Chicago Bulls Thread

[air gordon]

Anti-Skiles is probably the wrong way to put it, since Boylan isn't likely to get the job done long-term (or short-term for that matter) but I still think we've seen the extent of what Skiles can do with this team. I think they need a coach who commands respect without alienating his players or resorting to the same old measures (bench the starters, change the rotations every other game) to win games. A veteran coach who's had some success in the NBA, to put it simply.

anti skiles is hyperbole but however bringing up alientating players/using the lineup card is a total blanket statement/hyperbole. while he did often use those tactics when the team was terrible, more specifically his first year, you didn't hear anything about it when they were winning. only when the losing started did the finger pointing started

but yeh- a coach who commands respect from all his players without alienating any of them is paradox in this league where the players make more $ then the coach and it's the coach who takes the fall when the team underperforms. even the great phil jackson had problems with certain bulls players during the good times

and yes- i think its time to stop calling the 'core' players young, or at least use it as a crutch- not counting thabo, tyrus, noah

i think it's possible the bulls resign gordon- assuming he gets as much as Hinrich. otherwise i think it's QO and bye bye

i'll take any coach at this point- just as long as Ben Wallace is not on the team. it's quite possible that prick could be a big reason a why a good coach won't want to come to chicago

[Andrew]

anti skiles is hyperbole but however bringing up alientating players/using the lineup card is a total blanket statement/hyperbole. while he did often use those tactics when the team was terrible, more specifically his first year, you didn't hear anything about it when they were winning. only when the losing started did the finger pointing started

Fair call, it's unquestionably easier to tolerate things when the team is actually winning. All the same, would you say that Skiles is someone who could get the job done? Consider the Tyson Chandler situation where he seemed to regress only to become a solid, dependable player in New Orleans. He's no superstar but I'd take his 12 and 12 with a block per game for good measure over Ben Wallace any day. I know it's easy to blame the coach and there's the whole "fresh start" aspect to consider as well but I still can't help wondering about that.

I still couldn't give you the name of someone I think would do a better job though, so you've definitely got me there.

[air gordon]

Fair call, it's unquestionably easier to tolerate things when the team is actually winning. All the same, would you say that Skiles is someone who could get the job done? Consider the Tyson Chandler situation where he seemed to regress only to become a solid, dependable player in New Orleans. He's no superstar but I'd take his 12 and 12 with a block per game for good measure over Ben Wallace any day. I know it's easy to blame the coach and there's the whole "fresh start" aspect to consider as well but I still can't help wondering about that.

I still couldn't give you the name of someone I think would do a better job though, so you've definitely got me there.

I think Skiles was doing the job. IMO the poor start, the player contract situation/trade talks, and ben wallace did him in

the Tyson situation was unfortunate but i think a lot of that falls on Tyson himself- he admitted there was so much pressure being the 'guy' post good times era. then there was the question of work ethic, which he put to rest when he admitted in a slam magazine interview the summer he was traded to NO that he finally fully committed himself to working out/work on his game/etc to become a better basketball player. Not to mention now Chandler does play with the best PG in the NBA

and yes, Skiles was an ass but that's what Paxson brought him in for. for every Chandler we may be wondering about there's JR Smith, Jalen Rose, Eddie Robinson, Tim Thomas, etc

[Andrew]

I hadn't seen that article. I'm still a bit skeptical about Skiles but those other factors certainly didn't help him and weren't entirely his fault. In all fairness, Paxson deserves some of the blame for the blunders he's made though as far as this season is concerned it seems to be a case of the whole team not getting the job done coupled with injuries.

It's interesting you bring up JR Smith because he seems to have his moments in Denver. I wasn't a big fan of trading him away just like that, even with the questions about his attitude and maturity he's got some talent and he was signed to a fairly inexpensive short term deal with a team option. Considering what they got for him, he would have been a fairly low risk experiment.

[Ashman23]

I agree JR should at least been looked at and would've been that 'big' guard we seem to lack. Paxs I guess is in a good situation 'blunderwise' because he can use the coach as the fall guy. Maybe we should chase Jackson to see if he'd come back.

The Chandler thing just happens sometimes, look at Curry, the opposite has happened and every Bulls fan can laugh forever at the Knicks.

Pity Chandler didn't get traded to us, instead of away from us.

[Dan's Brain]

Pity Chandler didn't get traded to us, instead of away from us.

He did.

[Andrew]

I agree JR should at least been looked at and would've been that 'big' guard we seem to lack. Paxs I guess is in a good situation 'blunderwise' because he can use the coach as the fall guy. Maybe we should chase Jackson to see if he'd come back.

I wouldn't count on that. If nothing else, he's signed an extension with the Lakers not that long ago.

[Andrew]

Bulls Shopping Gordon

I'm still not keen on the idea, and not just because I'm a Gordon fan and bought a Gordon authentic in New York last year (though obviously, that would suck). He's not untouchable but he's the only proven 20 ppg scorer on the team. Unless the player the other way can provide a similar or better scoring punch, it'll be another blundered trade by Paxson.

[Ashman23]

I agree JR should at least been looked at and would've been that 'big' guard we seem to lack. Paxs I guess is in a good situation 'blunderwise' because he can use the coach as the fall guy. Maybe we should chase Jackson to see if he'd come back.

I wouldn't count on that. If nothing else, he's signed an extension with the Lakers not that long ago.

I never realisitically thought we could get Phil back, but he would've been good for the team. Moving on from that Gordon seems to have not much value at the moment so I reckon he'll stay put. The two Bens are 'millstones' at this present time, here's to hoping it gets turned around soon.

[Lakers'fan]

Big ben need to get out of there...the bulls need a man to be the leader....deng, hinrich and gordon are just supporting players.

[air gordon]

I hadn't seen that article. I'm still a bit skeptical about Skiles but those other factors certainly didn't help him and weren't entirely his fault. In all fairness, Paxson deserves some of the blame for the blunders he's made though as far as this season is concerned it seems to be a case of the whole team not getting the job done coupled with injuries.

It's interesting you bring up JR Smith because he seems to have his moments in Denver. I wasn't a big fan of trading him away just like that, even with the questions about his attitude and maturity he's got some talent and he was signed to a fairly inexpensive short term deal with a team option. Considering what they got for him, he would have been a fairly low risk experiment.

the chandler interview is in a slam issue. i believe it hit the stands during the summer where chandler was traded to N.O. i remember reading it when i was waiting for a prescription to be filled. but i digress

as far as smith- not enough moments. i'm not going to let a few 3's and dunks every so often impair my judgment. but that's me. though he can't even be the 6th man for a nuggets team that needs perimeter scoring and defense

im hoping this wallace to cleveland rumor is true. i don't care if it's gooden and hughes coming to chicago... just get the thief out

[air gordon]

YES! he's finally gone. soon i can buy a ben wallace chicago bulls for $5 (maybe even less) to wipe my ass

Hughes vritually has the same contract as wallace so it was a swap of expensive garbage. and actually the bulls took on more salary since Gooden was included.

Joe Smith surpassed my expectations and he arguably was the best bulls player this year (how sad). but if taking on a little extra salary and giving him up was the price the bulls had to pay to unload the Thief, i think it was worth it

who knows what happens with playing rotation? yet another PF and combo guard on the roster

i think the team will go small with Noah & Gooden at PF/C, deng SF and then the rest? have no clue. there shouldn't be any entitlement minutes but i can't imagine Hughes playing less then 25mpg when he's getting paid that amount of $. Gordon can't be happy with this trade lol

and will Gooden and Hughes be allowed to wear headbands?

[Andrew]

Totally worth it. I'll take Hughes and Gooden with their question marks over Wallace any day. I agree on Smith but with the season all but lost, it's a risk they can afford.

[Ashman23]

Good trade all round under the circumstances. The Cavs can challenge the Pistons and we can move foward. One way to give #32 to Hughes by moving Smith. Gooden's #90 is safe, too. Nothing on the official site as yet?

[BIG GREEN]

Hughes has been awsome in cleveland over the past 6 games and certainly upped his trade value. Now you guys have someone who can be the main man for the team with offense and good defense. Just cross your fingers that he isn't injured every 2 mins like he was in cleveland.

[Ashman23]

February 21, 2008 – The Chicago Bulls announced today that the team has acquired forward/center Drew Gooden, guard Larry Hughes, guard Shannon Brown and forward Cedric Simmons from the Cleveland Cavaliers in exchange for Joe Smith, Ben Wallace and Chicago’s 2009 regular second round draft pick.

Also as part of the three-team trade, Chicago has sent guard/forward Adrian Griffin to Seattle. Chicago’s roster now stands at 15.

“We are all very much aware that this season has not advanced as we anticipated. With that said, we will continue to evaluate and reshape our roster where necessary, until we can get to where we want to be as a team,” said John Paxson, Bulls Executive Vice President of Basketball Operations.

Just got this from the Bulls official site. So we lost three and a pick and picked up four.

[Fitzy]

im interested to know what larry hughes's roll will be at the bulls

[The X]

im interested to know what larry hughes's roll will be at the bulls

starting SG, 28-29mins/game....if Bulls play more open & he stays healthy, he'll go alright....I think he might do alright....I've always liked him so here's hoping

[air gordon]

After listening to Paxson talk to the media and after a few celebratory drinks I came up with a few thoughts on the trade...
The positives
The Cancer is gone, opening up minutes for Noah & Thomas.
For the upcoming offseason Paxson won’t have many obstacles to deal with in making trades (at least $ wise) - both Gooden & Hughes are younger, making their contracts easier to move and Hinrich & Noce will no longer have BYC status
Hughes “strengths” are what the Bulls have been lacking- size at the SG spot, slashing to the basket, a “scorer”
Gooden’s competency on offense should open things up for the perimeter game

The negatives
Hughes creates a logjam in the backcourt, which comes at a bad time considering Thabo has been playing well
Paxson claims it’s Boylan’s idea that Gordon is the 6th man but I fully believe it’s Paxson’s… which could mean Gordon will want out
Lets face it- While there are parties in Chicago happening for wallace’s departure, Cleveland is probably doing the same in honor of Gooden & Hughes. Hughes comes in with reputation of being a chucker (lol cavs fans had a website that tracked his poor shot selection) and being injury prone. Gooden is inconsistent and has the propensity to often act dumb as rocks


Optimist bulls fans will say Gooden’s/Hughes positives will be better utilized/ they’re weaknesses will be better masked in Chicago… and that those 2 will be rejuvenated playing for a different team. But we’ll just have to see. What a mind job it must to leave a “contender” for a team like the bulls

What I do find interesting is that Paxson want s to make the playoffs but at the same time develop the young guys. That’s almost a paradox, especially for a team that can’t win 2 games in a row. I say play the youngsters, enjoy the growing pains- see who can foul out first between Thomas, Gray, & Noah. If we get some wins out of this, that’s a bonus. My guess is that Paxson will be a busy GM this offseason. he better be- assuming Thomas doesn't develop into Shawn Marion or even Kenyon Martin these last 29 games, i'll be pretty damn pissed if Pax brings back the same roster

On a side note- it probably does makes sense for Cleveland to trade for more experienced front court players (which happened to be 3-0 vs Detroit ). I will be disappointed if Wallace doesn’t do better in Cleveland- he’s going to a situation where he’s a better fit- doesn’t have to the leader, can focus just on rebounding/defense, and is playing with a superstar. If he fails there, he and the media has no one else to blame but Ben Wallace

[[Q]]

im interested to know what larry hughes's roll will be at the bulls

I'm thinking maybe a dinner roll

[Andrew]

During the ESPN doubleheader today, both Stephen A and Jon Barry criticised the deal from Chicago's perspective and Stephen A even went so far to defend Wallace, claiming it was merely a matter of him being surrounded by inferior players compared to the Pistons team he came from. In all fairness that's part of it, but it's still giving Wallace too much credit. Funny to watch the awkward chemistry as he argued the point with Bill Walton though. As always, it looked like it was going to end in a brawl but somehow stopped short of it. Gotta love ESPN.

Meanwhile, nice to see Gordon have a big game and the Bulls win one. Any late attempt at a Playoff run aside, they shouldn't go down without a fight.

[shadowgrin]

im interested to know what larry hughes's roll will be at the bulls

I think Hughes can also play a little bit of PG. (76ers and GSW)

he’s going to a situation where he’s a better fit- doesn’t have to the leader, can focus just on rebounding/defense, and is playing with a superstar. If he fails there, he and the media has no one else to blame but Ben Wallace

Well said.
When he was in Detroit he didn't act like the ass he did with the Bulls because there were dominant personalities like Larry Brown, Rasheed Wallace, and Billups to keep him from going bonkers. When he went to the Bulls, he was "the player" and Skiles was the only one that can go against him, which we all know how it turned out.
I think Lebron can do the job of keeping that nutcase in check and just focus on playing.

I read what Andrew linked.

Skiles to Hoosiers? Rumors already are flying that former Bulls coach Scott Skiles will become head coach at Indiana if Kelvin Sampson is fired, but don't count on it.

Besides the fact that he probably wouldn't be paid even half of the $4 million per year he received from the Bulls, college coaching involves selling yourself to 18-year-old kids, kissing up to influential alumni and dealing with shady street agents.

Does that sound like something Skiles would be interested in? Not really. Chances are, he will wait patiently for the next NBA job.

[Andrew]

I suppose we can only speculate but I still wonder if he ever truly had the comraderie with the Bulls' players that he had with the Pistons, a case of his heart still being in Detroit if you'll excuse the cliche. Maybe he just felt unmotivated having received his payday and not being surrounded by the same level of talent but he certainly wasn't brought in to have that kind of attitude. Still, signing him for $15 mil per year was a questionable move at the time so while Wallace may be responsible for his actions, bringing him in was Pax's mistake.

[air gordon]

i dont think its speculation. all you say there is true IMO. and you forgot to mention this guy would be late for games. lol wtf is up with this guy

sorta reminds me of Jerome Williams. it broke his heart to leave toronto and he was public about it. in fact he would still wear raptor shorts under his bulls shorts. the guy was never truly happy when he was here... but at least he gave the effort

i don't want to turn this into a rip Wallace tangent. i'll just say if you get paid $15 million a year, you better be giving effort and producing nite in, nite out.


nice to the see bulls win. period. i think Thomas didn't miss a jump shot in the 1st half.. even made one late in the 4th. you would almost think the team doesn't need Gooden & Hughes. they would be just be standing in the way of young guys PT. ben wallace who?

[Matt]

looking at the Bulls roster and seeing both Gordon and Hughes makes me giggle!