2K for PC statistics

[JBulls]

Does anyone think it would be too much to ask for detailed information about NBA 2K for PC in terms of:

Units sold per version, revenue per version, profit/loss per version, cost of production and distribution per version etc.

It would be nice to be able to see how much of a niche within niche a market we really are. It would also eliminate much of the conjecture and hearsay within our tight and dedicated community.

[JaoSming]

yes, I do think it is too much to ask to provide consumers data that shareholders don't even get

that said, steamcharts for usage data that can be compared to consoles' "Who's online?" numbers, vgchartz I guess, and of course 2K's annual shareholders meeting information.

[JBulls]

yes, I do think it is too much to ask to provide consumers data that shareholders don't even get

Oh, my bad I thought it was a publicly traded company for some reason or another...

[JaoSming]

you are welcome to look around, http://ir.take2games.com/phoenix.zhtml? ... rol-irhome


the niche within a niche was coined by Andrew, but really very easy to legitimize. I think we can all agree that NBA video games are not the most played games. 2K gets into the top 10 of sales and all, but in comparison to shooters, MOBA, and just really any other genre it pales in comparison. I know 2K is selling a lot now though, so it might be selling more than Madden/NHL, but it is probably at least comparable in sales.

So, the "first" niche would be playing basketball video games to begin with. It's classified as a video game (not a simulator dammit) and within the "Sports game" genre. So I think we can accept that basketball games are a niche in comparison to the greater video game world.

So where the "second" niche, or the niche within a niche comes into play is comparing those of us that play the PC version of NBA games to those that play the console versions. Yes we have awesome mods and customization options, but we aren't even close to making the same impact on NBA 2K sales each year as NBA 2K does on yearly sales (I think, that is an assumption). Either way, we make up a tiny percentage of sales, which is difficult to pinpoint since no one shares exact figures anymore. Since we are so diehard with it and all, enough to make the PC version relevant despite the perceived low sales, I think that legitimizes it as a niche within the overall NBA 2K realm of things.

IMO, calling it a niche within a niche is a bit of sugarcoating. I think we are a nothing community to a huge corporation. If anything we give them some free advertising through the year with our mods, at least putting the "NBA 2K14" name out there and unofficially reaching out to the Space Jam, NCAA, and comic communities with MGX's stuff this year.

The only distinguishable, measurable thing we can look at is NBA 2K14's in-game "players online" in the online menu. Right now it is a summer Friday afternoon on the East coast US. I loaded up NBA 2K14 on my PS3 and found 38,579 people in the online menus, ready to play online. That number does not count those playing association or anything offline. I just loaded up the PC version too, 4 people are online now, looking to play online, worldwide.

http://steamcharts.com/app/255480 does say there are just over 1,000 people playing on Steam right now though, and that does not include disc users like me. 2,315 is an all time peak for concurrent users for the Steam version of the game. With the low online numbers and the low Steam numbers, its damning. They aren't representative of all the players that own/play the game though, just something that we can compare to the PS3 (and Xbox 360) versions of the game.

http://bf4stats.com/ exists too, as I'm sure other ticker sites do too, for comparison.


So, that's why I accept the niche within a niche. It would take data for me to reconsider that stance. And if you really want to get depressed, go look at how active OS' NBA 2K sections are in comparison to the releases forum (the most used forum) here.

[BLaZiNgSPEED]

http://www.vgchartz.com/gamedb/?page=1&results=200&name=NBA%202K&platform=PC&minSales=0&publisher=&genre=&sort=GL

Looking at the stats, NBA 2K11 has the highest sales globally at 188,171 with NBA 2K12 being second highest with 155,193. But if you were to combine the sales of both NBA 2K11 and 2K12 that accounts for 343,364 sales. But there are no statistics for the other NBA games. So I can assume that the PC version has sold more than a million copies if you combine all of the sales from all NBA games on PC.

We also don't know if those stats are combined with Steam & Retail DVD sales or just Retail DVD sales... But one things for certain the PC version of NBA 2K games sells at least 200 thousand copies annually, that may be nothing compared to the console version. But this is still a bonus profit for 2K! If 2K were to stop releasing a PC version of NBA that would mean they will get 200,000 less sales annually!

I believe if 2K were to make NBA 2K15 next-gen on PC and don't strip off certain features and also include more patch updates to the game to fix bugs/glitches. As well as making sure they make their 2K Online Servers more stable. The sales are guaranteed to be even greater than 200 thousand for NBA 2K15 PC! We can see this with EA Sports. When FIFA 11 PC became a next-gen PS3 port the sales boomed compared to the FIFA 10 PC PS2 port! This is why EA Sports decided to make FIFA 15 next-gen for PC. The same I believe would happen if NBA 2K15 PC was to become a next-gen PS4 port! Sales are guaranteed to be even greater compared to the current selling stats for PC.

[JaoSming]

You also need to factor in the costs though. Every online user downloads 60+ mb of updates. There is money that goes into the servers, even if no one uses them, for online play. And of course the cost to the people that make the PC port. Remember that isn't a simple "compile" and taa daaaaa PC version. There are scaleable graphic options that need to be put in place and of course the stripping of features. This doesn't even count the digital store cuts from the sale or the costs to make the discs.

The argument that porting and selling the PC version for near 100% profit is silly. It ain't free money.


Its a big discussion that is, just like the fate of 2K15, all speculative since none of us are in the industry and the only one who is can't talk about it.

[shadowgrin]

Oh, my bad I thought it was a publicly traded company for some reason or another...

Be a 2K shareholder if you want the numbers you're after.
Just because it's a publicly traded company doesn't mean its books are available all the time to the non-shareholder public.

SEC regulations require publicly owned companies to disclose certain types of business and financial data on a regular basis to the SEC and to the company's stockholders. The SEC also requires disclosure of relevant business and financial information to potential investors when new securities, such as stocks and bonds, are issued to the public, although exceptions are made for small issues and private placements.

Publicly owned companies prepare two annual reports, one for the SEC and one for their shareholders. Form 10-K is the annual report made to the SEC, and its content and form are strictly governed by federal statutes. It contains detailed financial and operating information, as well as a management response to specific questions about the company's operations.

tl;dr if you want official business numbers from 2K:
Be a 2K shareholder.
Be a potential investor when 2K is offering new stock shares.
Get it from or work for the SEC or related government body.

[BLaZiNgSPEED]

You also need to factor in the costs though. Every online user downloads 60+ mb of updates. There is money that goes into the servers, even if no one uses them, for online play. And of course the cost to the people that make the PC port. Remember that isn't a simple "compile" and taa daaaaa PC version. There are scaleable graphic options that need to be put in place and of course the stripping of features. This doesn't even count the digital store cuts from the sale or the costs to make the discs.

The argument that porting and selling the PC version for near 100% profit is silly. It ain't free money.


Its a big discussion that is, just like the fate of 2K15, all speculative since none of us are in the industry and the only one who is can't talk about it.

You're right. But majority of the PC Gamers or even Console Gamers (as customers) aren't interested in whether the developers have difficulty with the developing process or server costs. We want the final end product glitch/bug free as maximum as possible. I know this may sound like an inconsideration towards the producers/dev team. But we expect professionalism, like in any other field in life.

We know it's not an easy job for the producers to add specific PC options such as graphical scalability, keyboard/gamepad configurations, etc.
But if you see for example not a single patch being released like in NBA 2K14 PCs example, some PC Gamers are obviously going to be disappointed and question that 2K don't care. For example in both NBA 2K11 and NBA 2K12 PC we had a serious bug online disconnection (network error message) that appeared randomly in the middle of the game. We had to wait 8 months after the release of the game for 2K to finally fix this issue with a patch release. While similar observed scenarios for the console versions had patches released earlier in time! PC Gamers will then feel discriminated, not treated evenly. Then the PC sales suffer cause of factors like that & then we blame the PC user fanbase for being small.

Also last year NBA 2K13 PC Steam version wasn't available on release date, only Retail DVD. Steam version arrived a few months later. This is another factor that contributed to decline in sales. Also PC Retail DVD version being sold in only specific high street game stores, yet console versions are available in all high street game stores. I had to order the Retail DVD version online as my local game store didn't sell the PC version. But not many PC Gamers have the patience to wait for postal delivery.

So these are the factors that determine the sale number and sale differences between PC and Console. A similar scenario can be seen with EA Sports FIFA PC recycled PS2 ports for 6 years in a row. FIFA 10 PC (PS2 port) global units sold 40,453. FIFA 11 PC next-gen (PS3 port) global units sold 170,568. So where did the PC fanbase suddenly come from? As you can see EA learned from their lesson and it's no wonder they decided to port next-gen Ignite Engine to FIFA 15 PC this year. They are fully aware of the previous experience. We can't really say that the FIFA PC fanbase is particularly greater than the NBA 2K PC fanbase since VG Chartz demonstrates similar sale stats for both FIFA and NBA 2K on PC. Afterall Football (Soccer) and Basketball are the 2 most popular sports in the world!

We know porting won't give them 100% profit, but it will increase their profits. Otherwise 2K wouldn't have been releasing NBA 2K to PC for the last 7 years in a row, if the PC version didn't contribute them any money!

[ColumbusBobby23]

2K/VC has never been very good with patch support in my opinion. I still can't play MLB 2K12 with out setting my windows date back a few years. So I can't say I expect much from them in the future.

But when it comes to the NBA series the one thing that has given me a glimmer of hope is them expanding their Euroleague roster. It shows that they care about international sales more than they have in the past. The PC/Console ratio is much higher in Europe than it is here. If they want to expand their player base over there, aren't they going to need to put out a good PC release? I know it's not much to go on and I'm speculating, But I'm hoping that's the case.