Michael Moore violates Canadian AND US Election Laws!

[Matthew]

Oh top stuff, lets delete posts becuase they show your hyprocisy, thats the egarret way to do things, try to handle somthing publicly, then when it doesnt work, delete posts or lock threads... speaking of talking on topic, why havent you contributed to this thread? its been all off topic by you "Moderator supreme"

[Matt]

1. I'll check the movie out. Bottom line is that all politicians are idiots and don't deserve my vote, especially Mr Sheen

2. I don't really like that Jada song, but it gets him publicity and therefore record sales which = $$$$$$$. And maybe to answer Jada's question, perhaps Bush is the terrorist

[Matthew]

I think the shadow foreign affairs minister looks more like mr sheen than johny howard. if you want a comparison look at simon cream and the count of seasme streat, priceless .

John howard deserves my vote. Think of labours history of driving us into dept. They can't manage.. it's that simple. Mark Laetham has virtually declared that goth whitlam is his advisor, but goth whitlam was thrown out becuase he drove us into bankruptcy in 1975. Mark Lathaem did the same to liverpool city council. Imagine if this idiot gets in as pm....

btw matt, why wouldnt you vote for johnny? (im not trying to sway you, just want to see why he is so hated..)

[Jackal]

If you supposedly want to work things out in an intelligent and mature manner, then you both should be conducting yourselves like people who are, intelligent, mature and respectful. You're not, at all.

If someone wants to carry on the rest of the discussion, go ahead.

You attack my intelligence & question if I'm mature, you expect me not to carry on the discussion? You think you have the right to say what you feel like saying without someone actually asking you to shut the fuck up, PLEASE? (See Matt, that's being polite!) Anyways, since I'm not mature, nor am I respectful (to you only..) & I'm obviously not intelligent, duh...let's handle this the way you would handle it: In an intelligent, mature way.

Topic Locked

Wow, real mature.

Come on folks, applaud the fact he's so mature.

Don't make comments about my intelligence or my maturity, this way you won't get back mean comments that are called flames.

You want to be mature, don't attack someone's intelligence.

This so called goodwill for bettering the forum, it's all good, just don't respond to a request (to get back on topic, since when was this wrong?) with a flame. You blatantly attacked mine AND Matthew's intelligence. Shows alot of goodwill to better the forum.

Hmm, goodwill...sounds familiar.

[benji]

Talib Kweli's..."The Proud"

Who doesn't love two year old extremist rants?

I remember Oklahoma when they put out the blaze
And put Islamic terrorist bombing, on the front page
It's like saying only gays get AIDS, propaganda

Except that Terry Nichols had numerous meetings with Islamist terrorists (including an al Qaeda agent), that the FBI had intially (and then ol Janet immediately poo-pooed it) evidence it was an Islamist terror attack and that a Middle Eastern man fled the truck with McVeigh.

That kinda line at the end is slightly hypocritical...especially since he spends a good third of the song saying all Cops are racists that kill black people for jollies...

Of course...there's

Wrong! It's just the beginning, the first inning

Is Talib threatening more terrorist attacks?

And that whole verse is just junk

They don't wanna raise the babies so the election is fixed
That's why we don't be fuckin with politics

Except the 2000 election wasn't fixed...except that blacks vote overwhelmingly (85-90%) Democrat even though the Republican party platform is more in line with the beliefs of theirs...

Then ol' Talib ATTACKS HIS FIVE YEAR OLD SON for thinking (like nearly all children do) that police officers are kewl.

I already know the deal but what the fuck do I tell my son?
I want him livin right, livin good, respect the rules
He's five years old and he still thinkin cops is cool

Of course, before he goes Talib says America had 9/11 coming and implies it got what it deserved on 9/11...

America kill the innocent too, the cycle of violence is sad

Yeah, his political analysis is great and he certainly proved to me that

The President is Bush, the Vice President's a Dick
So a whole lot of fuckin is what we gon' get

I'd certainly look to him for political guidance

But to be fair to Mr. Phillips.

Why did bush knock down the towers
...
And why do niggaz lie in eighty-five percent of they rhymes
...
Why niggaz can't get no jobs
...
Why they ain't give us a cure for aids
...
Why the whole world love my voice

Well, we can certainly say that Mr. Phillips lives up to that second line...

As for the first one...Mr. Phillips explains:

"Obviously it's only a metaphor," Jadakiss says in a telephone interview Thursday from his tour bus outside of Toledo.

Perhaps Mr. Phillips need to learn what the word "metaphor" means...

"But on the same note," he adds, "I think that before 9/11 the intelligence agencies weren't communicating a lot of the important information. And ultimately, at the end of the day, he's the boss. The buck stops with him."

The rapper known to his fans as Kiss sounds like he's undergone a bit of media coaching since July 9, when he told Billboard.com: "I just felt [Bush] had something to do with it. That's why I put it in there like that."

...

"Let 'em come at me," he says of critics. "I ain't done nothing that Michael Moore ain't done. "

So is Kiss admitting he's a liar, a fraud, a propagandist, a seditionist, supports terrorism against the United States, and violates election laws?

Asked about his label's decision to omit the Bush reference from some radio and video versions of the song, Jadakiss sounds a bit beleaguered. "Well, you know how the politics are today," he says. "The censorship is crazy."

Oh yeah, that "censorship." That censorship that sends the Dixie Chicks, Michael Moore, Linda Ronstandt, Sean Penn, etc. to publicity highs they've never before seen. That censorship that sends Mr. Phillips to number one on the charts. That censorship that allows people like Mr. Phillips to make millions of dollars off of saying, in a time of war, that the President killed thousands of Americans.

I wish I was censored like Mr. Phillips.

African American social commentator John McWhorter is equally scornful. "Ever since the '60s, the essence of black authenticity is outrage," he said. "As reasons for alienation recede, it has become okay for black people to be outright incoherent in their alienation. So he can say anything he wants as long as he's angry. He's not an intellectual, he's a rapper, so of course he's going to have stupid things to say in his lyrics. Jadakiss knows as much about geopolitics as someone shopping at Wal-Mart."

[GloveGuy]

I guess that shows how weak the opposition to george w. is when the haters have to quote rap lyrics as an arguement against him

That wasn't my argument. It was just a quote from a song that I found comical, moreso than the one that Gripni posted.

I don't need rap lyrics to boast my argument on why Bush is an awful President and a moron. But I'd rather not start an argument on that matter with a stubborn Conservative such as Ben.

Also, I think that "The Proud" is a great song and the rap world needs more rappers like Talib Kweli who actually have some political insight.

[Matthew]

let's handle this the way you would handle it: In an intelligent, mature way.

Don't be silly PJ, since when has EG handled anything in a mature way? EG's style is "I'm right, because I'm Egarret, damn it!"

I don't need rap lyrics to boast my argument on why Bush is an awful President and a moron. But I'd rather not start an argument on that matter with a stubborn Conservative such as Ben.

Heheh he's stubburn becuase he is right?

Also, I think that "The Proud" is a great song and the rap world needs more rappers like Talib Kweli who actually have some political insight.

Re read bens post about how much "insight" he has... according to you anyone who says "george bush is a terrorist" has "insight"

[GloveGuy]

Heheh he's stubburn becuase he is right?

It's not about being right or wrong. His conservative views just happen to differ from my liberal views. It's a matter of opinion, which is why there's no real point in arguing about it. I'll never understand how Ben can live such a conservative life and support someone such as George Bush, just like he probably doesn't understand why I support the Democrat, Kerry, and live a more liberal lifestyle.

Re read bens post about how much "insight" he has... according to you anyone who says "george bush is a terrorist" has "insight"

That was Jadakiss. Talib said nothing of the sort. And I guess I should probably respond to Ben's views on the song.

Except that Terry Nichols had numerous meetings with Islamist terrorists (including an al Qaeda agent), that the FBI had intially (and then ol Janet immediately poo-pooed it) evidence it was an Islamist terror attack and that a Middle Eastern man fled the truck with McVeigh.

That wasn't the point of the message. He was criticizing the media for automatically assuming it was Islamic terrorists fully responsible for the attack. Who would've thought that it was a white man already living in this United States who was the catalyst in the attack.

Is Talib threatening more terrorist attacks?

Threatening, no. But he is stating that it is possible. The Islamic World's hate on the United States is far from over. Terrorists could strike on our nation any day now.

Except the 2000 election wasn't fixed...except that blacks vote overwhelmingly (85-90%) Democrat even though the Republican party platform is more in line with the beliefs of theirs...

I too wouldn't say it was fixed, but why were there cops keeping people who lived in the projects and the inner city out of the election buildings?...plus there were many instances where people intended to vote for Gore but the ballots had them down as voting for Nader.

Then ol' Talib ATTACKS HIS FIVE YEAR OLD SON for thinking (like nearly all children do) that police officers are kewl.

Clearly, you don't understand what he's talking about. There are crooked cops in this country who go around patrolling the inner cities, creating havoc on the people who live there. You must've forgotten his interlude before that verse where he gives an example of crooked cops getting away with crimes that had they not been cops, they would most likely have had a punishment bestowed on them.

August 4, 2001
A drunken police officer mows down an entire family in Brooklyn
The judge lets him go with no bail
It reminds us, of just how worthless our lives are to the justice system
I struggle, to explain the situation to my son, it's hard

[benji]

That wasn't the point of the message. He was criticizing the media for automatically assuming it was Islamic terrorists fully responsible for the attack. Who would've thought that it was a white man already living in this United States who was the catalyst in the attack.

We don't know that. Perhaps this Middle Eastern man who may be part of a terrorist group, who fled the scene, was that catalyst. The American militas aren't the most advanced of people. And it wasn't the media who "assumed" that, they were reporting what the FBI had initally concluded before Janet and crew brought the gauntlet down.

I too wouldn't say it was fixed, but why were there cops keeping people who lived in the projects and the inner city out of the election buildings?

They weren't. Not that losing a few hundred votes in any inner city would do anything (since they vote 80% Democrat anyway.

plus there were many instances where people intended to vote for Gore but the ballots had them down as voting for Nader.

Because they voted for Nader before they realized he was the path to defeat.

George W. Bush got more votes (and a higher %) than Bill Clinton ever did. 57% of the country voted against Bill Clinton in 1992, and 51% against in 1996.

Clearly, you don't understand what he's talking about. There are crooked cops in this country who go around patrolling the inner cities, creating havoc on the people who live there. You must've forgotten his interlude before that verse where he gives an example of crooked cops getting away with crimes that had they not been cops, they would most likely have had a punishment bestowed on them.

I know what he's talking about. But he's attacking his son for thinking cops are kewl. There are a few crooked cops out there, just like there are crooked everythings. But for Talib to insinuate that ALL cops are crooked and that his son is a moron for thinking that law enforcement is kewl, while earlier in the song attacking others for "assuming" all terrorists are muslim is a wee bit (as in very) hypocritical on his part.

It's not about being right or wrong. His conservative views just happen to differ from my liberal views. It's a matter of opinion, which is why there's no real point in arguing about it. I'll never understand how Ben can live such a conservative life and support someone such as George Bush, just like he probably doesn't understand why I support the Democrat, Kerry, and live a more liberal lifestyle.

I don't believe you can say that. You can't understand how I live "such a conservative life" because I don't. I'm just opposed to socialism and appeasement so I have to vote Republican.

I can, however, admit George W. Bush is far from perfect. He's always trying to get along with everybody and make everyone happy. He's finally accepting he can't do that as he showed in dissing the NAACP and in his speech to the Urban League. So he does provide some hope.

I don't blindly support George W. Bush. I oppose him probably ten times as much as you do Kerry. However. Since John F. Kerry has vowed to lose the war, damage the economy and add some $2 trillion in "shit" spending I can't take it upon myself to vote for him.

As the issues2000.org test said I'm a social liberal, fiscal conservative. Though it didn't say I'm NOW an activist foreign policier. They call us Kennedy-Reagan Democrats.

The Left doesn't support John F. Kerry, they're just enflamed with their ABB mentality. Anybody But Bush.

I'm down with ABK.

And I'm so Pro-Cheney, Rumsfeld and Rice because they roxxor hardcore. Especially Cheney.

[GloveGuy]

George W. Bush got more votes (and a higher %) than Bill Clinton ever did. 57% of the country voted against Bill Clinton in 1992, and 51% against in 1996.

but Clinton won the popular vote in ever election he had. Bush only got more votes because of the weak Third Party that year. Ross Perot received 8 million and 19 million votes respectively. Whether Bush had more than Clinton(only in popular votes) ever had, he still didn't have as much as Gore.

attacking his son for thinking cops are kewl. There are a few crooked cops out there, just like there are crooked everythings. But for Talib to insinuate that ALL cops are crooked and that his son is a moron for thinking that law enforcement is kewl, while earlier in the song attacking others for "assuming" all terrorists are muslim is a wee bit (as in very) hypocritical on his part.

Yes, but is it right to say that all cops represent everything that's good in this world. Cops surely do a ton of good, but there are those that are bad and take advantage of their authority. I was watching "Cops" and I saw one officer yelling at two, poor 7 year old kids for using a counterfeit $20 bill to buy a candybar. They didn't even know it was counterfeit, yet he continued to yell at them, showing them no pity at all. How fair is that?

The Left doesn't support John F. Kerry, they're just enflamed with their ABB mentality. Anybody But Bush.

Well, I am afraid to say this: I am that type of person. I can't help it. I'm not a fan of Michael Moore. I know what to believe and not believe but I do hate Bush. A lot it comes from my father. He was born in Ireland and is a typical European -- extremely liberal. A lot of that rubs off on me.

[benji]

but Clinton won the popular vote in ever election he had. Bush only got more votes because of the weak Third Party that year. Ross Perot received 8 million and 19 million votes respectively. Whether Bush had more than Clinton(only in popular votes) ever had, he still didn't have as much as Gore.

But that's irrelevant. Because we use the Electoral College. WHICH WE MUST USE. Otherwise only the states of California and New York would matter.

1888. Cleveland got 48.6% of the vote, Harrison got 47.8% of the vote. But Harrison destroyed Cleveland in the Electoral College: 233-168 (58-42). Cleveland's message was specifically tailored to one group of people, in the South. They went out and voted for him, but because Harrison's message was more overarcing he won more states, more electoral votes and the Presidency.

Of course, four years later, Cleveland got his platform back on track and beat Harrison.

57% of the country voted against Clinton, but Clinton dominated the Electoral College. That's why he's President. That's why George W. Bush is President.

Yes, but is it right to say that all cops represent everything that's good in this world. Cops surely do a ton of good, but there are those that are bad and take advantage of their authority. I was watching "Cops" and I saw one officer yelling at two, poor 7 year old kids for using a counterfeit $20 bill to buy a candybar. They didn't even know it was counterfeit, yet he continued to yell at them, showing them no pity at all. How fair is that?

Again, that's one cop. There is a small group of corrupt cops, is that any reason to attack ALL OF THEM especially after you just decried others for doing the same profiling?

Well, I am afraid to say this: I am that type of person. I can't help it. I'm not a fan of Michael Moore. I know what to believe and not believe but I do hate Bush.

But, why? Do you hate a booming economy thanks to income and dividend tax cuts? Do you hate winning wars for our way of life? Or do you just hate Bush because you're "supposed" to, like so many other youngins?

[Cameron]

I'm not going to get into your guys' argument, just wanted to interject a little point about Michael Moore getting charged by the Canadian government - it's not as it seems. I don't think our government really wants him arrrested or anything... actually, as far as I understand it, the Conservative party doesn't actually like the law they're charging him with, and their basically using him to tell the other parties (primarily the Liberals who are in power) to either charge the celebrity Michael Moore, or just get rid of the law. Basically the Torries are using Moore to get rid of a law they don't like.

[GloveGuy]

57% of the country voted against Clinton, but Clinton dominated the Electoral College. That's why he's President. That's why George W. Bush is President.

He still won the popular vote though! I don't see what the point is in debating about this. Clinton beat both Bush/Dole and Perot in the popular vote. He didn't beat them if you were to combine the Republican Party and the Independent Party, but since when are we doing that?

Also, Bush had 52.13% of the country against him. That's not much to brag about. Gore had 51.62% against, winning the popular vote.

Clinton won the popular vote and Electoral College against each of his competition, while Bush only won the Electoral College. Technically, he wasn't officially elected President. His position was issued by the Supreme Court.

But, why? Do you hate a booming economy thanks to income and dividend tax cuts? Do you hate winning wars for our way of life? Or do you just hate Bush because you're "supposed" to, like so many other youngins?

Yes, the economy is booming now, but to say that it was good under Bush is ludicrous. It's better than it was a year or two ago, but it's alright right now at best. My mom lost her successful job two years ago due to our awful economy. I'm embarassed by Bush. Do you realize how many people hate the US now due to Bush's actions and decisions?

[benji]

Basically the Torries are using Moore to get rid of a law they don't like.

Yeah, I knew all that. It's in teh article. However arresting Moore is icing on the cake. Mmmm. Cake.

Technically, he wasn't officially elected President. His position was issued by the Supreme Court.

No. That's wrong. The Supreme Court just stopped the ILLEGAL recounts. Bush was winning every single recount. And when the NYT and WaPo went back and applied all the guidelines the Gore campaign wanted Bush tripled his vote lead in Florida.

Yes, the economy is booming now, but to say that it was good under Bush is ludicrous.

The recession began under the Clinton administration in late 1999. The 1990s boom had nothing holding it up and companies like Enron were the ones driving it. The bottom caved and the whole thing collapsed. Since the Bush tax cuts have been enacted we have had the biggest economic boom in 20 years.

It's better than it was a year or two ago, but it's alright right now at best.

No, it's fantastic.

My mom lost her successful job two years ago due to our awful economy.

But not due to Bush.

I'm embarassed by Bush. Do you realize how many people hate the US now due to Bush's actions and decisions?

Do you realize how many people hated the United States before Bush and that Bush's rightful actions is just fueling their fire? The entire world has hated the United States for the last 50 years. If you think things were just peachy with the rest of the world under Clinton you're a fool. We didn't lose any standing in the world. Infact, I'd even say our standing has gotten better considering Eastern Europe loves Bush, Iraqi's (60%) and Afghanis (81%) now love the United States and the rest of the bums in the world are now scared to death we're going to lay the smackdown on their punk asses.

You say you're embarassed by Bush but that's no logical reason to hate a man. I'm embarassed by the Clintons. I could even say I'm embarassed by Kerry, Edwards, Kennedy, Pelosi, Daschle, Frist, the activist Judges, etc. I'm embarassed by you, Moore, Berger, Wilson, O'Reilly, Hannity, Clarke, McKinney, etc. But I don't hate any of the people listed (well, except that Hannity). If you hate Bush just because the loudmouths of the world hate us like they have for decades (if not centuries, I mean just look at European columns in newspapers from the 1800s) then you're a fool.

If people hate the United States because we removed Saddam Hussein then they are wretched people. I don't care if people who support a Saddam Hussein hate me. Infact, I hope they do hate me. Because people who would support such a vile creature do not deserve to like me.

[GloveGuy]

Do you realize how many people hated the United States before Bush and that Bush's rightful actions is just fueling their fire? The entire world has hated the United States for the last 50 years. If you think things were just peachy with the rest of the world under Clinton you're a fool. We didn't lose any standing in the world. Infact, I'd even say our standing has gotten better considering Eastern Europe loves Bush, Iraqi's (60%) and Afghanis (81%) now love the United States and the rest of the bums in the world are now scared to death we're going to lay the smackdown on their punk asses.

To you, they are rightful. To the liberals in Western Europe they are just wrong. We weren't hated after 9/11. The whole world mourned with us, feeling sorry for us. They didn't hate us when we went into Afghanistan and searched desperately for Osama bin Laden and dismantled the Taliban government.

But they started hating us when we started this "War On Iraq". Regardless of the fact that we were taking out the head of Iraq's government, they just didn't want any war happening. Why? Because they're liberals, and they're anti-war. We could've given it a different name such as the "Rectification of the Iraqi Government" and they wouldn't hate us nearly as much.

You say you're embarassed by Bush but that's no logical reason to hate a man.

I don't hate him as a person. Hate is a strong word, and I probably shouldn't have used it. I just think he's a moronic, God-awful president.

If people hate the United States because we removed Saddam Hussein then they are wretched people. I don't care if people who support a Saddam Hussein hate me.

Probably because they, along with me, just don't understand Bush's tactics. Why start a whole war just to take out one man. Why kill thousands of innocent civilians along the way? In one instance, we blew up a house that contained a terrorist in it, killing 10 or so innocent civilians with that one man. If that were any other country that did so, we'd call that terrorism. But it was us, and I guess that everything that we do and that George Bush does must be right because we are after all the surpreme country on this planet earth.

[benji]

We weren't hated after 9/11. The whole world mourned with us, feeling sorry for us. They didn't hate us when we went into Afghanistan and searched desperately for Osama bin Laden and dismantled the Taliban government.

Oh, come on. The rest of the world has despised America FOREVER. After 9/11 they faked compassion and instantly turned back against us after we went into Afghanistan.

Accepting condolences is all good and fun, but we have to win this war, not be comforted by Western Europe.

But they started hating us when we started this "War On Iraq". Regardless of the fact that we were taking out the head of Iraq's government, they just didn't want any war happening. Why? Because they're liberals, and they're anti-war. We could've given it a different name such as the "Rectification of the Iraqi Government" and they wouldn't hate us nearly as much.

Bullshit. BULLSHIT. They were opposed to the battle of Iraq because they had contracts with Saddam and didn't want to lose the money. Because you're a liberal you aren't "anti-war," 99% of all people are ANTI-WAR. The liberal mentality that infects places like State is keeping the status quo.

We HAVE to fight this war, it's not an option, and the Left doesn't understand that.

I don't hate him as a person. Hate is a strong word, and I probably shouldn't have used it. I just think he's a moronic, God-awful president.

Why?

Probably because they, along with me, just don't understand Bush's tactics. Why start a whole war just to take out one man.

It's not one man.

This is where the Left is moronic. They say we should just get bin Laden or just get al Qaeda. Michael Moore and Ben Afflick on that stupid O'Reilly Factor last night said the same thing and you hear this a lot from the Left. Should've sent in commandos to take out just bin Laden and called it a night. Not take down The Taliban or Saddam. Not take down the Ayatollah, Arafat, or Assad. Just get bin Laden and we're set.

But we're not, this is not a war against one man. This is a war against an entire culture. We have to destroy the Islamofascists (and Asianfascists) and their breeding grounds for worldwide terrorism. We couldn't just kill Hitler and Tojo we had to destroy the entire fascist cultures of Germany and Japan and rebuild them. Lenin and Stalin dying didn't stop the Soviet Union, it had to be wiped off the face of the Earth before those millions were freed and another hundred million didn't have to die at the hands of Communism.

We ARE the ones who have to act. Because, yes, we are the supreme country on this planet. If we do not lead, who will?

[J@3]

If we do not lead, who will?

I guess I could do it, as long as I don't have to start until after 2pm.

[Donatello]

If we do not lead, who will?

I guess I could do it, as long as I don't have to start until after 2pm.

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA i have to say that you are by far the funniest guy on here. good lord, man.

[benji]

Is that Aussie time?

[J@3]

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA i have to say that you are by far the funniest guy on here. good lord, man.

Thanks, I appreciatify the complimentities

Sorry, I'm just trying to sound more like Bush so people dont get too shocked when I take over.

Is that Aussie time?

Yeah but I'm flexible. Can I use your mobile Island bomb as a base?