Tim Duncan approaching 20k

[Kenny]

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In One Place

Out of the 34 players who have scored 20,000 points , only 10 have scored all of them with a single franchise. Duncan will become the 11th.

PLAYER (TEAM) POINTS
John Havlicek* (Boston) 26,395
Reggie Miller (Indiana) 25,279
Jerry West* (LA Lakers) 25,192
Kobe Bryant (LA Lakers) 24,981
Elgin Baylor* (Minn./L.A. Lakers) 23,149
Larry Bird* (Boston) 21,791
Hal Greer* (Syracuse/Philadelphia) 21,586
Bob Pettit* (Milwaukee/St. Louis) 20,880
David Robinson* (San Antonio) 20,790
Dirk Nowitzki (Dallas) 20,102
Tim Duncan (San Antonio) 19,985

* Hall of Fame Inductee

Over the last decade TD has been my favourite player. There's a lot to like about his attitude and the way he goes about playing. The ultimate definition of a franchise player in my opinion

[Rip32]

It surprises me that Duncan is behind Dirk on the scoring list. I know Dirk has a higher career scoring average, but Duncan also has been in the NBA for a year more. I don't mind Duncan though, best power forward of all time.

[Oznogrd]

I don't mind Duncan though, most fundamentally sound power forward of all time.

Fixed

I like Timmy because he's one of the few players I've seen who isnt just "outathleting" everyone else. Footwork/positioning and his technique are almost always textbook. Not the most exciting guy to ever watch but definitely in the debate of best of all time.

[Kenny]

I don't mind Duncan though, most fundamentally sound power forward of all time.

Fixed

I like Timmy because he's one of the few players I've seen who isnt just "outathleting" everyone else. Footwork/positioning and his technique are almost always textbook. Not the most exciting guy to ever watch but definitely in the debate of best of all time.

See I think his fundamentals make him great to watch. It's always fun to see a flashy player with emphatic dunks and what not, but I'd probably prefer watching Duncan over any of the power forwards in the league because he generally outplays people with his technique. He's still playing at a high level as well.

[Oznogrd]

I don't mind Duncan though, most fundamentally sound power forward of all time.

Fixed

I like Timmy because he's one of the few players I've seen who isnt just "outathleting" everyone else. Footwork/positioning and his technique are almost always textbook. Not the most exciting guy to ever watch but definitely in the debate of best of all time.

See I think his fundamentals make him great to watch. It's always fun to see a flashy player with emphatic dunks and what not, but I'd probably prefer watching Duncan over any of the power forwards in the league because he generally outplays people with his technique. He's still playing at a high level as well.

Everybody watches for different reasons. Its sort of like in football: if i want to see a great quarterback i'd watch peyton manning or Troy aikman. If i wanna be yelling "holy shit" every other play: i watch old tapes of michael vick. also usually if i want to watch fundamentals, i dont watch the nba and That's the thing about technique. It works so well that even if you lose a little speed, or you lost a little vert, the production will still be there. Hence the longevity of Timmy D. Not taking anything away from him but I understand why he's not up there in the talks with the lebron/kobe/wades.

[NovU]

There's a lot to like about his attitude and the way he goes about playing. The ultimate definition of a franchise player in my opinion

Agreed. Consistent both on and off the court, never causing trouble for the club or between teammates, also a great leader/role model for younger players.

TD is the best PF ever in my book at the moment but that is with missing out on watching generation of Moses Malone or other greats. Winning multiple championship rings with him as a centerpiece and having to stay a top contender every year in his career, I think it says a lot.

[dopeboy]

Not taking anything away from him but I understand why he's not up there in the talks with the lebron/kobe/wades.

But he must be. Not only because of his career achievements, but his performance this season as well. I mean, his PER (close to 28, IIRC) combined with his defense and leadership should make him a Top 5 candidate for MVP. Somehow most people don't recognize that. Well, that and the fact he's the best player of the last decade.

[Oznogrd]

Not taking anything away from him but I understand why he's not up there in the talks with the lebron/kobe/wades.

But he must be. Not only because of his career achievements, but his performance this season as well. I mean, his PER (close to 28, IIRC) combined with his defense and leadership should make him a Top 5 candidate for MVP. Somehow most people don't recognize that. Well, that and the fact he's the best player of the last decade.

Mvp isnt a career achievement (or at least shouldnt be.) Also...do you see Timmy fanboys coming on forums and going
"best playa evur!!! LULWUT? YOU SUCK IF YOU HATE."
He has never finished outside of the top 10 in mvp voting, thats quite a testament, i was simply saying that he doesnt seem to have the rabid blind followers due to not being a flashy player. People as you said: dont recognize his greatness. I wasnt saying he sucked: simply saying you never hear hype about him the way you do some of the current stars. Hell i hear about manu than i do Duncan.

[Kenny]

Duncan's game and personality in general are both understated. He gets his job done with minimal fuss and the numbers he puts up are that of a player you'd expect to be flashy. He's not going to win the MVP this year, I agree, but if the Spurs go deep in the playoffs (or make it for that matter), you can bet that Tim had a profound impact.

In my opinion, he is the greatest power forward of all time. Quite simply, he gets it done.

[Andrew]

That'll make a few players who have hit the 20,000 point mark this year. If Paul Pierce maintains his current scoring average without missing any more games, he'll also join the club by the season's final days.

It surprises me that Duncan is behind Dirk on the scoring list. I know Dirk has a higher career scoring average, but Duncan also has been in the NBA for a year more. I don't mind Duncan though, best power forward of all time.

Duncan's had a couple of years missing ten or more games whereas Dirk's never missed more than six, so Duncan has only played in 57 more games for his career. That, along with Dirk's higher scoring average, has allowed him to pull slightly ahead.

[Fresh8]

Tim Duncan is still one of the bext big men in the game. Very impressed with his training over the Summer to shed some pounds. He's playing less but is still getting the job done. I can see Spurs going to Western Conference Finals if they get a 2 or 3 seed for the playoffs.

[Andrew]

So close, he finished with 14 against the Jazz so he's one point away. I think we can take it as read that he'll score his 20000th point against the Rockets.

[Lamrock]

It was epic watching him foul out with his 19,999 career points tonight. (Also good for Portland's top 4 chances)

[Andrew]

Milestone reached, plus twenty four. Unfortunately for Timmy D, it wasn't accompanied by a victory.

[marinmarin]

I don't mind Duncan though, most fundamentally sound power forward of all time.

Fixed

I like Timmy because he's one of the few players I've seen who isnt just "outathleting" everyone else. Footwork/positioning and his technique are almost always textbook. Not the most exciting guy to ever watch but definitely in the debate of best of all time.

Why this needs to be fixed?

[Oznogrd]

I don't mind Duncan though, most fundamentally sound power forward of all time.

Fixed

I like Timmy because he's one of the few players I've seen who isnt just "outathleting" everyone else. Footwork/positioning and his technique are almost always textbook. Not the most exciting guy to ever watch but definitely in the debate of best of all time.

Why this needs to be fixed?

He had said greatest PF of all time. I changed it to say fundamentally sound. It is yet to be detemined if he's the greatest PF of all time. However he is certainly in that discussion if not the top. I was just stating he gets overlooked alot for not being a flashy guy.

[Kenny]

I personally think Duncan is the best power forward of all time. You could argue that Malone or Barkley were better I suppose, but the fact is that not only was Duncan was on the dynasty team of last decade, but he was the cornerstone of their success. He had good players around him (Parker, Manu, Bowen etc), but without Tim, they would have had a lot of trouble.

Anyway, that's just my opinion. If you couldn't tell, I'm very pro Duncan

[hova-]

It just comes to winning titles in the end. Having four rings whilst being the franchise player just lets you hit a level of being untouchable. So every discussion is not worth it. He's the best Power Forward of all time, because no franchise player power Forward has won more rings.

[Kenny]

It just comes to winning titles in the end. Having four rings whilst being the franchise player just lets you hit a level of being untouchable. So every discussion is not worth it. He's the best Power Forward of all time, because no franchise player power Forward has won more rings.

I couldn't agree more

[Oznogrd]

People are assuming Im trying to say he's not great: I dont disagree with you guys. It is very possible that Duncan is the greatest PF of all time. Keeping that level of play for that many years is a great thing as is 4 titles It could also be possibly that it was the right time right place. Or both. You can't only use titles as a basis though..then you could very possibly give Robert Horry best forward of all time status (7 titles, 3 teams)

I feel bad for barkley and malone both because they just never seemed to have enough to get those titles. It could be argued that Barkley and Malone were up against better teams (as being discussed in the other thread: less teams means less spots which means better players on each team)...Once again: just playing devil's advocate here. I do think Duncan is great. I think he's one of the best players I've ever watched. Im just not a fan of definitive "BEST EVAR" talk because anyone can argue anything. Enjoy the entertainment and like who you like. Dont worry about who the best and worst are. Just enjoy the game.

[Kenny]

People are assuming Im trying to say he's not great: I dont disagree with you guys. It is very possible that Duncan is the greatest PF of all time. Keeping that level of play for that many years is a great thing as is 4 titles It could also be possibly that it was the right time right place. Or both. You can't only use titles as a basis though..then you could very possibly give Robert Horry best forward of all time status (7 titles, 3 teams)

I feel bad for barkley and malone both because they just never seemed to have enough to get those titles. It could be argued that Barkley and Malone were up against better teams (as being discussed in the other thread: less teams means less spots which means better players on each team)...Once again: just playing devil's advocate here. I do think Duncan is great. I think he's one of the best players I've ever watched. Im just not a fan of definitive "BEST EVAR" talk because anyone can argue anything. Enjoy the entertainment and like who you like. Dont worry about who the best and worst are. Just enjoy the game.

I completely understand and please note that I didn't think you were saying anything contrary to him being great. I'm just firm in my stance that he is the greatest. And I agree that there's too many factors to consider a definitive "best ever" tag, because it's purely subjective. I mean, many say MJ is the greatest ever, but people like Jerry West, Bill Russell, Kareem and Wilt were all exceptional players of their time and could be argued as the greatest ever.

I'm not really saying that Tim is the definitive "best ever power forward", I just think he is in my own opinion. There's no argument to the contrary that will make me believe otherwise.

And yes, I feel bad for Barkley and Malone as well. Both amazing players that went without a championship in a highly competitive league.

[Andrew]

At this point, I'm comfortable ranking Duncan above the Mailman and Sir Charles. He's got the stats and the success and he does whatever the Spurs need him to do to win. Barkley never really adapted in clutch situations and Malone simply choked. If the Spurs need Duncan to go out and get 35-15, that's what he'll do. If they need him to do the dirty work and facilitate his teammates on offense, then he'll do that too. Barkley and Malone are amongst the all-time greats, but as far as the greatest power forward to date is concerned I'd have to concede to give Duncan the nod.

[marinmarin]

I'll just say that i am more confident about timmy being the best power forward of all time than Mj being the best player ever.