch videos of Iraq to get a good argument about it.

You would have to watch videos of Iraq to get a good argument about it.

LOL!!! That's the funniest thing I've ever heard, kudos to you sir.

No, if you watch the videos of Iraq that are available to us, you'll see shootings, raids, car bombs, etc. We're talking about the decision to go into Iraq you joker.