Best Point Gaurd of ALL time?

To everyone who is considering Oscar Robertson as the best ever is wrong cause he never played pg in Cincinate he played sf and sg in milwaukee never played the pg no matter how much he played like one.

Payton was pretty good, but playing in the transition era between Stockton & Kidd he was never considered the best PG in the league at any point.

for me it's Magic or Stockton too

Best point guard in the league by MVP voting standards:

1994 - Gary Payton
1995 - John Stockton
1996 - Gary Payton
1997 - Tim Hardway(came in 4th, Payton in 6th)
1998 - Gary Payton(third behind MJ and Malone)
1999 - Jason Kidd
2000 - Gary Payton

Payton was pretty good, but playing in the transition era between Stockton & Kidd he was never considered the best PG in the league at any point.

The transition era was the Gary Payton era which lasted for seven years. He was caught in between a point guard who was purer than him, and a point guard who played in a weaker conference than him. I wouldn't call him "pretty good" with the career numbers he holds.

For me personally..its shame that most of you and over-looking jason kidd. The best overall is definitly magic...but i put kidd second..and stockton and cousy tied for a close third. Payton was too much of a scorer in my opinion. He wasn't what i consider to be an ideal point guard. His mentality was never really to pass first and shoot second.

Think about it: you're discounting Payton for something that Kidd has never been able to do. You think Kidd actually CAN put up those offensive numbers? GP has always been an exceptional passer, as well as a great scorer. When you're the best scorer on your team(which Payton was during his prime), you're supposed to score. If you call Magic the best overall, don't call Kidd second, because he was neither the most pure over the rest of the options, nor the most talented.

Lets see....

1. Magic Johnson
championships, leader of showtime, great stats, able to make teammates better

2. Oscar Robertson
averaged a triple-double one year great all-around player. won a championship with the bucks

3. Bob Cousy
first great pg very good passer could shoot too led celtics to all these titles.

4. Jerry West
Mr. Clutch averaged 30 a game couple of seasons assists went up as he got older finally won title in 71-72

5. Allen Iverson
very good scorer able to carry his team on his own shoulders started bringing up his assist numbers last year one of the toughest players in nba history

If u consider AI a shooting guard then #5 would be Jason Kidd due to his great all around passing, followed by Stockton who was consistent over his career having great assists and with karl malone the best players to ever execute the pick and roll.

if you ask me (which you kinda did) i would tell you that stockton is the best true pointguard to ever play basketball. he did what a point guard is supposed to do better than anyone ever, so for me thats a easy choice. now if you want to know the best player to ever play the pg spot then you gotta go with magic as he is hands down the best player to ever play that position.

I think that's the best way of the looking at it. I second the motion.

who won more championship

MAGIC

I say Magic, but for ythose that just look at stats to think about the fact the he DID come back and killed his career averages and the fact that he was forced to retire while in the prime of his career.

and thank you GloveGuy for giving GP the credit he deserves.

if I had to take someone, it's John Stockton....he's not the best in the list of players mentioned, but as far as what he did as a point guard, can't fault the guy....he was tough defensively, he was dirty, his passes were pin-point precision, and he was so clutch....if Malone was anywhere near as clutch as Stock, Jazz would have got themselves a title, even against MJ & the Bulls....

as far as best PG's over All-Time....
50s-60s - Cousy
70s - no one stands out as West was a SG & Oscar was a combo guard
80s - Magic (no doubt on that one, with Isiah being great, but more of a scoring PG)
90s - Stockton (Payton is 2nd, he was superb in prime but whole career from start to end doesn't match up to Stockton's IMHO)
00s - Kidd (with Nash in the last 2 years taking that mantle)

if I had to take someone, it's John Stockton....he's not the best in the list of players mentioned, but as far as what he did as a point guard, can't fault the guy....he was tough defensively, he was dirty, his passes were pin-point precision, and he was so clutch....if Malone was anywhere near as clutch as Stock, Jazz would have got themselves a title, even against MJ & the Bulls....

as far as best PG's over All-Time....
50s-60s - Cousy
70s - no one stands out as West was a SG & Oscar was a combo guard
80s - Magic (no doubt on that one, with Isiah being great, but more of a scoring PG)
90s - Stockton (Payton is 2nd, he was superb in prime but whole career from start to end doesn't match up to Stockton's IMHO)
00s - Kidd (with Nash in the last 2 years taking that mantle)

I can't agree with you any more...

I think Gloveguy's beginning to give me flashbacks of NLSC circa 99.

5. Allen Iverson
very good scorer able to carry his team on his own shoulders started bringing up his assist numbers last year one of the toughest players in nba history

The thing about Iverson is that the best year(s) of his career accomplishment wise, he was playing the SG position as opposed to PG.

I agree w/ fgrep, if you consider AI a shooting guard he's one of the most talented.

This play during the Sixer's loss to Washington illustrates why he's either not a PG or a poor PG:

Fast break situation with Iverson & Iguodala, Jared Jeffries in between them, Iggy has the ball and is slightly ahead. Iggy gives it up to Iverson, JJ has to turn 180 to face Iverson and now his back to Iggy, and it's a perfect situation to complete a give & go or even better, an uncontested alley-oop to Iggy. Instead, Iverson keeps the ball and attacks the rim and gets completely swatted by JJ who kept the ball inbounds and they're going the other way, and Iggy is just staring.

Hell would freeze over before Stockton would have done anything like that.

Iverson is the PG because he can dribble, and the other Sixers can't

Fast break situation with Iverson & Iguodala, Jared Jeffries in between them, Iggy has the ball and is slightly ahead. Iggy gives it up to Iverson, JJ has to turn 180 to face Iverson and now his back to Iggy, and it's a perfect situation to complete a give & go or even better, an uncontested alley-oop to Iggy. Instead, Iverson keeps the ball and attacks the rim and gets completely swatted by JJ who kept the ball inbounds and they're going the other way, and Iggy is just staring.

I saw that play today. I was puzzled why he didn't make the pass to Iggy for a potential highlight dunk, but instead he was on the recieving end of a highlight block himself.

Iverson is the PG because he can dribble, and the other Sixers can't

Kevin Ollie is probably the best point guard on the Sixers... Which is kind of sad don't you think?

Exactly

who won more championship

MAGIC

Who won more championships, Karl Malone or Robbert Horry?

Iverson is the PG because he can dribble, and the other Sixers can't

Doesn't justify shit. Iverson isn't a pure point gaurd.

I would say Kidd, I have great respect for Stockton and Magic but Kid has best all around game, that is what PG needs to be. He can pass, score, rebound... Stockton was a guy who made everyone around him better with his plays, he was not too big on scoring. Magic is one of the best scoring PG's but he did not have defense. As for somebody that said Chris Paul...... shit he is nothing yet, I think in upcoming 5 years the true PG's would be Tony Parker, Nash, Hinrich and then Chris Paul.

Jason Kidd