Spirit of '99: 2011 Lockout Discussion

[benji]

Exactly, imagine LeBron James if he was only 6-2. Would have never even been able to make a NBL team.

[bowdown]

And if you are competent enough of your job at all (being good at basketball) you will have atleast a few options of teams to join. Its not just the stars that enjoy choice. Its just not as varied. Which fits in with real life.

And yet you think it's too easy for players to choose where they want to play.

Not to mention it requires a lot more than being 'competent'. There are thousands of players who never even make the NBA that you could easily describe as being 'competent'.

Are you serious? I am trying to say they have better working conditions than someone else with a fixed job. I dont care about who is not making the NBA because they are not good enough. We are talking about NBA players. Once you make the NBA, you make millions, thats not being compensated enough?

[The X]

And if you are competent enough of your job at all (being good at basketball) you will have atleast a few options of teams to join. Its not just the stars that enjoy choice. Its just not as varied. Which fits in with real life.

And yet you think it's too easy for players to choose where they want to play.

Not to mention it requires a lot more than being 'competent'. There are thousands of players who never even make the NBA that you could easily describe as being 'competent'.

Are you serious? I am trying to say they have better working conditions than someone else with a fixed job. I dont care about who is not making the NBA because they are not good enough. We are talking about NBA players. Once you make the NBA, you make millions, thats not being compensated enough?

It's good compensation yes, but it's also gotta be looked at relative to the revenues they bring into the league and to their respective teams.

Kobe, Lebron, Wade etc are worth a lot more to their teams than the $16-20 mill per year they each get. Naturally endorsements help them get closer to their real value in what they bring. The elite superstars are underpaid and many of the rest are overpaid, but that's the way the system is currently set.

People in "ordinary" jobs don't get paid big salaries because they don't bring much as much value to an organisation. Take a waiter or shop attendant for example, although their job is arguably no less important than an NBA basketballer, it is a job that can generally be done by almost anybody and the value they add to their employer is generally very low. You compare that to a lawyer or journalist, their salaries can range dramatically based on their experience and skills, such that a top one in their field can earn in the millions, whereas a run of the mill one will only bring home a 5 figure salary. Then you've got entertainers, such as NBA basketballers or movie stars ($20 million for a movie, are they worth it? Based on their relative talent level compared to other actors/actresses, probably not, but if they mean a movie grosses an extra $200 million than it otherwise would have then it is money well spent).

All that being said, I'd love to see the players take the deal so the lockout can end

[bowdown]

I have no problem with anything you said. All I am saying is that this new deal is not doing the NBA player injustice at all. They cannot continue to bitch about it.

[The X]

I agree that if you look at it in the grand scheme of things, they don't have a lot to complain about.

The complaints are more to do with taking a 12% cut in their salaries and a few more sticks put in place to make movement less attractive. In the end if a player like Lebron really wants to move and it's not about the money, then this new CBA (if approved) will not stop it and nor should it. He's a free man out of contract and had every right to move. It will however stop the Carmelo Anthony's of the world getting to have their cake and eat it too (getting to go to a big market and keep his Bird rights and get more wealthy contract extension). A new CBA will not stop Chris Paul from bolting from Hornets, nor will it stop Dwight Howard leaving Orlando if he really wants to, it just means they'll have to take a bit less than they previously could've got.

If my boss said I had to take a 12% pay cut, I'd be pretty annoyed too. But yeah, grand scheme of things for players, not as much.

[kAmilli LakeShow]

It could be worse.

Isiah angling for top union job

How many of you would be startled to discover Isiah Thomas has been creepin’ round Billy Hunter’s back door to get his job?

How many would be stunned to learn Florida International University’s current head coach is angling in due course to replace the executive director of the Players Association should its membership feel flogged (compromised following so many compromises) by David Stern upon the completion of a new collective bargaining agreement or if negotiations again break down and additional salary (games) get forfeited?

How many would be surprised to find out Thomas, a former president of the union during his playing days, is coiled to commandeer the slightest insinuation of instability and insurgence?

Damn, that wouldn't be a lockout, that would mean APOCALYPSE!

[kAmilli LakeShow]

I agree that if you look at it in the grand scheme of things, they don't have a lot to complain about.

The complaints are more to do with taking a 12% cut in their salaries and a few more sticks put in place to make movement less attractive. In the end if a player like Lebron really wants to move and it's not about the money, then this new CBA (if approved) will not stop it and nor should it. He's a free man out of contract and had every right to move. It will however stop the Carmelo Anthony's of the world getting to have their cake and eat it too (getting to go to a big market and keep his Bird rights and get more wealthy contract extension). A new CBA will not stop Chris Paul from bolting from Hornets, nor will it stop Dwight Howard leaving Orlando if he really wants to, it just means they'll have to take a bit less than they previously could've got.

If my boss said I had to take a 12% pay cut, I'd be pretty annoyed too. But yeah, grand scheme of things for players, not as much.

Great points. Just like Stern or someone said, i don't remember for sure : Players should be happy they got that deal in 98. Yes, they hit the jackpot, but they be foolish to think owners will let em hit it twice. Just buckle up and be ready to accept less because previous agreement was an atrocious mistake by the owners and they won't do it again. Something like that

[koberulz]

It will however stop the Carmelo Anthony's of the world getting to have their cake and eat it too (getting to go to a big market and keep his Bird rights

How did he keep his Bird rights?

[shadowgrin]

Bird rights are retained when traded.

[bowdown]

http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/72341 ... unter-says

PLAYERS REJECT. WILL DISBAND.

[The X]

This sucks

[shadowgrin]

YES!

[JoeJames]

Oh yeah Baby!!

[bowdown]

why do some of you like this? idk how this is gonna turn out

[koberulz]

Bird rights are retained when traded.

Huh. I guess I can see the reason for that, but it does seem a bit odd.

http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/7234180/nba-lockout-players-not-accept-deal-seek-decertify-billy-hunter-says

PLAYERS REJECT. WILL DISBAND.

Bogut to the NBL? Rumors were floating around a couple of weeks ago it could happen if the season's cancelled.

[shadowgrin]

why do some of you like this? idk how this is gonna turn out

Why should I not like it?

Huh. I guess I can see the reason for that, but it does seem a bit odd.

What's odd about it?

[Eich]

Today is the day I lost any respect I had left for those players that were in that room and were joking around before the announcement.
Few names: Anthony, Billups, Paul, Bryant, Terry, Rondo. Others I did not recognize, forgot the name or didn't know at all.

[NovU]

I have a feeling the league pushed players into the corner and it backfired just like Woj(Andrew's post) said before. Threatening and ultimatum whatever you call it, I never liked the owners' approach regardless of players' attitude. And here it is, a hard foul by players.

[shadowgrin]

How very appropriate of Maurice Evans to wear his diamond earrings during the press conference.

[kibaxx7]

phpBB [video]

Just terrible stuff. "The nuclear winter of the NBA is coming"

[mlp111]

players suck, its all about money, not fans!!!! you guys make enough money already........

[benji]

http://www.nbpa.org/

If it gets fixed:

Error 404: Basketball Not Found

Please be patient as we work on resolving this. We are sorry for the inconvenience.

[Nick]

Unbelievable.

It's not just the season that will be lost, but it's also integrity of the NBA's history books. Now there will be a big asterisk next to the season. Yuck.

I'm sick of all this rich vs rich bullshit. This is just a reflection of how fucked up our economic systems are. It just shows how much our world needs change. I'm over it.

[benji]

As Dwight re-tweeted, you guys have zero compassion:

@RICHFlair_: True NBA fans need to realize the players are not slaves for our entertainment.

[Nick]

Dwidiot. The players really are deluded. Fuck this.