Debate Thread: Circumcision

[koberulz]

Beneficial surgery or unnecessary mutilation? Discuss.

[Lamrock]

Innocuous procedure with aesthetic and social advantages.

[J@3]

Social advantages?

[Lamrock]

Yeah. You know, when you're with a girl and you're about to have intercourse, then she looks down and shrieks "elephant tusk! elephant tusk!"

[benji]

Yeah. You know, when you're with a girl and you're about to have intercourse, then she looks down and shrieks "elephant tusk! elephant tusk!"

Sounds like a personal problem, especially if your penis resembles an elephants' tusk as I can see why the potential of being stabbed by a sharp object would be upsetting.

[J@3]

I can't say I've ever had that happen but then again if I had sex with girls around your age I think prison time would be more of a worry than circumcision.

I was born in 85, which was sort of the very start of the circumcision boom or whatever. I don't know anyone who's circumsized, why I've had this convo with other guys is beyond me but I have. I guess it's a generational thing, I don't think it makes a difference one way or another. If anything it might decrease sensitivity and make sex worse because the head is always exposed thus would become sort of numb to things touching it. You probably have to work a tiny bit harder to make sure things are good hygienically but anyone who doesn't do that anyway is gross.

[benji]

I was born in 85, which was sort of the very start of the circumcision boom or whatever.

That's about 60-70 years late for the English speaking world. (Which led to all the babyboomers being circumcised and thus the "aesthetic and social advantage" that had never existed in the rest of Western history since they're the center of the universe and will make sure you know that.) And like 4000 years late for the Egyptians and Jews, and 2500 years or so late for Muslims.

The Ancient Greeks and the rest of Europe have never really been fans of it.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/c ... _Level.png
(I've always wondered why this chart has three data points instead of four, 20%-50% and 50-80% replacing the middle one. Guess they circumcised the data set.)

I wouldn't call it mutilation necessarily, but a forced procedure out of irrational hatred over the natural form of the human body. Kind of like if you did skin whitening or plastic surgery to a baby merely for cosmetic reasons. Most people wouldn't favor giving a baby collagen injections in their lips or bleaching their skin to get rid of the "color" but then again a lot of people throughout history have done a lot of shitty things to kids purely for cosmetic reasons that make them feel better so maybe they will in a few years.

[shadowgrin]

I haven't watched that Penn & Teller: Bullshit! episode yet so I have no stance on this.

[J@3]

That's about 60-70 years late for the English speaking world.

I think over here there was a lot of controversy/fear/worry etc about it at the time. I remember being told that I was booked to have it done but the day before the procedure another baby died from it somehow, so the number of people doing it had died down. There seems to be a pretty distinct period from like 88-1990 where people started having it done 100% of the time. At least from the penises I have been around.

[Laxation]

Jae, I dont think its as big in Australia as it is in USA... From what I hear in USA its almost weird for guys not to have it done. Anyone from USA clarify this?

[benji]

As I noted up above, it took off for a brief period but was basically everyone.

The Progressive Era made two claims in favor of circumcision, one that it reduced the evil epidemic of masturbation, and second everyone just decided it solved every potential disease associated with the penis or sex. As a result the "Greatest Generation" was the first significantly circumcised generation in the U.S., and almost all their kids (the babyboomers) wound up circumcised, however this has plummeted since the 1960s everywhere but the South and a few other specific enclaves as the endless proof came out that there's no medical benefit for 99.9% of males to be circumcised.

Death scares probably helped some, but for most people still doing it it's just a "you do it because you do it" without any rational basis as to why it's done. I believe the overall number is well under half the babies have it done anymore. (Except again, for those enclaves, and the South, where they love to do it.)

[el badman]

From what I hear in USA its almost weird for guys not to have it done. Anyone from USA clarify this?

Not that I spend my time looking at guys' junk, but I am also under the same impression. When I met my wife, she told me I was the first uncircumcised guy she'd met yet.
I forgot the name of the organization, but I saw online a group that preaches the benefits of "foreskin restoration", with a bunch of males who regret that they never had a choice in the first place and are using various techniques to try to make it grow back...

[benji]

Where did you meet your wife that she immediately saw your penis?

[Laxation]

What made you think she saw it immediately?

[el badman]

Yeah, that's not what I meant, it took a little while...

[benji]

Then how does she know you're the first uncircumcised male she's met? No, no, no, this doesn't add up. Not at all.

[Laxation]

I see where you're going with this now...

[shadowgrin]

el badman realizes what benji is getting at...

[el badman]

Damn you all!
That's the last time I share anything about my wife's sexual history...

[shadowgrin]

Don't worry about us. Worry about your wife finding out about you sharing her sexual history...

[Doobie]

I am not circumsized. I am the only one in my group of friends who isn't. Yes, they make jokes about me all the time without ever seeing my penis.

No girl has ever complained.

[J@3]

Damn you all!
That's the last time I share anything about my wife's sexual history...

JESUS THANKS ALOT BEN

I am not circumsized. I am the only one in my group of friends who isn't. Yes, they make jokes about me all the time without ever seeing my penis.

See I'd find that weird. Then I'd take my dick out and start knocking people out with it.

[shadowgrin]

my penis.

No girl has ever complained.

It's not the circumcision. The girl thinks it's in bad taste to make fun or complain about the disabled.

[koberulz]

This one's come up again recently here, with some doctors recommending that children should be circumcised to lessen the spread of HIV. Which is utterly absurd. Though these are the same people who think giving people the right to kill themselves would be utterly terrible, so it's not all that surprising.

[[Q]]

yeah i gotta say in the US, it's pretty common to have circumcision. people seemed to convinced themselves that it's like a miracle drug it can save your baby from all kinds of diseases. in my opinion there really is no point to it. i don't think i would do it if i had a boy of my own.