Ex-Magic's Turkoglu magically halts the blaze to Blazers

[AMenace]

The raptors were fucked to begin with.

[Abctest123]

Really BC? Was overpaying for one player the best you could do for the off-season? If The Raptors' depth wasn't shallow enough, they are officially FUCKED for acquiring a decent player off the bench now.

I thought I couldn't see the Raptors bench get any worse than last year's makeup of Kapono-Humphries-Ukic-Solomon-Mensah Bonsu. Now I think the coming season's bench will be even worse .

[Its_asdf]

Clearly you didn't understand what I was saying. Then again, with a name like gangsta4life I wouldn't expect you to grasp that I was specifically referring to the chances of the Raptors utilizing their capspace more effectively to address problems that they have.

Edit: Yes, that's right I'm getting my panties up in a bunch over something petty. Fuck all of you.

[Hedonist]

it kinda amazes me though he was just in the finals and he choses a lotto team from last year over up coming west team who won 54 games with young talent.

Me too.

Toronto is a better city than Portland.

Hedo's wife seems to think so :

A source says Turkoglu’s wife wanted badly to live in Toronto, a far more European-style city, and that’s where it appears the Turkish native is headed.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news;_ylt=A ... pe=lgns%22

edit: sorry for the double post.

[Brave Sir Rubin]

Wife's right. Toronto is as close to Europe as most of the U.S. gets.

They will probably resign Marion and pay the tax up the ass... it's better than simply loosing him.

Bosh
Marion
Hedo
Parker?
Calderon

Still looks like a rather scary-ish lineup. Lacks some size and a lot of D, but rather offensively productive.

I'd try to get rid of Marion in a sign and trade to clear up some cap if I was them so that they could resign Parker and possibly Delfino.

[Hedonist]

From what I read fans are thinking:

Calderon/Derozan/Turkoglu/Bosh/Bargnani

[The X]

Great result for the Blazers. Money was wasted on Turkoglu (as much as I like him). Now the Blazers can pursue a trade for Hinrich to get the perfect complement to Roy in the backcourt.

[Brave Sir Rubin]

From what I read fans are thinking:

Calderon/Derozan/Turkoglu/Bosh/Bargnani

I doubt Derozan will get to start right away (unless they end up without a decent veteran SG), but that lineup doesn't sound too bad. Bargnani is going to get dominated by every single black center out there, but ehh... it's Toronto.

[Hedonist]

Hedo or Hedon't? (UPDATE)
Posted on: July 3, 2009 10:54 pm
Edited on: July 4, 2009 12:37 am

Hedo, we have a problem.

Hours after agreeing in principle to a five-year contract with the Trail Blazers, free agent Hedo Turkoglu abruptly ceased negotiations and appears headed to the Toronto Raptors, a person directly involved in the negotiations told CBSSports.com.

"Hedo is headed to Toronto," said the person, who requested anonymity due to the sensitivity of the talks. "To sign."

But after a whirlwind day in which Turkoglu and his representative, Lon Babby, gave a verbal commitment to sign with the Blazers -- or were done in by what one rival executive termed "too many leaks and not enough info" -- determining Turkoglu's final landing spot is best left to those getting the signatures.

The situation was rapidly unfolding, and it was unclear Friday night whether Turkoglu had second thoughts or Raptors GM Bryan Colangelo swooped in and played his trump card -- the fact that Turkoglu and his wife were said to prefer landing in Toronto. As word spread that Turkoglu had agreed with the Blazers after meeting with coach Nate McMillan in Orlando on Wednesday night and touring the Blazers' facilities on Thursday, the Raptors were pursuing three separate avenues that would have precluded making an offer for Turkoglu. They were engaged in talks with Cleveland about a sign-and-trade for guard Anthony Parker, and were making progress on re-signing two of their other free agents -- Shawn Marion and Carlos Delfino. A person familiar with all three negotiations said Delfino's deal was closer to completion due to ongoing debate in the Toronto front office about Marion's value.

The person involved in Turkoglu's negotiations with Portland used the word "reneged" in describing the nature of the impasse. Babby, who earlier in the evening had cautioned that there was "nothing yet" in terms of finalized details of a contract, did not return phone messages or emails after the talks broke down.

UPDATE: The details of how Turkoglu would wind up with the Raptors were sketchy. But given the fact that Toronto had already engaged in discussions about re-signing Marion and Delfino -- with varying degrees of progress -- left open the possibility of a more complicated sign-and-trade avenue. That would entail multiple parties signing on, including the Magic, who have quietly stayed in the background of Turkoglu's quest for a new home after acquiring Vince Carter from the Nets last week to protect themselves against losing him. Such a scenario could drag on for days because of the moving parts involved, and the person familiar with Turkoglu's decision to spurn the Blazers for the Raptors did not know the details of how it would be worked out. The simplest option on the table was for Toronto to renounce the rights to Marion, Delfino, and Parker and use the $9-$10 million in cap space for Turkoglu.

UPDATE: It is believed that Turkoglu's preference for Toronto was not the only factor. Another person familair with the situation said Turkoglu wasn't the right fit for the Blazers and that the two sides had "different priorities." As always, money played a role, according to another source. By renouncing Marion, Delfino, and Parker, the Raptors could exceed Portland's offer by about $800,000 annually. It wasn't clear Friday night whether Portland drove a harder bargain after seeing Toronto's options dwindle; whether Colangelo swooped in with an 11th-hour bid; or whether Turkoglu's camp simply had second thoughts or believed it could get a better deal from the Raptors.

If anything was clear in this bizarre negotiation, it was that Turkoglu's discussions with the Blazers were irreparably broken.

"It's called an agreement in principle," one source said in describing the agreement between Turkoglu and the Blazers, without elaborating. It is believed that the last player to reneg on such an agreement was Carlos Boozer with Cleveland in 2004.

No agreement between teams and players during the weeklong free-agent negotiating period is binding until deals can be signed on July 8, after the NBA and players association agree on the salary cap and luxury tax for the 2009-10 season.

http://ken-berger.blogs.cbssports.com/m ... 3/15880246

From the Raptors perspective:

CHISHOLM: HEDO MOVE STUNNING BUT LET'S SEE COLANGELO'S PLAN

I'm stunned.

Not because Hedo Turkoglu reneged on his deal with Portland, because all indications are that there was, in fact, no deal agreed upon.

Not because of the amount of money Hedo is being paid, because while it's more than he's worth it's the way the free agent game gets played.

No, I'm stunned because I cannot cultivate a single definitive reason why the Toronto Raptors would make this move.
Let's assume, for a moment, that Shawn Marion was simply not coming back to Toronto. Let's also assume that Carlos Delfino still signs with the team for a percentage of the club's mid-level exception (which is the only money the team can use to sign him with if they renounce his rights, as expected). Let's even go so far as to assume that Bryan Colangelo already has a deal in place to ship Anthony Parker off to another team for a valuable addition to the club's second unit (sign-and-trades are still possible even if a player is renounced). Even if all of that proves true, this move still stuns.

It stuns because acquiring Hedo Turkoglu flies in the face of everything that the team seemed to be doing right to get themselves back on track in the Eastern Conference. They were getting out on the break, they were getting more athletic, they were focusing on defence and grit and they were addressing areas of need in a reasonable and practical manner. Hedo, though, doesn't run the floor, he's supremely unathletic, he's an average defender at best and he introduces a whole host of new problems.

This is a club that employs one of the steadiest point guards in the NBA, but Hedo needs the ball in his hands to be effective, so Jose Calderon is marginalized. Hedo also plays the game almost identically to Andrea Bargnani, occupying the same spots on the floor, and that will not only create redundancy on the roster, it will also stagnate Bargnani's growth. Hedo is also just an average rebounder for a small forward, which would be fine if this team didn't need an elite rebounder at the spot to make up for Bargnani's perimeter-based play. There is so much redundancy on this roster now it's like the club has managed to combine the most awkward elements of the Jermaine O'Neal AND Jason Kapono acquisitions into one. You get the financial hit of O'Neal with the redundancy of Kapono - two-for-one!

However, there has to be more to this story. If this is the first move of the summer, then moves two, three and four have to already be in motion. The Raptors, even if they renounce Marion and Anthony Parker, can still sign-and-trade them. They'll need to, too, since the club has used up all of its cap space and now has to get creative to eat into the space between the cap and the luxury tax (which is all that they have left to play with now). This team still has lots of holes to fill – starting shooting guard, backup combo guard, backup small forward, backup centre – and one has to assume that GM Bryan Colangelo had an eye towards resolving these issues before he committed more than $50-million to Turkoglu. After the disastrous attempts to fill out the roster on the cheap after the O'Neal trade (Hassan Adams, Will Solomon, Jake Voshkul), and the subsequent beating that group took, there is no way Colangelo is going to do that all over again. There is a plan in place - this summer is simply too important to the future of the Raptors franchise for there not to be - the $64,000 question now becomes what that plan is.

For now though, there is only that stunned feeling that we've been here before, that the team is once again miscasting the role of 'second-star' that they've been trying to get right since Tracy McGrady bolted town. Three years ago, Colangelo rode into Toronto hailed as a visionary architect, and while his current blueprint seems to be of little practical merit, it's so audacious he has to be given the chance to see it through – if for no other reason than to see how the rest of the building is built. It's sure to be stunning.

http://www.tsn.ca/blogs/tim_chisholm/?id=283676

I doubt Derozan will get to start right away (unless they end up without a decent veteran SG), but that lineup doesn't sound too bad.

There's also a lot of speculation on trades and s & t and what not..
Who knows what will happen, especially after this one.

Bargnani is going to get dominated by every single black center out there

You're overlooking at least one!



Oh, I know another one!

[tee-pane]

I read in the papers this morning that the Raptors were pursuing David Lee... Turkolu is too old for a five year contract, maybe a 3 year or something like that would be good. http://www.thestar.com/article/659530

Meanwhile, the Raptors seem to have pulled back on a decision to take a run at Orlando's Hedo Turkoglu, who now seems a good bet to land in Portland.

Still, two NBA sources said yesterday they thought Turkoglu was more interested in landing in Toronto than the Pacific Northwest. A report yesterday afternoon that Toronto was planning some exorbitant $60 million offer, however, was debunked by a handful of sources.

[Hedonist]

That story is old. July 2nd, 4.30 a.m. They reported a newer story themselves about Turkoglu cutting off talks with Portland. http://www.thestar.com/Sports/article/660660

[shadowgrin]

RealGM apparently said the Raptors also offered Marion some 4 year deal or something just earlier today. I guess that puts an end to that.

They will probably resign Marion and pay the tax up the ass... it's better than simply loosing him.

I'd try to get rid of Marion in a sign and trade to clear up some cap if I was them so that they could resign Parker and possibly Delfino.

Marion rejected the Raptors offer of 30 mil for 4 years. Say goodbye to him now Raptor fans.

[air gordon]

Link

Not surprising after the Magic scooped Carter up

is it surprising now???
is it surprising he went to Toronto instead???

Maybe Hedo got scared once he heard Artest was going to L.A so he ran back to the eastern conference

[puttincomputers]

hmmm... marion.... could he land in orlando?

[cyanide]

Well, this sucks. As much as I like Turkoglu as a player, he shouldn't be in Toronto for that much money. Bye Marion

Now I'm not in the mood to change the thread title again.

hmmm... marion.... could he land in orlando?

You are a fool.

[vinceair]

Turkoglu to Raptors. Poor guy. He don't see playoffs in 5 years. But he will be rich

[tee-pane]

http://my.thescore.com/courtsurfing/arc ... azers.aspx
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/sports/b ... le1206439/
It's official now.

[Lamrock]

Wow. Bryan Colangelo is officially an idiot. Marion was actually a decent fit too. Turk adds nothing to the Raptors, and will be regretted almost immediately.

[Hedonist]

Wow. I remember you complaining about trolls in Rubio or draft threads and actually agreeing with you.


Chris 'FA 2010' Bosh seems to be excited about something.

chrisbosh

We got Hedo! Next season's gonna be a lot of fun
about 4 hours ago from TwitterBerry

I hope Hedo signs with us
about 6 hours ago from TwitterBerry

IF IT'S TRUE..Let's get it cracking H Turk!!!
about 18 hours ago from web

http://twitter.com/chrisbosh

[Lamrock]

I like Hedo's game, but when you have a team thats far from a contender, you don't spend over 50 million on a 30 year old, especially when its at the expense of a guy who fits in perfectly and led an overlooked resurgence late last season.

[Hedonist]

Apparently this is the same guy that gave Nash a much criticized $65 million deal with the Suns, who was, you guessed it, 30 years old at the time. Worked out pretty well. I'm not saying Turk will win two MVP awards, but let's just say that Colangelo knows his 30 year-olds.

Marion is 31 and was asking almost the same money as Hedo.

If he's a perfect fit is hard to say (defense + rebounding is definitely a problem), but to say that he doesn't add anything is just BS. He brings experience, they didn't have a good playmaker when Calderon was on the bench, his reputation as clutch shooter/playmaker may be a bit exaggerated, but apparently they have problems closing out games, now they can put the ball in his hands and use Calderon as a sharpshooter.

[Lamrock]

Hedo Turkoglu
Lifetime PER: 15.1
2008-09 PER: 14.8 - 2009-10 PER: ??.?

Steve Nash
Lifetime PER: 20.0
2003-04 PER: 20.5 - 2004-05 PER: 22.0

Different circumstances.

[Hedonist]

PER: 20/15 = 1.33

$$$: 65/53 = 1.23

Seems about right. You know, inflation, weak dollar and stuff...

[Killer Crossover aka OG]

Is now the Turk officially a reptile

[Lamrock]

PER: 20/15 = 1.33

$$$: 65/53 = 1.23

Seems about right. You know, inflation, weak dollar and stuff...

Creative argument, but it doesn't work. On Hollinger's description of PER, the lowest benchmark is 9, meaning 9 is like 0. Anything below that and you are completely detrimential to the team. With that in mind, I think its more like:

11/6 = 1.83
65/53 = 1.23

Too big of a dropoff for four years of inflation.