Chicago Bulls Thread

[Andrew]

sure gordon has his deficiencies. against miami and the regular season, as andrew mentioned, he was good for the most part. and i agree whenever any team plays against an elite team like detroit, your weaknesses get magnified as well

I think a lot of people overlook that, Detroit deserves credit for being a team that is able to shut down one of the better backcourts in the league thanks in no small part to having one of the best (if not the best) backcourts in the league themselves.

what to do in the offseason? i think it's trading time -get that post scorer or at the least a player that will draw double teams. Gordon sometimes has that ability but the rest of the players thrive in that draw and kick scheme. Deng was awesome but seldom do you see him isolated on the wing, creating a shot for himself.

chris sheridan of espn had an interesting article mentioning stars such as garnett, jermaine o'neal, stoudemire, and gasol possibly being on the market. i'm sure it will cost one of their big 3- hinrich, deng, gordon, plus some other player (maybe nocioni or duhon) and a draft pick. maybe even more

but if it takes 2 of their big 3 to land one of those players, i think paxson should walk away. but pax has to be aggressive this offseason. i think any of those big guys would want to play for the team- they play in the weaker conference, most of the best post players are in the west & the team already has big ben in the middle, and city + fans are great.

If any of those players are available then the Bulls will definitely have to consider parting with someone from the core, depending on the asking price. Acquiring someone like KG is going to be really difficult though with PJ Brown's contract coming off the books since they'll have a tough time matching his salary without grossly overpaying for him. I wholeheartedly agree that Pax shouldn't be in any rush to give away any combination of two out of Deng, Gordon and Hinrich. Going from one glaring weakness to another isn't going to make them a better team.

[maes]

I look forward to a lot more Thabo next year, i hope he busts ass in the off-season.

I doubt Amare is on the market, most of that is speculated from Phoenix's unsustainable roster salary, but they have a lot of weight to shed before needing to drop Amare. Marion makes $17, Diaw $9, Kurt, $8. Those guys will move before Amare.

Personally, i think a lot of writers are shooting too high when talking about bulls trades. It's always KG or Amare or JON. KG & JON cost over $20M, and aren't even on the market which means Pax would have to overpay to pry them loose (like Wallace).

Speaking of high salary, it looks like Vince is asking for $20M a year for 3 years, looks like the Nets won't pay. That's a pretty high price for a SG who's probably on his last contract.

[Andrew]

I read a Sam Smith column the other day where he was pushing for an Amare trade if the Bulls win the lottery or finish top three (and then including the pick in a deal), citing chemistry problems in Phoenix as the reason the Suns would be willing to move him to avoid the luxury tax. I won't claim to have insider knowledge of the Phoenix Suns and their personnel but it was the first I've heard of chemistry problems dividing the Suns to the point where their stars cannot play with one another. The whole scenario seems highly unlikely to say the least.

[Dan's Brain]

His team-mates didnt exactly jump behind Amare, when he was making the comments about Bowen....


I dont think anything would come from that, though. The Suns are a team of big names. And as we all know, when big names dont get along, you do hear about it pretty quickly (read: Kobe-Shaq).

And they wouldnt be able to play the way they do if they didnt get along with each other.

The Bulls would have to be blown up to get Amare, which wouldnt solve anything.

[Andrew]

D'Antoni didn't really get behind him either though I doubt there's any friction there. Amare is probably more wary of plays like that since he's come back from knee surgery and the possibility of suffering a serious injury remains at the back of his mind, hence he has stronger feelings about the situation. In any event, grabbing Amare for a bargain seems like wishful thinking to me; as you said, if there were serious chemistry issues it's unlikely there wouldn't be any whispers about it.

[maes]

Probably won't happen as Pax said he's not going to get risky, but the Bulls should really try to move up in this draft. I think it's very doable now that the Oden is out of the picture for a lot of these teams.

Memphis doesn't need Wright/Noah with Gasol. They don't need Brewer/Julian with Rudy Gay. They needed a C, and assuming Atlanta takes Hibbert at 3, the next best C is...Spencer Hawes? Noah can defend C but he doesn't have any post moves i'm aware of.

I'd like to see Brandan Wright or Yi end up on the Bulls somehow.

[Dan's Brain]

There's a lot of mock drafts predicting the Bulls taking Hibbert at 9. I dont know much about him. Is he any sort of an offensive threat?


EDIT: Anyone else think we picked the wrong year to make a draft day trade with Portland?

[---]

^

Hibbert most likely won't help straight away, but if he works out he will be a really solid player. Think Zydrunas Ilgauskas.

I want to see the Bulls take Spencer Hawes. Hawes is one of the best college bigs in terms of post moves and footwork and is probably a top 2 passing big man in the country. He can give the Bulls the low post scoring they need, not to mention you can run plays through the guy in the post. His passing ability can be used like how teams utilized Chris Webbers.

[maes]

Now the rumor is that Hibbert will pull out, and draftexpress already has taken Hibbert off their boards. I think it's smart of Hibbert, because he's #1 - #3 next year.

I'm not sure about Hawes as C because he only grabbed 6 boards in college, will that go down vs NBA level rebounders? Guys like Horford & Noah grabbed 9.5/8.5, and that's competing with each other.

Paxson is hard to predict, he's bucked predictions every year. I'm curious as to what he'll do in this draft.

[Andrew]

EDIT: Anyone else think we picked the wrong year to make a draft day trade with Portland?

It crossed my mind but on the bright side this isn't a pick Portland is likely to give up so I guess that's of some comfort.

[air gordon]

obviously the big names mentioned are at this point pipe dreams though one player that could be a more realistic acquisition is Zach Randolph.

yeh it's still early and it's just speculation but with Portland possibly pairing oden and aldridge together, randolph could be expendable. there's no way randolph would take a back seat to those guys and he already has enough baggage to begin with. it would be reasonable to think that portland management would not want to have randolph around the young guys/want to peddle off his salary

even if he would be on the market, would bulls fans, let alone Paxson/Skiles, want a player like randolph on the team?? he is the post scorer the team needs and it may not take 'much' to acquire him.

i think most bulls fans, including myself, are a little skeptical about adding randolph...especially with his salary starting @$13.3 mil

personally i want the bulls to trade the pick- imo they don't need any more rookies on the team not named oden or durant. they need someone that can come in and contribute- none of which would be available @9 (though Yi's skillset seems a bit intruiging)

maybe i'd be open to getting randolph if it took a sign and trade of nocioni (~$7-8mil), the #9 pick, and some salary throw ins to get him.

still a lot of time before the draft so that means plenty of time for the rumors to surface

[---]

I've read that Portland wants to trade Jarrett Jack and LaMarcus Aldridge to Atlanta for the 3 pick which means Conley, so they can pair him with Oden. I really see that trade ging through, Atlanta gets a solid PG and a good center that shows alot of promise, and Portland gets Oden's longtime friend and teammate, which should help Oden alot.

So it's looking like Portland wants to keep Zach at the moment, remember he is still quite young.

Even so, it's just a rumor right now.

[Dan's Brain]

I'm mixed on this one.

Zach Randolph is a terrific player, he became the star on a bad team and a legitimate 20+ scorer. However, he likely wouldnt be getting 20+ ppg if he came to Chicago. Gordon and Deng would still be options 1 and 2, and you also have to get Kirk his shots. How Zach would feel about that is something of a quandary. He has worked hard to get the level that he's reached. But he also doesnt seem like the sort of player who would want to sacrifice his game to get his team to the next level.

Because of that, i think he would cause Portland some trouble if he remains there. I definitely think he's gone, but to Chicago? I dont think so.

It's not that i dont appreciate what he would bring (a Wallace/Randolph/Deng combo would be the top rebounding front court in the NBA), but i think there's other options the Bulls can chase for cheaper. I sort of have the feeling that it would cost Noc and one of the sophomores to get someone like Randolph. Which i would not be prepared to do.


EDIT: Jim Boylan has been interviewed for the Indiana head coaching job.

[Andrew]

When I read Adrian Wojnarowski's column about the Blazers possibly trading Zach Randolph to acquire another lottery pick I immediately wondered whether the Bulls would (or could) get in on that, though I'm also a little unsure about bringing in Randolph, assuming such a scenario was in any way feasible.

At some point you do have to look at what a player brings to the table and with Randolph that's a 20-10 player in the frontcourt, something the Bulls definitely need; to that end, you can't look a gift horse in the mouth and nitpick your way out of making a deal that could help the team. All the same, you have to consider the total package and as good as Randolph is, his attitude is questionable. I recall last season he was upset when Nate Macmillan dared to punish him for violating team policy. Can he play for a coach as strict as Skiles and fit in with the team in place? I'm not sure about that.

Beyond that, the asking price would no doubt be fairly steep, perhaps too steep for a player with a few question marks. I'd hate to see the Bulls give up a core player for someone who behaves selfishly or refuses to adopt the same professional attitude that the current roster demonstrates.

[Its_asdf]

You Bulls fans wouldn't want Randolph, trust me Andrew. Salary-wise, he'd make a mess of things since the Bulls' core of young guys will be wanting their payday (especially Nocioni this year) and they already have Ben Wallace's gargantuan contract to worry about.

The Bulls are known for their offensive balanced attack and Randolph is known as a black hole on offence that would disrupt that. When the ball is passed to Zack, you won't be getting it back.

[maes]

I think the reports of the Blazers just giving away Randolph for roleplayers is highly exaggerated. He's an excellent rebounder and a low post scorer and his position at PF is not threatened by Oden at C or Durant at SF. The only issue is that he probably makes a little too much money, but so does Ben Wallace and a lot of players.

I'm sure the Blazers are shopping but they're not going to take the 9th pick, it'll cost Hinrich, Deng, or Gordon; just like Gasol did.

20-10 post scorers in their prime do not drop into your laps for nothing, unless you are the Clippers and the Bulls give you Eltron Brand for a draft pick & Brian Skinner.

[shadowgrin]

The Bulls are known for their offensive balanced attack and Randolph is known as a black hole on offence that would disrupt that. When the ball is passed to Zack, you won't be getting it back.

It's the Zach attack.
Watch him jack a three or drive from the 3-point line to the lane and lose the ball.
He's got skills.

[Andrew]

You Bulls fans wouldn't want Randolph, trust me Andrew. Salary-wise, he'd make a mess of things since the Bulls' core of young guys will be wanting their payday (especially Nocioni this year) and they already have Ben Wallace's gargantuan contract to worry about.

The Bulls are known for their offensive balanced attack and Randolph is known as a black hole on offence that would disrupt that. When the ball is passed to Zack, you won't be getting it back.

That's what I'm concerned about it. It's hard to pass up a 20-10 player but a player's attitude has to come into the equation at some point and acquiring Randolph would be a huge risk. It does seem an unlikely scenario though unless the Bulls are prepared to part with any combination of Gordon, Deng and Hinrich which wouldn't be a desirable move.

[Matt]

Randolph isn't the black hole people claim he is. Watching him play this season, he routinely passed the ball out to open teammates.

[TomCat]

Maybe Randolph and Miles (2 bad-attitude players) for either Hinrich or Gordon. Blazer's favour....

I don't think Randolph would be a good person to trade. It would be too dificult to come up with a fair deal for both teams

[Its_asdf]

Randolph isn't the black hole people claim he is. Watching him play this season, he routinely passed the ball out to open teammates.

Even if that's true, they can't afford not to re-sign guys like Gordon, Deng and Noicioni. Randolph will put a stranglehold on their cap space.

[air gordon]

apparently Nocioni is a BYC player, so if he was signed for $8mil, his salary would only be worth $4mil in a trade...

but i think there's other options the Bulls can chase for cheaper. I sort of have the feeling that it would cost Noc and one of the sophomores to get someone like Randolph. Which i would not be prepared to do.

what other cheaper options are out there? i'm not picking on you or anything like that but what team is going to trade a good low post scorer for peanuts? or what FA of that talent will come here for the MLE??

[Dan's Brain]

I dont mean a superstar or anything. Just someone who can be more serviceable offensively than Ben Wallace or PJ Brown. When the Gasol rumours were floating around, other people were throwing around names like Shareef Abdur-Rahim, Nenad Krstic, Drew Gooden, Al Harrington, Chris Wilcox, Channing Frye.

I'd be happy with most of those guys. Guys that you can get on the relative cheap without having to blow up the core.

Those guys would be able to chip in 10-15 a night, while still leaving the Bulls perimeter (i hate spelling that word) game intact. You dont need to trade Hinrich, Gordon or Deng for them. You could do it with Nocioni, a pick and filler.

[Andrew]

I wouldn't mind a deal like that. As risky as it would be for Pax to get too complacent with the roster he has in place, rushing a deal or making one simply because it's there isn't the way to go either. There's overpaying a little to land a star player and then there's gutting the team to bring in a superstar who's now at the head of a weakened roster.

Hopefully Thomas sees more time next year, regardless of PJ Brown's future plans and whether or not the Bulls will bring him back if he decides to play on. He's got to be good for at least six points per game on lobs alone, he's shown flashes of having a decent jumpshot and a couple of other moves although he does remain fairly limited. Still, he has a couple of good weapons they could benefit from using. The same goes for Thabo; in my opinion his jumper isn't as bad his field goal percentage this season would have you believe and he showed a couple of nice moves when he got the chance. If they are still a little green, they should hopefully be given more of a chance to make a bigger contribution next season.

[air gordon]

I dont mean a superstar or anything. Just someone who can be more serviceable offensively than Ben Wallace or PJ Brown. When the Gasol rumours were floating around, other people were throwing around names like Shareef Abdur-Rahim, Nenad Krstic, Drew Gooden, Al Harrington, Chris Wilcox, Channing Frye.

I'd be happy with most of those guys. Guys that you can get on the relative cheap without having to blow up the core.

Those guys would be able to chip in 10-15 a night, while still leaving the Bulls perimeter (i hate spelling that word) game intact. You dont need to trade Hinrich, Gordon or Deng for them. You could do it with Nocioni, a pick and filler.

fair enough. however-out of those players, SAR and Krstic fill the post scoring role. the rest are either stupid, underachieving, or not true post players

imo Krstic is not going anywhere unless he's included in some blockbuster

so that leaves Abdur-Rahim. i don't know sacto's situation but he has a very cap friendly salary.

if that's what is out there, i'd rather keep el chapu. since the plantar fasciitis (sP) is still effecting noce, Pax may be able to sign him cheap

and as mentioned earlier, Nocioni is a BYC olayer making it difficult to trade him. not to mention Nocioni must give his ok for the trade to go through. keep in mind this guy paid $2mil out of his own pocket to buy out his contract to play for the bulls

so what's the next rumor?

and btw, this isn't just for you hinrich- what player is worth trading hinrich/deng/gordon for???