kings beat lakers...*sigh*

Those Kings beat the Lakers. I hate them, esp. Peja and Doug. How 'bout you guys?

I'm a Lakers fan...but you gotta give credit when it's due..and the Kings played much better in the 4th than the Lakers.

I don't have a problem with Peja..but I HATE Doug Christie..he's got great defensive skills and all but he's so damn whipped it's not even funny. I can't stand seeing how many times he puts his hand up during the game as his "i love you" to his wife..god be a man and leave it outside the arena when you come in to play. I loved Shaq's comment when he was talking a/b his injured toe and said: "I had Doug Christie's wife massage it for me." But damn, he's the epitome of whipped...

but personal feelings aside..he did a great job on Kobe in the 1st half..and as usual, Mike Bibby was clutch as ever in the 4th which normally leads to a W for the Kings.

I have a feeling they will be champs this year..

Last edited by bishibashiboy on Fri Mar 21, 2003 4:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.

You're from Vancouver! Where in.

umm..marpole area in west side of vancouver near oak st. bridge..

what a/b you??

I'm not a fan of the Lakers. Shaq and Kobe are great players, but I don't like how they present themselves off the court. Bashing players, like what Shaq said about Mike Bibby. It may be some psychological thing, but you don't need to do that...let your talking be done on the court. I hope the Kings go all the way this year!

Cool, West Van here.

I'm not a fan of the Lakers. Shaq and Kobe are great players, but I don't like how they present themselves off the court. Bashing players, like what Shaq said about Mike Bibby. It may be some psychological thing, but you don't need to do that...let your talking be done on the court.

That's something about Shaq that has always irritated me. I remember how he claimed Dream Team II would easily beat the original Dream Team...then later claimed Dream Team III would easily beat the first two put together. I don't know how much of it was in jest, but to me it came off as an arrogant and somewhat foolish statement.

His anti-Kings statements also make him look like a sore winner. For a team Shaq maintains is not in the same league as the Lakers, the Kings haven't done too badly. The only game decided by more than 10 points in last year's Western Conference Finals was a Kings victory. The Kings are 2-1 (or are they? ) against the Lakers so far this season. Shaq downplays the abilities of the Kings' players, but I don't think he's looking down the bench at his own teammates.

I feel this arrogance, as well as the injuries, and a team weaker than previous seasons, will be the Lakers' undoing this season. To hear Shaq tell it, the Lakers win every game by 50 and haven't been challenged on their way to the title (mind you, to hear him tell it, Shaq has done everything for the team, too). The worst part is, Phil Jackson has grown cocky as well. When he was the Bulls coach, he seldom acted like this. He was much more gracious. Sure, he didn't mince words when describing the play of the 90s Knicks, but he still didn't seem so arrogant.

I don't agree with the philosophy that a great team has to be arrogant and disrespectful in victory. When the Bulls defeated the Pacers in 1998, Jackson acknowledged the Pacers had given them a run for their money. He still said the Bulls were the better team for having won the series, but he gave credit where credit was due. Similar situation with the Kings in 2002, no credit is given, the Kings are considered inferior and the assertion is that they caused the Lakers no problems. Brash talk for a team that was 7 points away from being eliminated in a seventh game of the conference finals.

But it doesn't make me hate the Lakers, after all, I'm not a Kings fan. I just don't agree with the "no such thing as a bad winner" philosophy that seems to be present these days.

I agree Andrew..

I'm not sure a/b Phil Jackson not being cocky before..but for sure Shaq has problems. He's one of those guys that doesn't think about what he says before he says it and I think he'll have to eat his own words if they don't win it all this year.

Honestly, I think deep down the Lakers know how vulnerable they are this season and how good Sac really is. I think the main reason they don't give the Kings any credit is that they don't want them to have any sort of mental edge over them. By admitting that the other team is actually pretty good, it may cast doubt on your own team's ability to beat them. It may also give Sac more confidence when they face the Lakers, if they flat out say "the Kings are good". In any event, I think last year a humbled Rick Fox DID credit the Kings afterwards by saying something like: "during the series we couldn't really admit that these guys really ARE pretty good.." or something to that effect.

By admitting that the other team is actually pretty good, it may cast doubt on your own team's ability to beat them. It may also give Sac more confidence when they face the Lakers, if they flat out say "the Kings are good".

I do see your point, but I still feel that outright public disrespect of them is lacking in class (and setting yourself up for a fall). Wait until they beat you to give them credit, fair enough, but dubbing them the "Queens" and taking cheap shots at the players? Don't get me wrong, I don't expect there to be much friendship between two rivals such as the Kings and Lakers, but when the Lakers prevail and they're the ones taking the cheap shots and doing all the talking, they really look bad.

who cares, as long as they are still winning championships it doesn't matter

I guess it depends on how important you perceive sportsmanship to be. I like to see sportsmanship and class in professional athletes, so even if you don't care, I'm one of the people who do.

I I like to see sportsmanship and class in professional athletes, so even if you don't care, I'm one of the people who do.

Andrew, all your views are well taken!

I tell you what the Kings should do though...

After the last game, Phil Jackson gave a demeaning speech about the Kings after the loss, things like "I have absolutely no fear of this team at all,", etc. This is great locker room fodder and motivation for the Kings.

If I were the Maloofs, and these teams meet in the playoffs, I take a tape of that comment and display it on the Jumbotron before the game, "I have absolutely no fear of this team at all," for all the Kings fans to see. If that doesn't get the Kings fired up enough to win, they don't deserve to win.

Oh btw, I'm not a Kings fan, but I just hate the Lakers with a passion.

**** MAVS WIN IT ALL IN 2003 ****

Yeah, I agree with you. That's just like last year when Divac said the Lakers will never win a 7th & final game if they were playing as visitors and Shaq took that and put it in his locker room to remember that well. As a result, the Lakers took the Queens ass (in sacramento) and swept them all over the court so now the court looks brilliant as a diamond.

I still believe the Lakers wanted to go to a final 7th game just to show them you don't underestimate the heart of a champion. I wouldn't get surprised if the Lakers start taking out of their way the Queens who have an amazing team but they are facing the champs and those are the ones you have to worry about first.

Lakers took the Queens ass (in sacramento) and swept them all over the court so now the court looks brilliant as a diamond.

Considering the fact that the "Queens" weren't swept, not to mention the controversial game where the officiating was horrendous (and in the Lakers' favor)...the Kings morale was surely down. If you can't win when you play well because of horrid officiating, it's going to make you feel helpless...credit the 7 game win more to the refs than to Shaq watching Divac's comments...the Lakers only won by 7 or so, anyway, so it's not like they won by 50....

I still believe the Lakers wanted to go to a final 7th game just to show them you don't underestimate the heart of a champion.

Yeah...so the Lakers weren't trying in the playoffs until the last minute to prove they had heart? Come on...that makes them look like even more ungracious winners than Phil Jackson and Shaq and Fox are already doing...

I wouldn't get surprised if the Lakers start taking out of their way the Queens who have an amazing team but they are facing the champs and those are the ones you have to worry about first.

Don't understand the first part...but yeah, you do have to worry about the champs, but the Lakers are more than human this year. They're not even a one seed, and won't be, and they have to go against a great Spurs team, the Kings, and Dallas, not to mention Utah and Minnesota, two teams that can still tire the Lakers out. Remember, the first round is SEVEN games now...

How many times will I hear Laker haters gripe about the bad officiating in last years conf. Finals?

It was terrible yes, but it was not one-sided!

In game 2 when Kobe had a chance for the game winning shot BoJackson was grabbing his jersey and was all over him, but they let him play!

The officiating was bad,yes, but it was terrible on both ends for both sides, the only thing I will tolerate is that the officials were trying to stretch the series out. but the Officiating was not FAVORED to the Lakers, it was pretty even. each game the officiating being catered to a different team.


PS: And incase you forgot, the Kings had multiple opurtunity's to win game 7 and failed, Chris Webber whimped out, Christie and Peja chickened out(although granted Peja was injured) and Bibby is the only one who showed any heart in the final minutes and overtime. so the Kings cannot complain, they missed those free throws late that woulda sealed the deal. so whats this about not getting any calls?

While the Lakers are too cocky and arrogant for their own good and will likely fall this year, the Kings should just have shut up and not said anything about the officials last year when they couldnt make a clutch shot to send the Lakers home.

FYI: the Spurs will win it all this year by beating the Kings in Game 7 of the WCF.
Gamewiz

It was terrible yes, but it was not one-sided!

In game 2 when Kobe had a chance for the game winning shot BoJackson was grabbing his jersey and was all over him, but they let him play!

Is it just me, or is throwing an elbow and connecting a blatant flagrant foul, resulting in two foul shots and the ball? Kobe Bryant hit Mike Bibby with an elbow, knocking him to the ground and they let him play. If I remember right, they called a foul on Bibby...that's one sided, and that decided game four; if it hadn't been for that horrible call, the Kings would have swept the Lakers (or been up 3-1, I forget what the series record was)...

PS: And incase you forgot, the Kings had multiple opurtunity's to win game 7 and failed, Chris Webber whimped out, Christie and Peja chickened out(although granted Peja was injured) and Bibby is the only one who showed any heart in the final minutes and overtime. so the Kings cannot complain, they missed those free throws late that woulda sealed the deal. so whats this about not getting any calls?

That'd be partly because of the demoralizing loss in game four because of horrid officiating...which is what I said...I never said they didn't choke in game seven, I just said they lost confidence because of the bad officiating and the loss in game four...the mentioning of game seven was a comment to Scubillete's little comment that the Lakers swept and destroyed them when they only one by 7 or so...

The Kings beat the Lakers, but lost to the refs.

So you think officials have anything to do with scoring points shane? What is it that you believe the officials needed to do to make the Queens win? You are complaining about something that could also get on the Lakers side since most of the fouls that were called on Shaq in Sacramento wouldn't be called in Los Angeles.

Considering the fact that the "Queens" weren't swept

If you check, I didn't say the Lakers Swept the Queens in wins, I said they swept them all over the court.

If you can't win when you play well because of horrid officiating, it's going to make you feel helpless

Lakers won even with that horrid officiating, calling fouls on Shaq with every drama Divac was making.

credit the 7 game win more to the refs than to Shaq watching Divac's comments.

Yeah right, like the refs were scoring the points. I'll tell you what, try to watch the game again as a Laker fan and you will see that the refs were all against Shaq & Co. Even Pollard was making dramatic falling like they were in some theatre and the refs were calling all that. I give credit to the Lakers who won as visitors even with the refs against them all the time, all the Queens fans had to shut their mouth up and Divac didn't make again the comment he made cause obviously was embarrassed that even they had home court advantage, they couldn't do anything to avoid a loss.

the Lakers only won by 7 or so, anyway, so it's not like they won by 50...

LOL, So? I don't know but as far as I'm concerned, you only need to win by 1, after that if you win by 2 or more that's extra.

Yeah...so the Lakers weren't trying in the playoffs until the last minute to prove they had heart?

No, they were just trying to prove they can win a game 7 out of their court, there was no other way than playing around with the Queens & dolls until they got to that desired game 7. They were showing they had heart the whole time, how? winning the games they had to win to take the series to a game 7.

They're not even a one seed, and won't be

Get back to 95 Shane, and tell me who were the champs. I'm just going to describe to you what they did but you can tell me who those were.

They went to the playoffs as number 6 seed. They won as visitors in a last 5th game against the Jazz who were extremely favorites over them as any 3 seed who faces the 6th place.

Next, they had to face the number 2 seed of those playoffs Suns who as well were all the way favorites to take away their throne, as a result, they got the series to a maximum of games and won that game as visitors as well.

Next?, Spurs, number 1 seed of those playoffs facing number 6, who were your favorites? Spurs. But those number 6 didn't care who the favorites were, they had a mission to complete and they showed they didn't need to finish 1st to win a series.

Then after that they got to the Finals as visitors as well and swept the favorites from the East side (number 1 seed Magic with Shaq, Penny, Nick Anderson & D. Scott).

Now, you tell me who those were and tell me if you believe there's no way a 6th or 7th seed can win a championship. Plus, I don't want to talk about the Knicks who even they lost, they became the only 8th seed to show up in any NBA Finals.

and they have to go against a great Spurs team, the Kings, and Dallas, not to mention Utah and Minnesota, two teams that can still tire the Lakers out. Remember, the first round is SEVEN games now...

Notice that the 7 games first round is on the Lakers side. They do have to go against Spurs, Queens & Mavs. They can win against the Mavs, they would go one on one against the Spurs and the Queens can just get scared again. Why do the Queens need Bibby to step up and no Webber?. I consider Bibby does more than Webber on those games.

the mentioning of game seven was a comment to Scubillete's little comment that the Lakers swept and destroyed them when they only one by 7 or so

Again, if they win by 1, they won. If they win by 7-10, they won convincently.

I never said they didn't choke in game seven, I just said they lost confidence because of the bad officiating and the loss in game four

The Lakers are the Champs cause they never lose confidence on their game, if the official called bad, there's still another game. If the Queens couldn't get one game and they wanted to win, they couldn't stay thinking about that special game, they had to continue cause that's why is a series, this is not a superbowl that if you lose one game there's no tomorrow.

If I remember right, they called a foul on Bibby...that's one sided, and that decided game four

Again Shane, get back to the videos and watch those games as a Laker fan and you will see those officials were on the Queens side most of the time.

Wasn't Hakeem injured for most of the year that the Rockets won for the second time? I might be wrong. The Rockets had talent(Hakeem, Drexler, Horry, Cassell)

Unless you call 8-10 games "most of the year", I would consider you are wrong. However those players you mentioned, right, Drexler & Olajuwon superstars but those other were not a big deal to make you think they won cause they were more talented than the others. Yes they hit big shots, Cassell had a terrific night against Orlando I think but it's not the reason why they got that far.

Plus, Lakers have talent as well (Shaq, Kobe, Horry, Fox, Fisher, George)

Last edited by scubilete on Thu Apr 03, 2003 12:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.

It was terrible yes, but it was not one-sided!

In game 2 when Kobe had a chance for the game winning shot BoJackson was grabbing his jersey and was all over him, but they let him play!

Is it just me, or is throwing an elbow and connecting a blatant flagrant foul, resulting in two foul shots and the ball? Kobe Bryant hit Mike Bibby with an elbow, knocking him to the ground and they let him play. If I remember right, they called a foul on Bibby...that's one sided, and that decided game four; if it hadn't been for that horrible call, the Kings would have swept the Lakers (or been up 3-1, I forget what the series record was)...

PS: And incase you forgot, the Kings had multiple opurtunity's to win game 7 and failed, Chris Webber whimped out, Christie and Peja chickened out(although granted Peja was injured) and Bibby is the only one who showed any heart in the final minutes and overtime. so the Kings cannot complain, they missed those free throws late that woulda sealed the deal. so whats this about not getting any calls?

That'd be partly because of the demoralizing loss in game four because of horrid officiating...which is what I said...I never said they didn't choke in game seven, I just said they lost confidence because of the bad officiating and the loss in game four...the mentioning of game seven was a comment to Scubillete's little comment that the Lakers swept and destroyed them when they only one by 7 or so...

But the refs are not an excuse, you cannot say "we lost our confidence because the refs cheated us" a real champion ignores the referee's and rises to the occasion whether they were cheated out of a win or not, all champs have had to come through bad officiating and take their beatings, with the Lakers it was the Spurs, now the Lakers own them, with the Bulls it was the Pistons, Pistons was the Celtics if I remember correctly. I am just saying that the excuse that the refs took away the Kings confidence and thereby its their fault they didnt have any when they needed it does not wash, as a champion you have to filter that out and take the oppurtunity granted you.


As for that blatant Flagrant, granted it was a foul, but COME on, Bibby was all over Kobe on that play too so Kobe elbowed him off, so if the Refs were not going to call the first offense on Bibby, why call this blatant flagrant on Kobe?

Let em' play!
Gamewiz

Last edited by Steve04 on Thu Apr 03, 2003 12:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.

So you think officials have anything to do with scoring points shane? What is it that you believe the officials needed to do to make the Queens win? You are complaining about something that could also get on the Lakers side since most of the fouls that were called on Shaq in Sacramento wouldn't be called in Los Angeles.

Considering the fact that the "Queens" weren't swept

If you check, I didn't say the Lakers Swept the Queens in wins, I said they swept them all over the court.

If you can't win when you play well because of horrid officiating, it's going to make you feel helpless

Lakers won even with that horrid officiating, calling fouls on Shaq with every drama Divac was making.

credit the 7 game win more to the refs than to Shaq watching Divac's comments.

Yeah right, like the refs were scoring the points. I'll tell you what, try to watch the game again as a Laker fan and you will see that the refs were all against Shaq & Co. Even Pollard was making dramatic falling like they were in some theatre and the refs were calling all that. I give credit to the Lakers who won as visitors even with the refs against them all the time, all the Queens fans had to shut their mouth up and Divac didn't make again the comment he made cause obviously was embarrassed that even they had home court advantage, they couldn't do anything to avoid a loss.

the Lakers only won by 7 or so, anyway, so it's not like they won by 50...

LOL, So? I don't know but as far as I'm concerned, you only need to win by 1, after that if you win by 2 or more that's extra.

Yeah...so the Lakers weren't trying in the playoffs until the last minute to prove they had heart?

No, they were just trying to prove they can win a game 7 out of their court, there was no other way than playing around with the Queens & dolls until they got to that desired game 7. They were showing they had heart the whole time, how? winning the games they had to win to take the series to a game 7.

They're not even a one seed, and won't be

Get back to 95 Shane, and tell me who were the champs. I'm just going to describe to you what they did but you can tell me who those were.

They went to the playoffs as number 6 seed. They won as visitors in a last 5th game against the Jazz who were extremely favorites over them as any 3 seed who faces the 6th place.

Next, they had to face the number 2 seed of those playoffs Suns who as well were all the way favorites to take away their throne, as a result, they got the series to a maximum of games and won that game as visitors as well.

Next?, Spurs, number 1 seed of those playoffs facing number 6, who were your favorites? Spurs. But those number 6 didn't care who the favorites were, they had a mission to complete and they showed they didn't need to finish 1st to win a series.

Then after that they got to the Finals as visitors as well and swept the favorites from the East side (number 1 seed Magic with Shaq, Penny, Nick Anderson & D. Scott).

Now, you tell me who those were and tell me if you believe there's no way a 6th or 7th seed can win a championship. Plus, I don't want to talk about the Knicks who even they lost, they became the only 8th seed to show up in any NBA Finals.

and they have to go against a great Spurs team, the Kings, and Dallas, not to mention Utah and Minnesota, two teams that can still tire the Lakers out. Remember, the first round is SEVEN games now...

Notice that the 7 games first round is on the Lakers side. They do have to go against Spurs, Queens & Mavs. They can win against the Mavs, they would go one on one against the Spurs and the Queens can just get scared again. Why do the Queens need Bibby to step up and no Webber?. I consider Bibby does more than Webber on those games.

the mentioning of game seven was a comment to Scubillete's little comment that the Lakers swept and destroyed them when they only one by 7 or so

Again, if they win by 1, they won. If they win by 7-10, they won convincently.

I never said they didn't choke in game seven, I just said they lost confidence because of the bad officiating and the loss in game four

The Lakers are the Champs cause they never lose confidence on their game, if the official called bad, there's still another game. If the Queens couldn't get one game and they wanted to win, they couldn't stay thinking about that special game, they had to continue cause that's why is a series, this is not a superbowl that if you lose one game there's no tomorrow.

If I remember right, they called a foul on Bibby...that's one sided, and that decided game four

Again Shane, get back to the videos and watch those games as a Laker fan and you will see those officials were on the Queens side most of the time.

As much as I hate the Laker Bashing/Ref excuses, I have to disagree, the Lakers did not sweep the Kings all over the court, they barely got out alive, and it was not because of the Refs, which as I said whoever was home got the calls. it was because they dug in deep and came out with more grit than the Kings, and deep down I think the Lakers know they got away with one last year and are more vulnerable than ever this year.

The 7 game series is actually not to the Lakers strength, if they do not get up to a 4 seed or 5, it will be against them because having the play the Kings/Mavs/Spurs in rounds 1&2&3 will wear their veterans down and they have not got any bench players worth speaking of. so I will be very suprised to see them repeat again, as for the Rockets, the West then was not as tough as the West now, I dont know if the Lakers can hold up 3 straight 7 game series against the top 3 in the west. so I think its important that they go on a run and play the Blazers/T'Wolves then the Mavs/Spurs/Kings will only come up 2 more rounds.

Either you want to admit it or not, it's on the Lakers side, why? cause in a short series Lakers can easily get swept by the Queens who will have their first 2 at home, then they were just going to get to LA and depending on how the Lakers were going to play they might have taken that one as well and the series was gonna be over.

Now, if the Queens win the first 2, there's still a lot to go thru since they have to get to LA and win 2 more straight to sweep the series.

As much as I hate the Laker Bashing/Ref excuses, I have to disagree, the Lakers did not sweep the Kings all over the court, they barely got out alive

Regarding the Lakers sweeping the floor with the Queens, look at the stats:
Shaq: 35 pts, FT : 11-15, 13 rebs, 4 blocks.
Kobe: 30 pts, FT: 8-10, 10 rebs, 8 Assts.
Horry: 16 pts, 12 rebs, 5 Assts.
Fox: 13 pts, 14 rebs, 7 Assts.

Webber: 20 pts, 8 Rebs, 11 Assts.
Divac: 15 pts, 10 Rebs
Bibby: 29 pts, 5 Rebs

Now I ask you something, when have you seen a team with 4 players with 10 or more rebounds in a game?, what would you call it if they are just taking all the boards in the game plus the performance of 2 of those players with 30 + points?. I agree the Queens did their best but once this was set, there was no way the Queens were going to win that game, again, either you like it or not, that's the reality.

P.S. try to quote just the part you are talking about, it's easier to make your point that way, not quoting the whole post.

I forgot about the rebounding factor, dang Fox had a good game for him. Anyway, my view on this, there was some bad officiating, but that happens all the time. In that same year Baron Davis shot a bank shot that obviously left his hands well before the buzzer rang, yet it was waved off (by Bernie Fryer if memory serves.) They went on to win the game in OT as it was tied, but it should have been over then. Reggie also made a second too late last second shot (by about 0.1-2 seconds) that counted.