The politics thread

[cyanide]

Or I could post an article about how the US Military are paying the Iraqi press to write propaganda articles about the success of the war, etc., thus pissing off the Pentagon for breaking the first rule of democracy... but I won't.

[Riot]

Or I could post an article about how the US Military are paying the Iraqi press to write propaganda articles about the success of the war, etc., thus pissing off the Pentagon for breaking the first rule of democracy... but I won't.

Yeah, that's a problem but that is done in every war. Shouldn't be happening, but the Iraqi journalists do it because they want the money. Greedy bastards.

[Bang]

Or I could post an article about how the US Military are paying the Iraqi press to write propaganda articles about the success of the war, etc., thus pissing off the Pentagon for breaking the first rule of democracy... but I won't.

Yeah, that's a problem but that is done in every war. Shouldn't be happening, but the Iraqi journalists do it because they want the money. Greedy bastards.

Like there is any other motive? -_-;; Plus they are poor, so they need the money.

[J@3]

Like there is any other motive? -_-;;

You are so Asian.

[Bang]

Like there is any other motive? -_-;;

You are so Asian.

I thought money loving was a caucasian trait.

[The Other Kevin]

No, the -_- emoicon thing.

[Bang]

True...true..
I thought I used that frequently? Guess I didn't use it much in this forum.

[Riot]

Fort Apache. He saw and did a lot and the following is what he said about weapons, equipment, tactics and other miscellaneous info which may be of interest to you. Nothing is by any means classified. No politics here, just a Marine with a bird's eye view's opinions:

1) The M-16 rifle : Thumbs down. Chronic jamming problems with the talcum powder like sand over there. The sand is everywhere. Jordan says you feel filthy 2 minutes after coming out of the shower. The M-4 carbine version is more popular because it's lighter and shorter, but it has jamming problems also. They like the ability to mount the various optical gunsights and weapons lights on the picattiny rails, but the weapon itself is not great in a desert environment. They all hate the 5.56mm (.223) round. Poor penetration on the cinderblock structure common over there and even torso hits cant be reliably counted on to put the enemy down. Fun fact: Random autopsies on dead insurgents shows a high level of opiate use.

2) The M249 SAW (squad assault weapon): .223 cal. Drum fed light machine gun. Big thumbs down. Universally considered a piece of **** Chronic jamming problems, most of which require partial disassembly. (that's fun in the middle of a firefight).

3) The M9 Beretta 9mm: Mixed bag. Good gun, performs well in desert environment; but they all hate the 9mm cartridge. The use of handguns for self-defense is actually fairly common. Same old story on the 9mm: Bad guys hit multiple times and still in the fight.

4) Mossberg 12ga. Military shotgun: Works well, used frequently for clearing houses to good effect.

5) The M240G Machine Gun: 7.62 Nato (.308 ) cal. belt fed machine gun, developed to replace the old M-60 (what a beautiful weapon that was!!). Thumbs up. Accurate, reliable, and the 7.62 round puts 'em down. Originally developed as a vehicle mounted weapon, more and more are being dismounted and taken into the field by infantry. The 7.62 round chews up the structure over there.

6) The M2 .50 cal heavy machine gun: Thumbs way, way up. "Ma deuce" is still worth her considerable weight in gold. The ultimate fight stopper. The most coveted weapon in-theater.

7) The .45 pistol: Thumbs up. Still the best pistol round out there. Everybody authorized to carry a sidearm is trying to get their hands on one. With few exceptions, can reliably be expected to put 'em down with a torso hit. The special ops guys (who are doing most of the pistol work) use the HK military model and supposedly love it. The old government model .45's are being re-issued en masse.

8 ) The M-14: Thumbs up. They are being re-issued in bulk, mostly in a modified version to special ops guys. Modifications include lightweight Kevlar stocks and low power red dot or ACOG sights. Very reliable in the sandy environment, and they love the 7.62 round.

9) The Barrett .50 cal sniper rifle: Thumbs way up. Spectacular range and accuracy and hits like a freight train. Used frequently to take out vehicle suicide bombers ( we actually stop a lot of them) and barricaded enemy. Definitely here to stay.

10) The M40A3 sniper rifle: Thumbs up. Mostly in .308 but some in 300 win mag. Heavily modified Remington 700's. Great performance. Snipers have been used heavily to great effect. Rumor has it that a marine sniper on his third tour in Anbar province has actually exceeded Carlos Hathcock's record for confirmed kills with OVER 100.

11) The new body armor: Thumbs up. Relatively light at approx. 6 lbs. and can reliably be expected to soak up small shrapnel and even will stop an AK-47 round. The bad news: Hot as hell to wear, almost unbearable in the summer heat (which averages over 120 degrees). Also, the enemy now goes for head shots whenever possible. All the stuff about the "old" body armor making our guys vulnerable to the IED's was a non-starter. The IED explosions are enormous and body armor doesn't make any difference at all in most cases.

12) Night Vision and Infrared Equipment: Thumbs way up. Spectacular performance. Our guys see in the dark and own the night, period. Very little enemy action after evening prayers. More and more enemy being whacked at night during movement by hunter-killer teams.

13) Lights: Thumbs up. Most of the weapon mounted and personal lights are Surefire's, and the troops love 'em. Invaluable for night urban operations.

Bad guy weapons:

1) Mostly AK47's The entire country is an arsenal. Works better in the desert than the M16 and the .308 Russian round kills reliably. PKM belt fed light machine guns are also common and effective. Luckily, the enemy mostly shoots poorly. Undisciplined "spray and pray" type fire. However, they are seeing more and more precision weapons, especially sniper rifles. (Iran, again) Fun fact: Captured enemy have apparently marveled at the marksmanship of our guys and how hard they fight. They are apparently told in Jihad school that the Americans rely solely on technology, and can be easily beaten in close quarters combat for their lack of toughness. Let's just say they know better now.

2) The RPG: Probably the infantry weapon most feared by our guys. Simple, reliable and as common as dogcrap. The enemy responded to our up-armored humvees by aiming at the windshields, often at point blank range. Still killing a lot of our guys.

3) The IED: The biggest killer of all. Can be anything from old Soviet anti-armor mines to jury rigged artillery shells. A lot found in Jordan's area were in abandoned cars. The enemy would take 2 or 3 155mm artillery shells and wire them together. Most were detonated by cell phone, and the explosions are enormous. You're not safe in any vehicle, even an M1 tank. Driving is by far the most dangerous thing our guys do over there. Lately, they are much more sophisticated "shape charges" (Iranian) specifically designed to penetrate armor. Fact: Most of the ready made IED's are supplied by Iran, who is also providing terrorists (Hezbollah types) to train the insurgents in their use and tactics. That's why the attacks have been so deadly lately. Their concealment methods are ingenious, the latest being shape charges in Styrofoam containers spray painted to look like the cinderblocks that litter all Iraqi roads. We find about 40% before they detonate, and the bomb disposal guys are unsung heroes of this war.

4) Mortars and rockets: Very prevalent. The soviet era 122mm rockets (with an 18km range) are becoming more prevalent. One of the marine's NCO's lost a leg to one. These weapons cause a lot of damage "inside the wire". Marine's base was hit almost daily his entire time there by mortar and rocket fire, often at night to disrupt sleep patterns and cause fatigue (It did). More of a psychological weapon than anything else. The enemy mortar teams would jump out of vehicles, fire a few rounds, and then haul ass in a matter of seconds.

5) Bad guy technology: Simple yet effective. Most communication is by cell and satellite phones, and also by email on laptops. They use handheld GPS units for navigation and "Google earth" for overhead views of our positions. Their weapons are good, if not fancy, and prevalent. Their explosives and bomb technology is TOP OF THE LINE. Night vision is rare. They are very careless with their equipment and the captured GPS units and laptops are treasure troves of Intel when captured.

Who are the bad guys?:

Most of the carnage is caused by the Zarqawi Al Qaeda group. They operate mostly in Anbar province (Fallujah and Ramadi). These are mostly "foreigners", non-Iraqi Sunni Arab Jihadists from all over the Muslim world (and Europe). Most enter Iraq through Syria (with, of course, the knowledge and complicity of the Syrian govt.) , and then travel down the "rat line" which is the trail of towns along the Euphrates River that we've been hitting hard for the last few months.

Some are virtually untrained young Jihadists that often end up as suicide bombers or in "sacrifice squads". Most, however, are hard core terrorists from all the usual suspects (Al Qaeda, Hezbollah, Hamas etc.) These are the guys running around murdering civilians en masse and cutting heads off. The Chechens (many of whom are Caucasian), are supposedly the most ruthless and the best fighters. (they have been fighting the Russians for years). In the Baghdad area and south, most of the insurgents are Iranian inspired (and led) Iraqi Shiites. The Iranian Shiia have been very adept at infiltrating the Iraqi local govt.'s, the police forces and the Army. The have had a massive spy and agitator network there since the Iran-Iraq war in the early 80's. Most of the Saddam loyalists were killed, captured or gave up long ago.

Bad Guy Tactics: When they are engaged on an infantry level they get their asses kicked every time. Brave, but stupid. Suicidal Banzai-type charges were very common earlier in the war and still occur. They will literally sacrifice 8-10 man teams in suicide squads by sending them screaming and firing Ak's and RPG's directly at our bases just to probe the defenses.

They get mowed down like grass every time. ( see the M2 and M240 above). Jordan's base was hit like this often. When engaged, they have a tendency to flee to the same building, probably for what they think will be a glorious last stand. Instead, we call in air and that's the end of that more often than not. These hole-ups are referred to as Alpha Whiskey Romeo's (Allah's Waiting Room). We have the laser guided ground-air thing down to a science. The fast mover's, mostly Marine F-18's, are taking an ever increasing toll on the enemy. When caught out in the open, the helicopter gunships and AC-130 Spectre gunships cut them to ribbons with cannon and rocket fire, especially at night.

Interestingly, artillery is hardly used at all. Fun fact: The enemy death toll is supposedly between 45-50 thousand. That is why we're seeing less and less infantry attacks and more IED, suicide bomber stuff.

The new strategy is simple: attrition.

The insurgent tactic most frustrating is their use of civilian non-combatants as cover. They know we do all we can to avoid civilian casualties and therefore schools, hospitals and (especially) Mosques are locations where they meet, stage for attacks, cache weapons and ammo and flee to when engaged. They have absolutely no regard whatsoever for civilian casualties. They will terrorize locals and murder without hesitation anyone believed to be sympathetic to the Americans or the new Iraqi govt. Kidnapping of family members (especially children) is common to influence people they are trying to influence but cant reach, such as local govt. officials, clerics, tribal leaders, etc.).

The first thing our guys are told is "don't get captured". They know that if captured they will be tortured and beheaded on the internet.

Zarqawi openly offers bounties for anyone who brings him a live American serviceman. This motivates the criminal element who otherwise don't give a hoot about the war. A lot of the beheading victims were actually kidnapped by common criminals and sold to Zarqawi. As such, for our guys, every fight is to the death. Surrender is not an option.

The Iraqi's are a mixed bag. Some fight well, others aren't worth a **** Most do okay with American support. Finding leaders is hard, but they are getting better. It is widely viewed that Zarqawi's use of suicide bombers, en masse, against the civilian population was a serious tactical mistake. Many Iraqi's were galvanized and the caliber of recruits in the Army and the police forces went up, along with their motivation. It also led to an exponential increase in good intel because the Iraqi's are sick of the insurgent attacks against civilians.

The Kurds are solidly pro-American and fearless fighters.

According to this marine, morale among our guys is very high. They not only believe they are winning, but that they are winning decisively. They are stunned and dismayed by what they see in the American press, whom they almost universally view as against them. The embedded reporters are despised and distrusted. They are inflicting casualties at a rate of 20-1 and then see things like "Are we losing in Iraq" on TV and the print media. For the most part, we are satisfied with equipment, food and leadership. Bottom line though, and they all say this, there are not enough guys there to drive the final stake through the heart of the insurgency, primarily because there aren't enough troops in-theater to shut down the borders with Iran and Syria. The Iranians and the Syrians just cant stand the thought of Iraq being an American ally (with, of course, permanent US bases there).

One of my favorite articles I've every read. A lot of interesting stuff. Thumbs up, no doubt.

[cyanide]

Bush defends phone-tapping and other Big Brother methods of invading into American citizen's privacy

and

Iranian president bans Western music

So this guy's more nuts than Bush.

Mr Ahmadinejad became president this year promising to reverse a recent series of reforms and return Iran to the ultra-conservative atmosphere of the 1979 revolution.

In recent weeks he launched an outspoken attack on Israel, calling for the Jewish state to be "wiped off the map".

He also claimed the Nazi Holocaust, which killed six million Jews, was a "myth".

[Riot]

I'm all for defending the constitution and what not but if President Bush thinks that it will make this country safer than I am all for it. There are a lot of dangerous suspects in America right now (most of them came in through Canada's pathetic borders) and I'm all in favor of the whole "if you have nothing to hide don't worry" theory.

And that Ahmadinejad is the ultimate nutcase. He is one of the main reasons why I think Iran has to be #1 on our list now that we are in Iraq. Iran is not only a threat to the peace in the Middle East but they are a threat to entire world. With that insane weirdo in charge and their refusal to disarm their nuclear program things could turn even uglier in that region.

[cyanide]

There are a lot of dangerous suspects in America right now (most of them came in through Canada's pathetic borders)

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't it the Americans that watch their own borders? (At least we have good borders by not letting in any dangerous suspects.)

[Riot]

Are you serious? Canada is a safe house for dangerous terrorist suspects. There are a lot of KNOWN TERRORIST members in Toronto and other cities inside Canada. It's easy for them to get in and they know they won't be bothered. I could look it up and post some kind of article if you don't believe me but trust me, Canada has it's own border issues. And despite America's wishes, Canada will not arm it's border patrol.

[cyanide]

My point was, if Canada had crappy border policies by letting terrorists into the States, then it doesn't make the States' border any better if they were defending their border.

[Riot]

No, my point is that Canada is letting known terror suspects into their borders and safe housing them. And knowing the Canadian/American border, those guys will probably be able to sneak themselves into America a lot easier now that they are safely in Canada. And I'm really worried about not only America's safety but Canada's safety as well with the known terrorists running around in that country. Could Toronto be a target?

[cyanide]

I don't know.. I haven't really heard anything about terrorism in Canada to be honest. The only time I heard was they caught this key suspect in Ontario or someplace near ocean borders, and that was it.

[Riot]

http://www.renewamerica.us/columns/hughes/050711
http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/000919.php
http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/001032.php

Many of the world's top terrorist organizations are operating inside Canada's borders.

[Ty-Land]

You do realise that a site such as renewamerica.us is a pretty poor resource. All you need to do is look around the site objectively and you'll see what particular bias and point of view they are portraying. It's the same as someone going to an islamic extremist site to present an opposing opinion. It would be considered, in the academic arena, as a very weak argument as their is a clear agenda present.

On a different note, I wonder if there is any links between islamic terrorist groups and speratist extremist in Quebec?? While this might sound a little extreme there were/are clear links between the IRA and Basque speratist movement ETA.

The remarks made by the Iranian President regarding the Holocaust are quite astounding. After visiting a few of the camps in Europe and having met surviviors in Melbourne this is such a disgraceful and ignorant thing to suggest. This raises questions of the leadership of this Islamic fundamentalist state, as the recent remarks and other recent acts must be placing increased international scrutiny on the regime. To this outcome, I think it is best that the US and it's allies wait and watch what unfolds in Iran as increased external criticism of the countries goverment mounts more internal scrutiny will take place. The atrocities and the restricitions on freedoms and the certain rights that are chartered in the UN Human Rights Charter should not go without punishment, hence if push comes to shove military action may be necessary. Hopefully this time it can be supported by the UN and the EU in order to quash further divides between the US and the rest of the world.

[spreeul8r]

No, my point is that Canada is letting known terror suspects into their borders and safe housing them. And knowing the Canadian/American border, those guys will probably be able to sneak themselves into America a lot easier now that they are safely in Canada. And I'm really worried about not only America's safety but Canada's safety as well with the known terrorists running around in that country. Could Toronto be a target?

Shouldnt America invade Canada then? Just messing around.

I came across some good articles the other day...some new some old...but i cant seem to find them right now.

Here is one, ill post the rest later.

http://www.cynthiaforcongress.com/news/ ... -2004.html

Cynthia McKinney on Supporting Our Troops

(CynthiaForCongress.com) - As I watch the increasingly tragic events unfold in Iraq, I am concerned for the health and well-being of our brave men and women in uniform. I'm not only concerned about their survival while in Iraq, but I'm also very concerned about their lives and futures once they home to their families and loved ones. Throughout my tenure in congress, I have dedicated myself to supporting our veterans, active duty troops, and their families. I still do.

Supporting our troops means much more than applauding them for their courage and bravery when they are already in danger. Support for our men and women in uniform also means ensuring that they are only placed in harms way in legitimate defense of America and our allies It means ensuring that they have the proper equipment, intelligence, and weapons they will need to accomplish their mission. And, it means supporting their families by giving them proper pay and reasonable access to health care when they need it.

While in congress and a member of the House Armed services Committee, I introduced legislation H.R.1587, the Agent Orange Respiratory Cancer Act which passed and is now law. Soldiers who had respiratory cancers from their exposure were getting denied their benefits, and that will no longer happen.

I also introduced HR 3155 IH, the Depleted Uranium Munitions Suspension and Study Act, which requires the suspension, sale, development, production, testing, and export of depleted uranium munitions pending the outcome of certain studies on the effects of such weapons.

Many of our troops returning from Iraq are showing signs of depleted uranium exposure and the effects of this exposure range from accelerated cancer rates, lung and respiratory illnesses, to horrible birth defects. Some sick vets were found to be expressing uranium in even their semen. Their intimate partners often complained of a burning sensation during intercourse, followed by their own debilitating illnesses. Monstrous birth defects have been documented in newborn children in Iraq whose parents have been exposed. I fear that the families of our troops may suffer the same horrible fate.

Dr. Asaf Durakovic, a professor of nuclear medicine at Georgetown University, is a former army medical expert. He told nuclear scientists in Paris last year that tens of thousands of sick British and American soldiers are now dying from radiation they encountered during Gulf War I. He found that 62 percent of sick vets tested have uranium isotopes in their organs, bones, brains and urine. Laboratories in Switzerland and Finland corroborated his findings.

According to the Veterans Affairs Department, more than 20,000 soldiers have sought care since returning from Iraq and Afghanistan. With thousands more expected to seek benefits and health care, the VA faces its biggest challenge since the early 1990s.

I also believe that supporting our troops means ensuring that our government works to build and maintain good relations and treaties with our allies and the global community. Our troops should not bear the brunt of what should be the world’s responsibility. In those critical times when we must send our troops into battle, we must not only arm them with the best equipment and protection available, but we must arm them with strong conviction and belief in their purpose and mission.

Supporting our troops means supporting the causes of justice, fairness, and humanity upon which this nation was founded. We must become a more responsible global leader and one which will lead the world into an era of peace, justice, and prosperity. The policies of the Bush administration pose a clear and present danger to the lives and families of our courageous soldiers. It is a policy of unjust and perpetual war without regard for the safety and health of those called upon to fight these wars.

We can do much better and I look forward to my return to congress where I will continue my efforts to defend America and support those who are called upon to make the ultimate sacrifice.

Hopefully ill get to post the rest of the articles (unrelated) before i go away on a short holiday, but if i dont, i want to wish you all a Merry Christmas and Happy New Year...

[Riot]

You do realise that a site such as renewamerica.us is a pretty poor resource. All you need to do is look around the site objectively and you'll see what particular bias and point of view they are portraying. It's the same as someone going to an islamic extremist site to present an opposing opinion. It would be considered, in the academic arena, as a very weak argument as their is a clear agenda present.

No doubt, but I was just showing one of numerous articles and sources that supported my opinion. I found probably find more unbiased websites and sources but I think you get my point.

The remarks made by the Iranian President regarding the Holocaust are quite astounding. After visiting a few of the camps in Europe and having met surviviors in Melbourne this is such a disgraceful and ignorant thing to suggest. This raises questions of the leadership of this Islamic fundamentalist state, as the recent remarks and other recent acts must be placing increased international scrutiny on the regime. To this outcome, I think it is best that the US and it's allies wait and watch what unfolds in Iran as increased external criticism of the countries goverment mounts more internal scrutiny will take place. The atrocities and the restricitions on freedoms and the certain rights that are chartered in the UN Human Rights Charter should not go without punishment, hence if push comes to shove military action may be necessary. Hopefully this time it can be supported by the UN and the EU in order to quash further divides between the US and the rest of the world.

The Iranian government is a complete and utter joke. The young Iranian public is actually very intelligent and very pro-democractic. The only problem is the elder, more conservative Muslims are in control of that country. Which is why I think America must go in there, with military action, and remove the threats from power. I am concerned about the safety of Isreal, Iraq and our troops in the Middle East. There is no reason why they should stay in power any longer, and the United Nations knows this.

[cyanide]

Oh the humanity!

Saddam: "Americans Tortured Me"

I don't know if the guy's bullshitting.

[Riot]

I don't believe a word that man says. Hang him.

[Jackal]

Hehe, now it isn't funny to him? What right does he have to even say "they tortured me"? After the thousands if not millions he hasn't tortured, psh, that bitch.

[Ty-Land]

Regardless of the fact that Saddam himself has tortured thousands during his regime's reign it is still not acceptable if he has been tortured himself. No country, especially the US who is trying to make an example of him, should be advocating torture. If it is in fact true that he has been tortured it increases the criticism of this trial and further promotes the case for this trial to run through the ICC.

And Riot why would you want him to hang? He could spend the next 30 years rotting away in a jail, wouldn't that be a better result. If he is hung he doesn't really have to suffer for long, where the rest of his life in prison would take away the freedoms he has lost tyhe right to deserve because of his actions. I guess you can argue who can decide whether somebodies life should be taken? But that may take us down the path of a philosophical debate. Consequetly if he is hung etc. he will be made as a martyr to those extremist looking for a justification to attack democratic nations.

[J@3]

I think he's great entertainment. They should drag this case on for another few years, I find his insane rantings quite entertaining. Then the fact that some guy is there talking about the torture he witnessed Saddam do, while Saddam is sitting there scribbling on a notepad like he's a lawyer or something

[Riot]

I still strongly believe that the worse thing you can do to someone is take their life away. We should take Saddam's life away.