The Official South Park Thread

[Andrew]

I thought it was a really good end to an up-and-down season. No "epic adventure", just a down-to-earth story revolving around the kids and excellent use of the secondary characters, especially the goth kids who have proven to be a pretty good addition to the cast over the years. Butters taking the vamp culture literally was great, though his father being an unreasonable jerk is becoming a bit passe. It did make his rebellion entertaining though.

[Doobie]

I just saw the woodland critter christmas again. I forgot how funny this episode actually was. I think I actually died and came back to earth. Oh my god wow I'm still laughing.

[Andrew]

It was pretty good, I caught it again recently during a South Park marathon on the Comedy Channel. For me it kind of loses its impact/shock value after the first viewing though.

[ixcuincle]

New episodes coming up this Wednesday

[Andrew]

Cool, thanks for the heads up.

[Oznogrd]

Here's hoping for a strong season 13

[Andrew]

Agreed, Season 12 was alright but I still feel it was the weakest in a while.

[Oznogrd]

Certainly not best episode ever but pretty good nonetheless. Once again awkward watching it with my 70 year old grandmother but there were times i almost fell off the couch laughing.

[Andrew]

I thought it started off really well but tapered off a bit when it brought in Mickey Mouse and got a bit cliche with the "Disney turns out to be evil" commentary/satire. Decent but too much of a re-tread of a comedy standard (Disney not being as wholesome as they appear to be/claiming to be "family friendly" while still using sex to sell) as well as their own common plot device (boys stumble upon a conspiracy) to be brilliant.

[benji]

I think the criticism of Disney was secondary to their criticism of people who buy into it. I think "Mr. Mouse" was speaking for them quite a bit in his end rant.

Similar to many other episodes where the criticism is targeted more at peoples' allowance of and complicity in the "evil" to get its way than it is of the "evil" itself.

[Andrew]

Good point, though I think they did it better - and in a much funnier way - in those previous episodes.

[cyanide]

Regarding the last episode:
Is South Park the Most Moral Show on TV?

[benji]

That blog entry sucks. Time is such a horrible enterprise.

But yes, it pretty much, along with King of the HIll, has been for years.

[Andrew]

Which is funny to think given its traditional use of scatalogical humour and all the accusations that it's destroying society, etc etc.

[benji]

But that's just people who are paying attention to the method of delivery, outward appearance and the guys love of old fashioned toliet humor. South Park is seeped in liberalism in all it's philosophical forms. Most episodes feature a social criticism at some level, but only when Stan spells it out do most people realize it.

It's the difference between South Park and something shit like Family Guy which is constantly trying to make social commentary. Compare for example the Wal-Mart episodes. Family Guy positions it as this powerful inhumane evil that destroys the town so they drive a tank through it. South Park accurately criticizes us for any proliferation of big box stores. Explicitly with the "heart" of the store, and the ending where everyone goes off to shop at Jim's Drugs and then True Value.

Everyone remembers "Gnomes" for the underpants gnomes, but foremost it's a social/political criticism on localism vs. corporatism.

That's why it's moral. Most people who critique media or art on moral terms are obsessed with meanginless "shock value" instead of their actual moral claims.

[el badman]

That's a good way to put it, and it really makes more and more sense season after season. That makes you wonder what kind of creative process the writers are going through, when comparing Simpsons/Family Guy (even if the amalgam is not necessarily fair here) and South Park. Instead of making quick hit-or-miss shots (FG) or half-assed stories (Simpsons) about certain cultural phenomenons, it seems like the SP guys do consider all the inherent implications on today's society, the causes and consequences, and they dedicate an entire episode to it, even if the initial premise is sometimes absurd.

Even though they've had highs and lows like any other series, it just feels like South Park consistently achieves the right mix of entertainment value and social criticism. While "bad" South Park episodes are rarely embarrassingly painful to watch, it certainly hasn't been that way in the past few years for its two counterparts. Many older Simpsons and FG episodes are among my personal favorite TV moments, but boy do these two suck when the inspiration runs out. They don't have to be as well balanced as South Park, but at least they really have to avoid the obvious creative laziness that has plagued both shows lately.

[benji]

As I said in the other thread, the modern Family Guy/Simpsons is more focused on the scenarios. Early Simpsons and the pre-cancellation Family Guy was more willing to follow a singular plot that focused on the characters and their reaction to events. Simpsons did this first with Bart, then Homer, Family Guy around Peter. Eventually both abandoned this and used the characters merely as a vehicle to get to the jokes.

American Dad and King of the Hill continue to focus on the characters as part of the plot and their success continues. South Park, is similar in that they know how to use the characters to drive the plot (Cartman will oppose this!) rather than the plot (PETER NEEDS TO BE GAY LOLOLOL) driving the characters. I think South Park has lost a lot compared to say KOTH, but it's still heads above Family Guy and the Simpsons because it doesn't compromise the majority of the characters (I'd say it has done it with a few like Garrison) to tell bad jokes/references but instead works harder to fit the characters into the jokes and the story.

I think it's an instance of the writers on Simpsons/Family Guy knowing the popular aspects (Bart = rebel, Homer = dumb, Lisa = smart...see above for the Family Guy chart, etc.) of the characters, while on South Park/KOTH you have the creators still actively involved so they know the characters much deeper. And both South Park and KOTH is more willing to work their messages into the story (as in the characters reaching the conclusions with you), while Family Guy in particular beats you over the head with it.

[Andrew]

Well put, the Wal-Mart episodes are definitely a fine example of that.

As far as The Simpsons is concerned, it's probably time for Al Jean to step aside as the show runner. He's one of the people who contributed greatly to the success of the show in the early days and wrote/co-wrote some fantastic episodes but having become the longest running show runner to date, the vision and approach is growing stale. It's funny to think he co-write the brilliant "The Way We Was" which still stands as my favourite flashback episode, yet approved the terrible "That 90s Show" which pissed all over the established canon and charming backstory the former episode created.

Then there's the decreased involvement of Matt Groening and James L Brooks, not to mention the complete absence of Sam Simon (though to be fair he's been gone since the fourth season) which ties into what you pointed out about the creators of South Park/King of the Hill still being actively involved and the original vision and spirit of the show still being kept in mind. Perhaps the current writing staff for The Simpsons and Family Guy (FG in particular) have bought too much into their own hype. The Simpsons has been running so long it's become an institution that some don't dare criticise and Family Guy beat cancellation which in some people's minds probably makes it seem bulletproof as well. They've both been pretty dismissive of fan dissent so I don't see anything changing anytime soon.

[ixcuincle]

From the Comedy Central Press Release:

"THE COON"
IN AN ALL-NEW "SOUTH PARK" ON
WEDNESDAY, MARCH 18 AT 10:00 P.M. ON COMEDY CENTRAL‚


NEW YORK, March 16, 2009 – One young citizen takes it upon himself to maintain order during a time of despair in South Park. An all-new episode of "South Park" titled, "Who Is The Coon?,” premiers on Wednesday, March 18 at 10:00 p.m. on COMEDY CENTRAL.

“The Coon” rises from the trash and takes his place as a lone vigilante who wipes out crime in the town of South Park. A rival superhero appears on the scene in the form of “Mysterion” and challenges the Coon’s place as a “symbol” for the town.

Lol

[Jackal]

What a boring episode.

[JaoSming]

i enjoyed it, thought it was a bit slower paced but I was laughing for most of it

[Andrew]

I thought it was great, sure beats another played out conspiracy plot or Kyle vs Cartman episode in my book. I was kind of disappointed they didn't truly reveal Mysterion's identity but it was a good joke all the same that made fun of their simple character designs.

[el badman]

I liked it too, it wasn't quite as rich as the previous one but they kept it simple and funny.

[Oznogrd]

Most of it other than cartmans anger for those that didnt catch it was straight lifted from Dark Knight and Watchmen.
I want a big wheel like cartmans.

[Andrew]

I thought their parody was pretty well done, much better than you'll find on current Family Guy eps or the latest "(Whatever) Movie".