Kobe, all but done.

by **Old School Fool** on Fri Oct 10, 2003 2:43 pm

Hey Vin15 i just want to congratulate you on your 1000 Post in advance :wink:

by **wangster** on Fri Oct 10, 2003 4:41 pm

Old School Fool wrote:Hey Vin15 i just want to congratulate you on your 1000 Post in advance

spam

About the topic, it sure isn't looking too good for kobe. The defense seems to feel that they have a good case against him. I agree with others that tyring to prove her to be mentally ill is not a good strategy, as it seems to accomplish next to nothing. A better approach would be to point out evidence through cross-examination, etc. to indicate she may have had received her injuries from something other than an encounter with kobe. I don't think it's too farfetched to think that she might have been promiscuous and that she received her injuries from someone else (or herself for that matter, but I won't go into that on this forum) and she's accusing kobe only because of who he is and not because he actually was the attacker. Now, I didn't say that she's a gold-digger but it seems to me she has some kind of motivation in accusing Kobe. It is entirely possible she doesn't even expect to win the case, if you take my meaning. But so far, it doesn't look like Kobe's chance is as high as the general consensus once was. Somehow, I can't see Kobe as a rapist but who knows, time will tell, I guess.

Is it just me, or is the judge maybe biased?

by **air gordon** on Fri Oct 10, 2003 5:38 pm

Robby wrote:
limpdilznik wrote:wouldn't it be the other way around.. if the defense team prove she's mentally ill, he'll be acquitted of the charges?

If they try to prove she's mentally ill, that doesn't mean that she wasn't assaulted. So going that route and making that the biggest point would be a somewhat ineffective route.

Actually no, you see, if they prove she's mentally ill, that means she cannot legally consent, thus, any sexual act automatically becomes CSC.

thanks for the 411... what's the deal with the defense saying the accuser's full name several times (against the judge's request)

kind of hard to stay away from this topic considering it's being talked on the bus, train, work, school, oh and tv/radio

by **paul_pierce_the_truth** on Fri Oct 10, 2003 11:53 pm

I believe her medical records were not allowed, I could be wrong, from what I understand the Colorado law called "Rape Shield" is very certain about not putting the accuser on trial. Look for Kobe to get the long probation part of the conviction. I have heard his lawyer is very good, but I just can't see things working by bashing the accuser, such as suggesting she had sex with multiple people or that she is unstable. She would be protected first, by law, therefore I believe the jury will hear little about her mental problems if they exsist or any sexual acts outside that hotel room. I could be wrong, but that is what I have heard. The details of the scene add up to about 20 years of probation in my opinion. If Kobe Bryant is found guilty of this charge, I believe his playing days should be over, he really isn't what any team or league should put out there as a product. I personally think he deserves 3 1/2 - 12 years in a max prison for sexual offenders, murders, bank robbers, the real violent criminals.

I believe her. Making a story up like this one is just not to her benefit.

by **Filip** on Sat Oct 11, 2003 2:09 am

A news paper that I red today said that Kobe grabed her at her neck (when she was leaving) and trown her down a chair, then lifted her skirt and had sex with her from behind.

by **LeBron James** on Sat Oct 11, 2003 2:28 am

i hope kobe goes to jail.

by **emadhn15** on Sat Oct 11, 2003 2:54 am

LeBron James wrote:i hope kobe goes to jail.

I can guarantee u that he aint going to go to jail or be proven guilty,,, even if he had raped the girl, he will be proven innocent,,, he has got the best lawyers in the whole state, and what has the girl got????,,,

If OJ Simpson got away with murder, do u think that kobe will be guilty for rape??????? impossible,,

just wait and see!!

by **Filip** on Sat Oct 11, 2003 3:20 am

I don't want to see Kobe in Jail, I want to see him on the court!

by **Jackal** on Sat Oct 11, 2003 3:37 am

emadhn15 wrote:
LeBron James wrote:i hope kobe goes to jail.

I can guarantee u that he aint going to go to jail or be proven guilty,,, even if he had raped the girl, he will be proven innocent,,, he has got the best lawyers in the whole state, and what has the girl got????,,,

If OJ Simpson got away with murder, do u think that kobe will be guilty for rape??????? impossible,,

just wait and see!!

You have a lot of faith in the law... :roll:

by **jwin** on Sat Oct 11, 2003 4:34 am

but the thing that seperates this case from o.j.'s is the fact that there is a living victim who has already stated that kobe in fact has done this to her. there was no none in o.j.'s situation to say that they were attacked by him, so it had to be proved that he did it beyond doubt. kobe is kind of the opposite, they have to prove that he didn't do it since someone is alive to claim he did. and he may be found guilty no matter who he is, it seems athletes get off more with light sentences in this type of situation than they do with being found innocent. and you have to remember that if a jury has to decide his fate, any lie that kobe has told already is one step closer to conviction, if the girl doesn't have to testify, how can you even find faults in her accusations or statements?

by **CHHAMP** on Sat Oct 11, 2003 5:17 am

Kobe will be in jail for 20+ years. Colorado sentenced a guy to jail for 15 years despite no physical evidence showing up on the rape victim.

With all the physical evidence on this girl the court has no choice but to send Kobe to jail for a minimum of 20 years.

by . on Sat Oct 11, 2003 5:29 am

CHHAMP wrote:Kobe will be in jail for 20+ years. Colorado sentenced a guy to jail for 15 years despite no physical evidence showing up on the rape victim.

With all the physical evidence on this girl the court has no choice but to send Kobe to jail for a minimum of 20 years.

that doesnt proof anything, Im pretty sure that there were so called rapists that were proven not guilty in the past. + there were saying that she had sex with 3 different guys on 3 different days, so that doesnt mean that Kobe hurt her physical

i hope kobe goes to jail.

lol....funny how people act like someone who theyre not, cause you told me a time ago that you liked Kobe on msn :roll:

, maybe you have different personalities in your head :roll:

.

by **GForce11** on Sat Oct 11, 2003 5:46 am

Old School Fool wrote:Aloy he is not a Rapist he is perfectly innocent cause i heard the Accuser ha sex with 3 other guys before kobe so one of the three dudes might have banged up her Vaginal Area and the accuser wants to blame Kobe for it but the Accuser just wants Kobe's MOney

You heard wrong. Don't twist assumptions/accusations as facts, it makes you look ignorant.

by **Robby** on Sat Oct 11, 2003 5:52 am

I think Kobe would have a good shot to win this thing because after reading about all the things Mackey did, she seems like a very good lawyer. What kind of bothers me is how and why is the accuser's blood on Kobe's t-shirt if he's innocent? It'll be interesting to see how to defense handles this.

by **GForce11** on Sat Oct 11, 2003 5:54 am

CHHAMP wrote:Kobe will be in jail for 20+ years. Colorado sentenced a guy to jail for 15 years despite no physical evidence showing up on the rape victim.

With all the physical evidence on this girl the court has no choice but to send Kobe to jail for a minimum of 20 years.

I doubt it, maybe 5-10 years and probation. First time offender. Granted, Colorado law is much more strict in cases like this.
Lots of evidence against Kobe. Don't think his lawyers are doing him a favor pissing off the judge either. I guess we'll see. Still too early to say where Kobe's going. Maybe he should take this year off and just focus on his life. You couldn't pay me enough to be in his shoes right about now...sad.

by **jwin** on Sat Oct 11, 2003 7:47 am

yeah these court proceedings have nothing to do with money, this is a criminal trial. she would file a civil suit if she is after money, that usually comes after the criminal trial, but this is not her against kobe as someone said earlier, it's the state of colorado against kobe, which is more than likely to lead to a jury who will decide if he's guilty or not, if he is then i believe the judge will hand down his sentence and no it's not a good idea to piss him off, he could throw the max regardless of it being a first offense. but the girl being out for money is not even an issue here yet.

by **Jackal** on Sat Oct 11, 2003 8:06 am

Just a reminder if he is convicted, she could file a civil lawsuit and get money out of him. If im not mistaken.

by **TheBob** on Sat Oct 11, 2003 8:35 am

Psycho Jackal wrote:Just a reminder if he is convicted, she could file a civil lawsuit and get money out of him. If im not mistaken.

Or even if he isn't found guilty...ala OJ Simpson....

by **jwin** on Sat Oct 11, 2003 11:35 am

true and i will stop just short of guaranteeing that a civil suit will be filed, probably after the criminal trials are over. but if i'm not mistaken as well, she could possibly have filed one already, which would have been pushed back till after the criminal case is decided. and i think the judge makes the final determination on the amount, but just from the "trauma" of her experience she could file a civil suit seeking damages. now this is where her mental state could be in her favor. she can say she can't go back to her job because of the stress it causes her to think of what happened, that she has been threatened, or verbally abused, or whatever she might be convinced to say to prove that she deserves to be compensated for what he did to her. that's where she could affect kobe, but only her statements are really needed in the criminal trial, the prosecution is the one out to get him for now.

by . on Sat Oct 11, 2003 9:44 pm

Another man's semen reportedly found on Bryant's accuser
BY GREG GITTRICH AND CORKY SIEMASZKO
New York Daily News

NEW YORK - (KRT) - Kobe Bryant's defense team believes it has proof that the woman who accused him of rape had sex with at least one other man shortly before the alleged attack, the New York Daily News learned on Friday.

The revelation came a day after Bryant's lead defense lawyer, Pamela Mackey, caused an uproar at a court hearing by asking whether the woman's vaginal tearing was the result of "sex with three different men in three days."

Retired Eagle County District Court Judge William Jones said Mackey asked the question because she has physical evidence suggesting the tearing could have happened during an earlier sexual encounter.

"There was more than one man's semen found in her panties," Jones said. "That's what's behind all of this."

Jones said he learned of this from Mackey's co-counsel, Hal Haddon.

"I have known him for 40 years," Jones said. "He was doing some work for me and he mentioned it to me. It will come out in due course."

He does not account for Mackey's suggestion that the woman had sex with a third man.

Citing the gag order that Judge Frederick Gannett imposed on the case, a spokeswoman for District Attorney Mark Hurlbert declined to comment. Bryant's defenders also declined to discuss the case.

Veteran Denver criminal defense attorney Jeralyn Merritt said she's convinced Mackey has something up her sleeve.

"By her asking that question, it's clear they have evidence about the accuser," she said. "Pamela Mackey would not have brought this up out of thin air."

Mackey, a lawyer known as a pit bull in pearls, dropped her bomb after Eagle County Sheriff's Detective Doug Winters recounted in graphic detail the alleged victim's version of what happened on June 30 at the posh hotel near Vail, Colo.

The 19-year-old woman told cops she and Bryant kissed. But when she tried to leave, Bryant bent her over a chair and raped her, Winters said.

The accuser's blood was found on Bryant's clothes, Winters said.

But Mackey's surprise question brought the proceeding to an abrupt halt. The hearing resumes on Wednesday.

Crossed a legal line?

Former Denver District Attorney Norm Early said Mackey "blatantly smeared" Bryant's accuser and possibly violated Colorado's Rape Shield law, which bars lawyers from delving into the sex lives of assault victims.

"I don't care what evidence they could have, three nights of consensual sex with three different partners would not lead to a vaginal tear," Early said.

Karen Steinhauser, another former Denver prosecutor and an expert on sex assault cases, disagreed. She said vaginal tearing also occurs during consensual sex and that Mackey's question was "proper."

"There is an exception under the Rape Shield that allows her to ask about the injuries if there is evidence they could have been caused before," she said.

Mackey is no stranger to high-profile cases. Among others, Mackey got a domestic violence charge against Colorado Avalanche goalie Patrick Roy dropped. She also avoided jail time for Jeane Newmaker, who smothered her 10-year-old adopted daughter in a highly publicized "rebirthing" case three years ago.

Haddon represented JonBenet Ramsey's parents and got sex assault charges against gonzo journalist Hunter Thompson dropped for lack of evidence.

Thats awesome (y)

, this could put Kobe in a way better position as he was in before

YouTube · by **Andrew** on Sat Oct 11, 2003 10:05 pm

It doesn't clear him though. It could prove the alleged victim had sex with another man the same night she was with Kobe, but it doesn't prove he didn't rape her.

by . on Sat Oct 11, 2003 10:58 pm

Andrew wrote:It doesn't clear him though. It could prove the alleged victim had sex with another man the same night she was with Kobe, but it doesn't prove he didn't rape her.

yes I know, but this could mean that the physical damage was not done by Kobe, so that means that some evidence may be incorrect

by **Stevan** on Sat Oct 11, 2003 11:45 pm

Thats awesome

After reading that article, and then seeing your quote... LOL :lol:

Glad to see that there was not flame wars/immaturity in this thread for the most part. Well done people.

Personally I think the damage has been done to both the accuser and to Kobe, so hopefully they can resolve this as quickly as possible and get it out of the way.

by **emadhn15** on Sun Oct 12, 2003 12:42 am

i dont know why, but i repeat again that i am pretty positive that kobe will be innocent, i aint a kobe lover but this is what i think will happen,, I guess the girl wants fame, thats why she filed a criminal suit against kobe,, this girl was in american idol,,, maybe kobe did really rape her, but how do u know that the girl is telling the truth, she could be lying,,,

and the article k08e4mvp posted, in my opinion, can really prove that kobe is innocent,, who would have sex with 3 different people in 3 different nights? except a prostitute or a mentally ill person,,

YouTube · by **Andrew** on Sun Oct 12, 2003 12:58 am

emadhn15 wrote:i dont know why, but i repeat again that i am pretty positive that kobe will be innocent, i aint a kobe lover but this is what i think will happen,, I guess the girl wants fame, thats why she filed a criminal suit against kobe,, this girl was in american idol,,, maybe kobe did really rape her, but how do u know that the girl is telling the truth, she could be lying,,,

The alleged victim didn't file the suit - the case is the State of Colorado vs Kobe Bryant. It's not a civil suit - it's a criminal case, filed by the DA.

And we don't know that she's lying, but when she reported the incident to the police, she was informed that there are serious charges for falsely accusing someone of rape.

Everyone seems ready to believe Kobe's innocence and condemn the alleged victim. Kobe is innocent until proven guilty - why doesn't the alleged victim have that same right?

emadhn15 wrote:and the article k08e4mvp posted, in my opinion, can really prove that kobe is innocent,, who would have sex with 3 different people in 3 different nights? except a prostitute or a mentally ill person,,

So if a person is mentally ill or promiscuous, they cannot be raped? If that's the best Kobe's legal team can come up with, he's as good as guilty.

Kobe, all but done.

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