2018 PLAYOFFS: (3) Portland vs. (6) New Orleans

[NovU]

Lillard this year imho belongs to ALL NBA FIRST TEAM. You could make an argument he was the best PG in tough West.

But it seems Lillard needs the ball in his hands to be effective. He is small, and neither has off the ball skillset to impact the game positively. Perhaps surround him with players who can complement his game rather than players who will feed off his energy. I don't think neither Nurkic nor McCollum fits that bill. Nurkic is a nice center but still raw and erratic. McCollum imho is Jamal Crawford type of player, scoring punch. It'll always be a uphill battle with those two as 2nd and 3rd best player on the team.

[shadowgrin]

Dat 6.8 PER from Lillard. Credit to the Pelicans for exposing Lillard, he’s not a franchise player, he’s a sidekick at best.

*That PER was 9.1 for the series.

Still not good. But that was the actual PER.

It was 6.8 3 games into the series, before bball-ref updated since the last game was just finished.
I didn’t need to wait for bball-ref to update to show much of a dumpster fire Lillard played.

[Dee4Three]

Dat 6.8 PER from Lillard. Credit to the Pelicans for exposing Lillard, he’s not a franchise player, he’s a sidekick at best.

*That PER was 9.1 for the series.

Still not good. But that was the actual PER.

It was 6.8 3 games into the series, before bball-ref updated since the last game was just finished.
I didn’t need to wait for bball-ref to update to show much of a dumpster fire Lillard played.

6.8 PER through three games would have been the accurate statement, but no worries.

Yes, he was shut down.

[bowdown]

Who should the Blazers keep out of Lillard and McCollum?

Very tough to say. I kinda feel like rebuilding all over again. Trade everyone. Contracts of Turner and Leonard won't allow Blazers to do anything anyways.

[Andrew]

That's definitely going to be a problem. Washington are in a similar situation with some of the players that they signed to huge deals. I guess it was only a matter of time before those ballooning salaries came back to haunt teams, even with continued rise of the salary cap.

[[Q]]

I could see stotts getting fired and taking blame in what was a terrible matchup for them. Makes me wonder how far they would have gotten had harkless never got hurt

[Dee4Three]

I could see stotts getting fired and taking blame in what was a terrible matchup for them. Makes me wonder how far they would have gotten had harkless never got hurt

I get the Harkless thing, but I am supremely disappointed in Evan Turner's time with Portland. I was a huge fan of him in Boston, I liked all the things he could bring to the game. Dude got the C's a basket when they needed it, played hard on D, could score in clusters, showed out to be a good ball handler and passer, was on the boards, etc. No, he didn't deserve that contract, but I did expect him to be a bigger difference maker in Portland.

He never became a good three-point shooter, but as Rondo and Simmons have shown, that isn't necessary if you play the right way, and can do all the other things. He didn't have to be a great three-point shooter to make a big impact... but he just never seemed to look comfortable with Portland. Sometimes I think it's because they played him off the ball too much, but the times I did see him with the ball, he just didn't look like the same version of Evan Turner that I saw with the C's.

[Lamrock]

On Lillard or McCollum: Though McCollum out-played Lillard in the playoffs, and was taken just a year later, I'd rather see CJ go. Lots of sentimental value attached to Lillard, plus he is the much better player. But like bowdown said, trading both might not be the worst option either. Trade both of them for picks, young players and contracts set to expire by 2020, extend Nurkic (and maybe Napier) and see how it goes. Thing is, who will they sign when guys like Turner and Leonard come off the books?

On Harkless: With a healthy Harkless, maybe this series goes five games.. He's good but doesn't prevent the Pelicans from guarding Lillard the way they did.

On Evan Turner: We see it a lot with guys who leave Boston and suddenly fall off a cliff. Turner was a product of a Brad Stevens system that plays to everybody's strengths. He was below average in Philly and Indiana, his Boston stint was an anomaly and Olshey should have known better. Of course, we only signed him because we missed out on Chandler Parsons so...

[Dee4Three]

On Lillard or McCollum: Though McCollum out-played Lillard in the playoffs, and was taken just a year later, I'd rather see CJ go. Lots of sentimental value attached to Lillard, plus he is the much better player. But like bowdown said, trading both might not be the worst option either. Trade both of them for picks, young players and contracts set to expire by 2020, extend Nurkic (and maybe Napier) and see how it goes. Thing is, who will they sign when guys like Turner and Leonard come off the books?

On Harkless: With a healthy Harkless, maybe this series goes five games.. He's good but doesn't prevent the Pelicans from guarding Lillard the way they did.

On Evan Turner: We see it a lot with guys who leave Boston and suddenly fall off a cliff. Turner was a product of a Brad Stevens system that plays to everybody's strengths. He was below average in Philly and Indiana, his Boston stint was an anomaly and Olshey should have known better. Of course, we only signed him because we missed out on Chandler Parsons so...

Still better than Parsons.... ha.

But so is most of the NBA.

[bowdown]

When was Turner really even good? He has been average or below average all his career. His stint with Boston was exactly the same as Portland except he averaged just an assist or two more.

[Dee4Three]

When was Turner really even good? He has been average or below average all his career. His stint with Boston was exactly the same as Portland except he averaged just an assist or two more.

He didn't seem lost with the Celtics, he had a niche with the team. It's the most confident I've ever seen him play.

I'd say he was average or slightly above average with Boston. Like I stated, he obviously didn't deserve that contract.

He has never looked comfortable with Portland.

[[Q]]

He''s a weird player, as he seemed to begin to put it all together as a starter for the sixers but then everywhere else he's been forced into a reserve/6th man type role. Not a lot of players thrive when you limit their minutes and tell them that they're better off not starting. some just seem to accept it while others use it as motivation to prove em wrong

[NovU]

bowndown has it right. At his best, he is still a high risk low reward player. Everything he does is below average or mere average at his best. In his 8 seasons in NBA, he always scored at way below league average efficiency. He shoots 3s at way below league avg(doesnt create space), is a nice free throw shooter but doesnt have ability to draw enough fouls. His assists numbers are somewhat meaningless because it comes with a big caveat, turnovers. He is just a low end option for all teams, aka Mr. Expendable/Prototypical Journeyman.

[Dee4Three]

Just a disagreement in relation to how he played in Boston. I do believe that Brad gets the best out of his players, I mean... look what he is doing this year and what he did last year with those groups. Turners confidence was sky high in Boston, Brad let him run the show most of the time with the second unit.

I still thought he would perform better in POR, but clearly I was wrong.

I agree with Lamrock in regards to Lillard, he is the keeper over McCollum in my opinion. And, I agree for the same reasons he stated.

[air gordon]

Lillard this year imho belongs to ALL NBA FIRST TEAM. You could make an argument he was the best PG in tough West.

But it seems Lillard needs the ball in his hands to be effective. He is small, and neither has off the ball skillset to impact the game positively. Perhaps surround him with players who can complement his game rather than players who will feed off his energy. I don't think neither Nurkic nor McCollum fits that bill. Nurkic is a nice center but still raw and erratic. McCollum imho is Jamal Crawford type of player, scoring punch. It'll always be a uphill battle with those two as 2nd and 3rd best player on the team.

i always wondered about this needs the ball theory applied to 25ppg players. it's obvious these guys need to the ball. how many off ball guys averaged 20ppg? in recent memory- shawn marion, rip hamilton

im guessing its the gameplan but really-the blaze seem like they are force feeding Nurk in the beginning of games... a la bill cartwright style. i agree nurk is erratic. he definitely get a lot of gift wrapped looks at the basket

turner stinks.

[NovU]

I guess I have to admit off-ball Lillard is a bad argument. Blazers being one-superstar(Lillard) team in reality, there was no way Lillard not playing ball dominant. Nor he had high caliber teammates who's capable of creating chances for him to excel off ball.

[Andrew]

Klay Thompson would be another example of a player who can score in bunches playing off-ball. More often than not though, top scorers are creating for themselves with the ball in their hands a lot of the time, and Damian Lillard is no Klay Thompson in terms of his ability to play off the ball.

[air gordon]

iirc blazers do run some off ball action for dame when he flares off those screens but the ball stops after that lol
good call on thompson