T-mac's career without Injuries

[Mandich]

Where would he be now if injuries haven't interrupted his career ? I'd say this is an interesting topic , and he would be right up there with Kobe , Lebron and Wade.
He would have at least one more scoring title , an MVP. Maybe even a championship. Call me stupid but the guy was just flat out amazing, I fell in love with his game back there.
Where would you rank him ?

[shadowgrin]

Maybe even a championship?

Doubt it. Remember when his Magic where up 3-1 against the Pistons? "It feels good to be in the second round."

[Fresh8]

What about Ron Harper without injury? He would have been the next Michael Jordan.

[Mandich]

shadowgrin, True that , but if that rockets teams was healthy a couple of years back (Yao , Scola , Artest , T-mac) they would have some serious chances
Sit, Not feelin the love towards Ron Harper , T-mac had more talent .

[Andrew]

I don't know about him having a championship. Even if he were healthy, I don't think the teams he's around him were all that close to being at that level. I think perhaps there'd be a few second round appearances, certainly another scoring championship or two and he'd definitely still be a significant player in the league, a perennial All-Star and all that.

[Fresh8]

mandich, Harper was more talented.

[Mandich]

Sit, I still say T-Mac is

[Axel The Great]

I don't know about him having a championship. Even if he were healthy, I don't think the teams he's around him were all that close to being at that level. I think perhaps there'd be a few second round appearances, certainly another scoring championship or two and he'd definitely still be a significant player in the league, a perennial All-Star and all that.

I'm gonna have to disagree with you on the championship part, Andrew. If you recall in the 2009 playoffs in the second round, T-Mac was injured, and Yao went down in Game 3. Yet, the Rockets still pushed the Fakers to a Game 7. Imagine what this team would've been capable of with a healthy McGrady and Yao on the roster. Blazers would've gone down in 4 or 5, Lakers would've been done in 6 or 7, and the Rockets would've most likely made it all the way to the Finals. Who knows, if Yao and T-Mac would've stayed healthy, the Rockets could possibly the ones searching for the three-peat this season, assuming their roster was at full health last season.

[Mandich]

I'm gonna have to disagree with you on the championship part, Andrew. If you recall in the 2009 playoffs in the second round, T-Mac was injured, and Yao went down in Game 3. Yet, the Rockets still pushed the Fakers to a Game 7. Imagine what this team would've been capable of with a healthy McGrady and Yao on the roster. Blazers would've gone down in 4 or 5, Lakers would've been done in 6 or 7, and the Rockets would've most likely made it all the way to the Finals. Who knows, if Yao and T-Mac would've stayed healthy, the Rockets could possibly the ones searching for the three-peat this season, assuming their roster was at full health last season.

I second that

[Rip32]

You could also make the argument that those Rockets rallied together knowing that everyone was going to doubt them without Yao and T-Mac. When you have guys like that, especially two guys who need the ball to be effective, it can really take away from your supporting players who can actually ball, but don't get the opportunity.

Minus the two stars, I think those Rockets that were left on the team played a lot more confidently, which led to them pushing the Lakers to the brink.

[Axel The Great]

Fair point there. But you're also forgetting the current Heat and Lakers. The Heat have 3 players who need the ball to be effective, and yet the supporting players can still chip in their stats, with their big 3 giving them open looks. The current Lakers, the best example, you have Kobe who can be compared to T-Mac, and Gasol can be compared to Yao. Those are also two guys who, combined, take about 35 shots a game. Yet, you still have Lamar Odom, Matt Barnes, Andrew Bynum and other supporting players getting their stats, and much to my dismay, have been a very successful team.

So if those teams are able to succeed that way, I'm pretty sure the Rockets could've gone that way too. And you could also say that when two players are playing well, the supporting players tend to follow that example.

[Andrew]

You could also make the argument that those Rockets rallied together knowing that everyone was going to doubt them without Yao and T-Mac. When you have guys like that, especially two guys who need the ball to be effective, it can really take away from your supporting players who can actually ball, but don't get the opportunity.

This.

Not to take anything away from that Rockets team, but it's far from being proof that with a healthy T-Mac they could've won a championship or been going for a threepeat, especially when McGrady had no prior history of carrying teams past the first round. Had he been playing in that series, some of the other guys who stepped up might not have been as big a factor as they were without him.

Even if they had knocked off the Lakers, there's no guarantee they wouldn't have run into a roadblock in the Conference Finals. Consider the 2007 Golden State Warriors, who upset the Mavericks in the first round then quickly fizzled. Sometimes matchups and circumstances favour an underdog against certain elite teams, but they're still fodder for others.

[Fresh8]

Sit, I still say T-Mac is

phpBB [video]

5 NBA titles >>>> Knee-Mac

[Modifly]

I really hate talking about this topic because it brings so much pain to think what could have been for Tracy McGrady and the Rockets. Every single point and argument are valid and solid, but we could not conclude things for certain as it did not happen. At the end of the day, T-Mac's career was hampered by injuries and he's never advanced past the first round despite being healthy in some of those first round series (even though he had a really crappy team to carry in some of them).

[Stress Fracture]

Really a pain in the ass. We can only imagine what would the Rockets be with him and Yao as star players.

[The X]

What about Ron Harper without injury? He would have been the next Michael Jordan.

I'm a big fan of Ron Harper pre-injury, but he would not have been the next MJ. Would've been perennial All-Star though.

If we're talking best career without injury, I would put Bill Walton at the top of the list

[Mandich]

Yes completely forgot about Walton , damn such a shame about him . .

[rise]

best career without injury

I'd go with Grant Hill.

[Lamrock]

Oden sans injury would have been a combination of Bill Russell, Shaq, Morgan Freeman and Ron Jeremy.

[Mandich]

Oden sans injury would have been a combination of Bill Russell, Shaq, Morgan Freeman and Ron Jeremy.

[Stress Fracture]

What's with the laugh? He has the ability. Have you ever watched him play when he was at Ohio State?

[Andrew]

It might have been at the latter two names on the list, particularly the implications of the latter one.

[formx]

What about former Chicago Bulls draft pick Jay Williams. If that motorcycle accident never happened he still would have been playing in the NBA.

[Andrew]

He was a long way from reaching the heights of T-Mac at his peak though and with so much left unproven I'm hesitant to declare he'd be right up there with the top players in the league or that he'd be to the Bulls what Derrick Rose is becoming. Any what-if scenario is rife with speculation but with a player like T-Mac who was at that level before injuries set him back and caused his career to fizzle quicker that it likely would have done if he hadn't been plagued with injuries, we can at least make a more educated guess and predictions of him being an elite player aren't far-fetched.

With Jay Williams, who knows? He might have been a good player, but not a great one. He barely scratched the surface of what he could have possibly accomplished in the NBA and his career could've gone either way. His first season wasn't outstanding enough to proclaim he definitely would've been a superstar, not ordinary or disappointing enough to declare beyond a shadow of a doubt he'd be a bust. Without much of a chance to succeed or fail, both scenarios are pretty much equally plausible.

Len Bias is perhaps the best example of that, along with being one of the most tragic stories in league history. He was touted as being better than Michael Jordan coming out of college, but that's before Michael Jordan became the player he's recognised as today. It's not far-fetched to suggest he would've been a star in the league, but by the same token he could've been another player who was great in college but not that great in the pros. Or, given the nature of his death, he might have gone the route of players like Chris Washburn. Unfortunately we'll never know, though the college hype tends to influence what-ifs involving Bias.

[Fresh8]

Yes completely forgot about Walton , damn such a shame about him . .

Yeah, I feel Luke's pain